Batman/YMMV: Difference between revisions

** Stephanie Brown/Spoiler/RobinIIII/BatgirlIII, unfourtunately, gets quite a lot of hate, despite having a large fanbase and, generally, being well liked by the fandom, but there's just enough people who hate her for her to qualify for this. [[Replacement Scrappy]] status asside, people either love her for being hope-filled, angstless, idealistic and generally happy, while others hate her for all these things since they don't feel it 'fits' with the rest of Gotham's protectors. Apparently, some people only like angsty and brooding heroes.

*** Or, you know, they dislike her because she was used for a very badly-handled Very Special Issue story early in her run, some of the writing decisions involving her have been dubious at best (Batman just deciding to reveal both his and Robin's secret identities to her because... he thought Robin needed relationship help or something), and let's not forget that some of her fans can make rabid [[Harry Potter|Harmonians]] look like [[Star Trek|Vulcans]].

** James Gordon, Jr. is this as well, having tortured and murdered many people in the past for no reason beyond the power it gives him. He even reveals that he thinks of empathy as a weakness, and {{spoiler|tortures his sister Barbara by driving a pair of knives into her paralyzed legs.}}

* [[Copy Cat Sue]]/[[Overused Copycat Character]]: Hush is debatably this, given that it can be argued that ''nothing'' about his character is particularly original within the context of the Batman mythos. Batman already had plenty of [[Shadow Archetype]] enemies, while the Wrath and Prometheus, and more subtly Black Mask, all whom came along before Hush had backstories made to explicitly mirror Bruce Wayne's. Was even subject to some (possibly unintentional) [[Lampshade Hanging]] by Batman, who drew parallels to his other villains when trying to deduce Hush's identity (associating him using [[Guns Akimbo]] to Deadshot and quoting Aristotle to Maxie Zeus). On a somewhat related note, Hush also dresses up exactly like ''[[Darkman]].''

* [[Creator's Pet]]: For much of Damian's existence, he's been a [[McGuffin]] and has barely had any character development. As a result, he tends to be widely disliked amongst fans. Being made into Robin has only increased the backlash against the character.

** And yet, because of his age, the fact that he comprises half of one of the more entertaining Batman-and-Robin duos in a long while, and the considerable amount of [[Character Development]] he's received, he's actually started to win over a fair amount of fans, even some of his most vocal haters.

** Hush. However, after the "Heart of Hush" storyline, reactions have been turning to more positive.

** Batman himself may easy turn into one when [[Running the Asylum|he is written by his fans]] - most jarring examples include some comics written by [[Frank Miller]], that are determined to show how much better than everybody else Batman is and ''JLA: Act of God'', where he receives giant amount of [[Character Shilling]].

* [[Jerkass Woobie]]: Jason Todd, post-resurrection. Surely, he did a lot of awful things (as [[Kick the Dog|trying to kill Dick and Tim]]), but the guy is so screwed in the inside. His family is dead, his biological mother watched when was being tortured by the Joker and did ''nothing'' to stop it (in fact, [[Evil Matriarch|she was helping the Joker]]), and was brought back to life with amnesia, suffered a lot more while trying to recover his identity and his life (as we can see on ''Red Hood: The Lost Days''), and to this day, his life hasn't gotten any better.

** Damian is a brat, no two ways about it. But he finally gets to be Robin only AFTER his father vanishes from the face of the earth, of which the whole point of getting said role was to spend time with him, is prohibited from killing in this new role, a tad crippling since he now has to solely rely on his TEN year old build to subdue the likes of Killer Croc and as a result gets kicked around by a LOT of people good and bad, and to top it all off he's surrounded by what amount to the surrogate CHILDREN of Bruce Wayne, a collection of people he loved and trusted despite not being his real family, who outright despise him. Not to mention how hellish and lonely his childhood probably was, and getting his SPINE blasted to pieces within the second arc of his flagship title. Kid's got it rough.

* [[Marty Stu]]: Batman is so [[Crazy Prepared]] that he can seem like this at times, though the fandom tends to [[Memetic Badass|exaggerate his prowess]] to the point where the lines between what he can really do and what the fans think he can do tends to blur slightly.

* [[Memetic Badass]]: Batman is one of the more notable ones. Give him enough prep, and he can beat God! "Batman can defeat any villain, given enough prep time," is Fanon.

** The second Ventiloquist hasn't been very well-received so far, as the perception is that rather than try to make her appealing in her own right, much of the focus has been on running down her predecessor to say how much better she is.

** Steph replacing Cassandra as Batgirl wasn't well-received by all. Before that, her replacing Tim as Robin wasn't, either.

** Dick Grayson is ''definitely'' seen as a lot more formidable now than back when he was [[Snark Bait|Robin and wore tights and short-shorts in the Silver Age]].

** Jason Todd, for a short while anyway. Whether or not this has happened since his resurrection, he helped save friggin' '''Superman''' in [[For the Man Who Has Everything]].

** Accomplished to such a degree with Damian that many who hated him are both surprised terrified with the fact that they are starting to LIKE him.

** Flamebird. Due to her early [[Valley Girl]] nature and incompetence Post-Crisis, her clingy obsessive attitude, as well as being a retool of an already-campy character, fans didn't take to her very well. Geoff Johns and Ben Raab fleshed her out more in ''Beast Boy'' mini-series.

* [[The Scrappy]]: Damian Wayne, though he's getting better.

** The Riddler. Not as bad as most others, but is generally labelled as the lamest of the big name rogues, with a mental disorder (OCD) that many find dull in comparison to the others. Emphasizing him as a "technically legal" villain has since quieted some of them down. Though back in the [[Golden Age]] and [[Silver Age]], he actually ''was'' one of the most popular villains, since many of the other rogues who supplanted him hadn't been invented yet.

* [[Straw Man Has a Point]]: Jason Todd. Joker's not going to stop killing people now is he?

* [[Tear Jerker]]: Alfred after ''[[Final Crisis]]''. "Am I alright? ... No, sir. My son is dead."

* [[Wangst]]: Exactly how strongly this is portrayed falls squarely into [[Depending on the Writer]].

** [[Memetic Mutation|MY PARENTS ARE DEAAAAAAAAAD!]]

* [[The Woobie]]: Cassandra Cain, Stephanie Brown and Mister Freeze.

** The Ventriloquist. How can you not feel for the guy? It ain't his fault that he has to share his brain with a ruthless, abusive gangster.

 

=== Examples from ''[[Batman (TV series)|Batman]]'', the 1966 TV Series ===

== TV Series ==

* [[Crowning Moment of Funny]]: [[Large Ham]] King Tut madly screams his dialogue to the ear of one of the beautiful mute [[Living Prop]] slave girls of his harem. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTQ0RHE8ZhA She tries her best to do not change her indifferent expression].

* [[Ear Worm]]: Several, including:

* [[Fair for Its Day]]: [http://tothebatpoles.blogspot.com/2011/09/spotlight-on-hi-diddle-diddlesmack-in.html This article] argues that given the [[Values Dissonance]] between the executives in charge in [[The Sixties]] and [[The New Tens|now]], the mere fact of a show about [[Superhero|SuperHeroes]] being green lighted at [[The Sixties]] as an [[Affectionate Parody]] of the comics written at [[The Silver Age of Comic Books]] was a fair enough interpretation.

* [[Hate Dumb]]: The complaints from "Batman fans" that this show nearly ruined Batman and didn't get him at all. At the time ([[The Sixties]]) of the comics this was how Batman was portrayed. Actually the comics were even more stupid and played straight (see [[The Silver Age of Comic Books]]). Batman was only "dark" for a brief period of time when he first started and then dissolved into a colorful superhero that the series represented. It wasn't until the 70's that Batman returned to his darker roots, after this show had ended. Never mind the fact that this show launched Batman into pop culture and saved the comics from cancellation.

[[Frank Miller]], 'Introduction', [[Batman: Year One]] }}

* [[Hilarious in Hindsight]]: Those who have seen Vincent Price as Egghead [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Utj087mchw#t=6m33s and heard what the Narrator called him] will probably get a kick out of what [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jw0HlB54CIw this song] calls Vincent Price's character [[The Great Mouse Detective|in a certain animated movie with mice]] many years later, or vice versa!

* [[Ho Yay]]: Obvious. Three bachelors in one house, and two of them wear tights.

** Also, in the pilot, the Riddler is ''really'' excited by seeing his assistant dress up as Robin and pose in a somewhat seductive fashion.

* [[Memetic Mutation]]: The aforementioned catch phrases of Robin and the announcer. (Notably, these became memetic ''long'' before the invention of the Internet.)

** [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrmPehlHK3w "Ualuealuealeuale!"], a [[Memetic Mutation/Music|musical meme]] combining a loop of Batman bobbing his head like a drunkard while performing the Batusi dance with the incomprehensible hook of the El Chombo single "Chacarron Macarron." The Batusi itself is also a meme.

== 1989 Movie ==

* [[Badass Decay]]: Commisioner Gordon is perfectly competent in the Burton movies, but in the Shumacher films he's turned into a joke.

* [[Complete Monster]]: The Joker. He retains a certain amount of sympathy through being [[Laughably Evil]] and a [[Magnificent Bastard]]. But, he kills people [[For the Evulz|just for pleasure]] the whole movie, he horribly disfigured his girlfriend Alicia (it's also implied he throws her out of a window), {{spoiler|he shoots dead his long-time friend Bob just let out his anger}}, and intends to poison the whole of Gotham's citizenry with the Smylex gas, without showing much motivation or thought process about it.

** {{spoiler|Oh yeah, and he's the one who killed who Bruce's parents for no reason.}}

** And a [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnrJhbmxaoM&feature=related fan tribute]!

* [[Fanon]]: While Jack Napier's partner who grabbed Mrs. Wayne's pearls is generally believed to be Bob, several fans assume him to be Joe Chill.

{{quote|I'm Batman.

"Winged freak terrorizes"? ''Wait'll they get a load of ME!''

* [[What an Idiot!]]: The second of Joker's three goons at the top of the cathedral is a big fat guy who tries to jump down on him from a higher platform. And promptly falls through the floor before Batman even has time to turn around. Also qualifies as a [[Funny Moments]].

* [[What the Hell, Casting Agency?]]: Michael Keaton so thoroughly proved the naysayers wrong that, in hindsight, it's hard to remember just how bizarre casting a famously mild, unimposing comedic actor as a grim, Frank Miller-inspired version of Batman seemed at the time. Thousands of fans wrote letters to [[Warner Bros]] protesting the choice before the movie's release, and even Keaton himself initially thought that his being cast for the part meant that the film would be taking its cues from the TV series.

* [[WTH Costuming Department]]: Lawrence, the large, bald individual of the Joker goon squad, wears [[Christianity Is Catholic|a Roman collar]] beneath his jacket.

 

* [[The Batman/YMMV|The Batman]]

** [[The Batman vs. Dracula/YMMV|The Batman vs. Dracula]]

* [[Batman: Under the Red Hood/YMMV|Batman Under the Red Hood]]

 

=== Examples from Batman in [[Video Games]] ===

== Trans-Franchise VG Tropes ==

* [[The Problem with Licensed Games]]: In general, Bats has had more luck with this than most superheroes; his first NES outing by Sunsoft is considered one of the finest [[Nintendo Hard]]-in-a-good-way platformers, his 16-bit games tended to be at least okay (though this is the time period which [[The Angry Video Game Nerd]] found the most to object to), and the [[Batman: Arkham Asylum|Arkham]] [[Batman: Arkham City|Series]] pretty much proved that licensed games ''don't'' have to be bad. He has still had some stinkers, though (like a few of the aforementioned 16-bit era games, or the Commodore 64 game, which ''looked'' cool but was a nightmare to actually play).

* [[Batman: Arkham City/YMMV|Batman Arkham City]]

 

 

{{reflist}}