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Contested Sequel: Difference between revisions
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{{trope}}
{{quote|''"This isn't the best one to start with. It's not '[[Show Within a Show|Sumo Slammers]]' classic. It's '[[Development Gag|Sumo Slammers: Hero Generation]]'. [[Conversational Troping|It's a sequel to the original show, but they kinda' messed it up.]] [[Time Skip|It's like five years later]] [[Easily Forgiven|and the bad guy Kanko has teamed up with the hero Ishiyama.]] [[Self
Sometimes there's a [[Sequel]] that attempts to address complaints people had with the original, or build upon the original's perceived strengths. Sometimes, in its attempt to do so, though, it may lose track of what made the original so great for many. If that happens, there may be a huge split in the fanbase, with some fans saying that the sequel is an excellent improvement, with others saying that the sequel's improvements aren't worth the other changes made. This can result in large flame wars when someone who prefers the original argues with those who consider the sequel to be superior.
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See also [[First Installment Wins]], [[Critical Backlash]].
{{examples
== Anime & Manga ==
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* The second season of ''[[Minami-ke]]'' is loathed by a significant percentage of the show's fanbase, caused mostly by the combination of low-budget animation and an increase in [[Fan Service]] to silly levels. Luckily, the third season met with a lot better reception.
* ''[[Magical Girl Lyrical Nanoha]] StrikerS''
** It was a Contested Sequel even before it aired due to the [[Time Skip]] aging the nine-year-old main characters to adulthood; some were relieved that people might finally stop judging them for watching [[Lolicon]] bait, others saw it as an insult to the original. Later accusations came from the copious amounts of [[Demoted to Extra|screentime]] [[
** It appears that the people behind Nanoha noticed how splintered the fandom became as they're making money out of both factions. On one hand, they've released a lot of ''StrikerS'' side materials and created [[The Movie]] to make the first season more StrikerS-like. On the other hand, they started a whole new video game series which is an [[Alternate Continuity]] centered around ''A's'' where the heroines had yet to grow up and the phased out characters are still prominent (and playable).
** Force is a good example as well. A lot of fans dislike the new characters, the slow pace, the overall [[Darker and Edgier]] feeling, the somewhat questionable writing, and {{spoiler|Signum suffering the [[Worf Effect]].}}
* ''[[Naruto|Naruto Shippuden]]'' has become a Contested Sequel over time due to the [[
* If it's a series of ''[[Digimon (Franchise)|Digimon]]'' that's not ''[[Digimon Adventure (Anime)|Digimon Adventure]]'', it's a [[Contested Sequel]].
** The most contested is easily ''[[Digimon Frontier (Anime)|Digimon Frontier]]'' for its significant departure from the [[Mons]] premise; ''[[Digimon Xros Wars (Anime)|Digimon Xros Wars]]'' also gets this for similar reasons, though it's generally regarded higher than ''Frontier''. ''[[Digimon Tamers (Anime)|Digimon Tamers]]'' and ''[[Digimon Savers (Anime)|Digimon Savers]]'' get it for being [[Darker and Edgier]] (and in ''Tamers'''s case, [[They Changed It, Now It Sucks|not being another direct sequel]] to ''Adventure''), and ''[[Digimon Adventure 02]]'' tends to get criticised under [[
** Adding another layer to the ''02'' [[Broken Base]] comes the fact that most of the cast from ''Adventure'' (that is, anyone who's not T.K. or Kari, or their respective 'mons) got [[Demoted to Extra]]. Although ''02'' had only become officially cracked at the epilogue. Oh, and the whole [[Strangled By the Red String|'Sora chose Matt and not Tai']] thing.
* ''Bubblegum Crash'' is this for fans of the original ''[[Bubblegum Crisis]]'' series.
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== Classical Music ==
* Hector Berlioz's ''Lélio, ou Le retour à la vie'' is a [[Contested Sequel]] to his ''Symphonie fantastique''. Whereas ''Symphonie fantastique'', despite its program, was an entirely instrumental work, ''Lélio'' is made up mostly of choral movements [[Dolled
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** ''[[Batman the Movie|"Some days, you just can't get rid of a bomb!"]]''
* ''[[X Men the Last Stand (Film)|X Men the Last Stand]]'' is either a '''''horrid''''' representation of the [[With Great Power Comes Great Insanity|Phoenix Saga]] and a total [[Dropped a Bridge On Him|cop-out as far as the role of Cyclops goes]], not to mention being "The Wolverine and Jean Show" and devoid of all other character development... or it is an adequate adaptation of the Phoenix Saga that does away with plot elements that would have been out of place in the established movie canon, not to mention a ''sweet'' action movie in which basically all hell breaks loose and [[Badass|Wolverine]] owns the show. Take your pick.
** ''[[X Men Origins Wolverine]]'' is equally contested. For many it is a Narm-fest which flies in the face of the other movies' continuity (particularly rewriting a lot of back story from ''[[X 2]]'', the franchise's peak), ruins both Gambit and Deadpool, allows a lot of characters to make stupid decisions in the name of advancing the plot, and all for the sake of making another movie centered on Wolverine when the first 3 were essentially his show anyway. For others, the continuity wasn't all that important, Sabretooth was finally given his due with some decent character development, the incorporation of some new mutants was interesting, and the whole thing is a [[So Okay
* ''[[Spider-Man (Film)|Spider-Man]] 3'' was a highly-anticipated sequel riding off the wave of critical and commercial acclaim its previous films had garnered, and was the highest-grossing of the three films when it was released. However, critical response was evenly split between general audiences who enjoyed the story and the new characters, and comic book fans (and even some long-time fans of the films) who felt that the third film was a betrayal of all the plot threads that had been set up in the prior two films. It didn't help that ''3'' was subject to some extensive [[Executive Meddling]] on the part of Sony Pictures and Marvel head honcho Avi Arad, who canned a prior story treatment focusing on The Vulture and Sandman and forced several disparate plot elements into the film - including fan favorite Venom, who wound up getting the short shift in terms of screen time. There is very little middle ground when it comes to opinion on the film.
* The various sequels to the [[Godzilla]] franchise fall under this trope. Fans who complained that the American Godzilla movie was too different are also now complaining that the later Japanese films are too predictable due to Toho "not willing to take any risks."
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** Truthfully, putting a [[Karma Meter]] in any game will almost assuredly give you a [[Broken Base]]. [[Knight in Shining Armor]], or [[Complete Monster]]? And ''Deity of choice goes here'' help you if in a world with [[Grey and Grey Morality]]...
* ''[[Tales of Symphonia Dawn of the New World (Video Game)|Tales of Symphonia Dawn of the New World]]'':
** While not the first direct sequel to a [[Tales Series]] game, is probably the most well-known, given that it continues the events of [[Tales of Symphonia (Video Game)|the game that made the series popular and well-known to Western audiences.]] Some people enjoyed new characters Emil and Marta, the [[Deconstruction]] of what happens after the goals of the previous game were achieved, and seeing their old favorite characters come back to kick ass. Some ''other'' people hate it for Emil and Marta, the reuse of the first game's locations, the [[Mons]] system, and [[
** DOTNW also gets a lot of hate for the fact that the old characters stop gaining levels at certain point, much earlier then Emil and Marta, pretty much forcing you to always rely on Emil and Marta and the monsters you recruit.
* ''[[Banjo-Kazooie]]:''
** ''Nuts and Bolts''. Some believe that it's a fun resurrection of the franchise, some think it's a good game but not a Banjo-Kazooie game, and some say that it destroyed any chance of a more traditional ''[[Banjo-Kazooie]]'' game being released.
** ''Banjo-Tooie'' as well. While the game play was virtually unchanged from the original (aside from some new moves for Banjo and Kazooie), the worlds were about triple the size, and each was connected to other worlds in some way, thus necessitating some backtracking in order to get some of the Jiggies. While many fans loved and embraced these changes, other fans of the original preferred the smaller worlds and being able to get all of the Jiggies in one sitting (conveniently forgetting about the second bobsled race in Freezeezy Peak).
* ''[[Tetris the Grand Master]] 3''. Some ''TGM'' fans view it as an improvement on ''TGM2'', raising the challenge through faster speeds and at the same time making the game more intuitive to play through a 3-piece preview, hold piece, and a fix for the problem involving trying to rotate an I piece into a hole one cell wide. Others see these features as [[It's Easy, So It Sucks|dumbing down TGM]] and the increase in speed as [[Fake Difficulty]].
* Although definitions of sequel may differ here, ''[[Xenosaga (Video Game)|Xenosaga]]'' is often contested when it's remembered that it was meant to be a spiritual successor to ''[[Xenogears (Video Game)|Xenogears]]''. Although set to be done under a new company, ''Xenosaga'' was originally toted to be the beginning of a massive multi-episode story only hinted to in ''Xenogears''--done the way it was meant to be. Exciting prospects of fleshing out the massive back story of 'gears in such an epic fashion, and a possible remake of ''Xenogears'' itself somewhere down the line enticed many fans who were enthralled with the cultish appeal of ''Xenogears'' but found it less than completely...[[Department of Redundancy Department|complete]]. However, a variety of problems from internal screw-ups and bitter feelings between the staff--as well as what some would consider awful execution of the first ''Xenosaga'' game eventually led to the series almost completely changing direction and staff by the second chapter. By the third and final ''Xenosaga'' game, any notion of it being a spiritual prequel to ''Xenogears'' had been scrapped (aside from the occasional nod), as the series--originally meant to span generations with each game--concluded in the third as one generation with most of the original story threads tied up in a hurried fashion. As expected, fans are still split to this day. Though most were let down by this lost potential, some accepted ''Xenosaga'' as its own entity and defend it as its own entity--while others see it as one of the biggest botch-ups in video game history when comparing what it became to what it could have become. Some say perhaps the original vision in general was just too ambitious to begin with as well, we'll never know for certain.
* ''[[Grand Theft Auto IV]]''. Some love it for its realism, rich characters, production values and gritty nature, while others chastise it for those very things, preferring the zany, cartoony, over the top style of San Andreas and Vice City. Thankfully, the ''[[Saints Row]]'' series offers that experience, leaving everyone happy in the end.
* ''[[The Elder Scrolls IV Oblivion]]'':
** It may have been adored by critics and the general public, but is a contested sequel for fans of ''Morrowind''. Not only do many claim that it was [[It's Easy, So It Sucks|dumbed down]] for console users and casual players, but it took on a far more generic art style than the previous game. The expansion pack ''Shivering Isles'' fixes the latter, at least.
** This used to be a problem early on for ''Morrowind'' with ''Daggerfall'' fans, but it's died down a little since ''Morrowind's'' release. In this vein, a lot of old-school [[The Elder Scrolls|Elder Scrolls]] fans in general have complained about one or the other facet of Oblivion's gameplay. ''Oblivion'' did shake things up.
** It was probably the replacement of the political intrigue, multiple factions with conflicting quests, and depth of lore with a rather generic "Swords and Sorcery, save the world" storyline that cause the [[Fandom Heresy]].
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** ''[[Mass Effect 3]]'' is considered by majority to be a return to form... [[Broken Base|except for the ending.]]
* Maker's breath, ''[[Dragon Age II (Video Game)|Dragon Age II]]''.
** Take away the tactical RPG elements that made ''[[Dragon Age Origins]]'' a callback to the oldies like ''[[Baldurs Gate]]'' and replace them with an emphasis on hack n' slash combat. Take away the epic storyline of saving the world and replace it with one (wo)man's journey to just... well... survive. Add a simplified item crafting system, and a [[Suddenly Voiced]] [[Arson, Murder, and Jaywalking|main character]], and you've got all you need for a [[Flame War|nice, long discussion about its merits as a game on its own and as a sequel]].
** ''Origins'' actually got some flack as a Contested [[Spiritual Successor]] to ''BG'' for similar reasons. It was initially criticized for being a poor tactical RPG due to class imbalances. Mages were almost invincible, had group crowd control, and the highest group damage. The only downside to them was that you couldn't recruit a full party of them. Rogues had the highest single target damage (though Mages had a much easier time raising their single target damage) and could constantly backstab from any direction, negating the need to deploy them tactically. Warriors had absolutely no redeemable qualities. The tanking skills were extremely ineffective, they did poor damage, and they ended up being the most squishy class later on (Mages were nearly invincible because of skills, Rogues had almost as good armor and avoided far more attacks). It didn't help that about half the characters were Warriors, while Mage and Rogue recruits were limited, missable, and more prone to leaving. Basically, the optimal strategy was taking the maximum number of mages and nuking. If everything didn't immediately die at that point, the Rogue would stun lock an enemy and constantly "backstab" him.
* ''[[Freedom Force]] vs. The Third Reich'' split the fanbase. The additional powers were nice. The new characters were well developed. The plotline was good (although the {{spoiler|disappearing teammates}} angered people who liked those character and/or had invested a lot of experience in them). But they dumbed down the power consumption mechanic from a wide spectrum to three possible values of one-third, two-thirds, or all of your power bar, which nerfed many of the concepts, and minor changes in the engine meant most of the third-party models no longer worked in-game.
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* ''[[Tomb Raider]] Legend'' was a reboot of the series by a different developer, with as much changes as that implies. Let's just leave it to the [[Broken Base]] whether this is the point where it [[Growing the Beard|grew the beard]] or [[Jumping the Shark|jumped the shark]].
* For the ''Zelda'' series, ''any'' console game that [[Tough Act to Follow|follows]] ''[[The Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time (Video Game)|The Legend of Zelda Ocarina of Time]]'' is immediately [[Love It or Hate It]] among fans and gamers. The standout examples are ''[[The Legend of Zelda the Wind Waker (Video Game)|The Legend of Zelda the Wind Waker]]'' and ''[[The Legend of Zelda Twilight Princess (Video Game)|The Legend of Zelda Twilight Princess]]'' which, respectively, departed from the formula and followed the formula, both to praise and criticism.
** ''[[The Legend of Zelda Majoras Mask (Video Game)|Majora's Mask]]'' is a hotly contested [[Broken Base|Base Breaker]]: it was not widely liked at the time of its release for [[They Changed It, Now It Sucks|being too different]] from ''Ocarina of Time'' ([[Darker and Edgier|and darker]]) but some fans consider it one of the best games in the series.
** ''Wind Waker'' itself has spanned contested sequels as well, ''[[The Legend of Zelda Phantom Hourglass (Video Game)|Phantom Hourglass]]'' and ''[[The Legend of Zelda Spirit Tracks (Video Game)|Spirit Tracks]]''.
** ''[[The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword (Video Game)|Skyward Sword]]'', which tried to encompass the aspects of all previous ''Zelda'' games, including visuals (a paint-like blend of the ''The Wind Waker'' and ''Twilight Princess'' styles), has backfired significantly reception-wise, with as many fans saying it's the worst game in the series as fans saying it's the best.
* ''[[Roller Coaster Tycoon|Roller Coaster Tycoon 3]]''. While many people enjoy Atari's reboot of the franchise, some "purist" fans believe that Atari ruined it. Some of which criticize it for having full 3D graphics.
* ''[[Lego Racers]] 2''. Oh '''boy''', ''[[Lego Racers]] 2''. It tried to be anything except a sequel to the original. If anything, it tried to be the polar opposite. The game was a lot more open than the original (It had a ''[[Diddy Kong Racing]]''-esque Adventure Mode), the power-up system was changed to randomization (in the original, you had four colors for different types and could add three additional levels of power to it), the controls were changed to be more realistic, there was a new car damage system, and every world now has five courses taking a different route through the world. These changes led to a wide variety of opinions, and nowadays it's best [[Internet Backdraft|not to express an opinion on it.]]
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* ''[[Ben 10 Alien Force (Animation)|Ben 10 Alien Force]]'' as a series when compared to ''[[Ben 10 (Animation)|Ben 10]]''. Despite being said to be the sequel, many consider ''Alien Force'' to be a [[Alternate Continuity|different continuity]] from the original series. This is due to the characters not simply being older but [[Not As You Know Them|appearing to be entirely different people]] ('''especially''' Kevin). It also contradicts many things in the past series, [[All There in the Manual|although proper explanation was given between this and Ultimate Alien.]]
** ''[[Ben 10 Ultimate Alien (Animation)|Ben 10 Ultimate Alien]]'', the sequel to ''Alien Force'', continues the trend, with the series being widely considered a [[Franchise Zombie]] by this point.
* ''[[Batman:
* ''[[The Batman (Animation)|The Batman]]'' was tossed into this the moment it was announced. Though the show was totally unrelated to TNBA and was a reboot, but some TNBA fans felt it didn't live up to "the standard." Eventually the show grew into its own path and found its own unique take on the characters.
* ''[[Batman the Brave And The Bold (Animation)|Batman the Brave And The Bold]]''
** People started saying the same things about [[The Batman (Animation)|The Batman]] (which is lampshaded within the series itself with it's [[Fourth Wall Observer]] Batmite) and people are ALREADY crying this with the upcoming 2013 Batman cartoon involving Batman, a gun toting Alfred and Kantana. With the bar set so high because of the first series, it's commonplace for Batman.
** The series finale of Brave and the Bold [[Take That, Audience!|took a swipe at the fandom]] over this trend. [[This Loser Is You|Batmite]] goes through lengthy attempts to get Brave and the Bold cancelled because he wants a more serious series like B:TAS. When he succeeded, the show ends up getting replaced with a CGI ''Batgirl'' series. [[Hypocritical Humor|Batmite immediately starts complaining about preferring Brave and the Bold,]] especially when he realizes he's not going to be able to [[Shoo Out the Clowns|show up in a]] [[Darker and Edgier]] series.
* Some will argue that ''[[An American Tail]]: Fievel Goes West'' is better than the first movie because it's [[Lighter and Softer|not as depressing]] and it spends more time developing secondary characters, plus, you know, it has [[John Cleese (Creator)|John Cleese]] playing a villain. Others would argue that making the movie [[Lighter and Softer]] completely took away what made the first movie so great in the first place.
* ''[[All Dogs Go to Heaven|All Dogs Go to Heaven 2]]''. While most fans of the first movie consider the second to be totally inferior because they say that it mostly lacks everything from the original, some say that it's a superior followup to the original because it's [[Lighter and Softer|not depressing]] and it has a good story with catchy songs.
* Season 2 of [[My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic (Animation)|My Little Pony Friendship Is Magic]] seems to be heading in this direction due to [[Lauren Faust]] [[Only the Creator Does It Right|quitting the show,]] with an increase on [[Parental Bonus|pop-culture references]], [[Fandom Nod|Fandom Nods]], [[Depending On the Writer|multiple different takes on the characters]], quite an amount of [[World Building]], [[Ascended Fanon]] and in general some ''very'' controversial writing/storytelling on most episodes.
** Though a lot of the complaints seem to have subsided now that most of the season is out.
* ''[[The Ren and Stimpy Show (Animation)|The Ren and Stimpy Show]]'''s "Adult Party Cartoon." Many fans of the original show criticized the show's revival for being completely different than the show they grew up with, for being too dirty, and for being poorly written. However, fans of the APC praise it for going back to John K's roots and original ideas, which were snatched away from him when he was fired and Games took Spumco's place. Fans of the APC praise the show for its humor (which they claim wasn't THAT dirtier than the original series,) the noticeably smoother, more dynamic animation, and the writing. While non-fans despise the show for having "ruined" Ren and Stimpy, fans call the APC a "masterpiece."
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