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Grey and Gray Morality: Difference between revisions
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In most cases, [[A Lighter Shade of Grey|one side has better reasons and more good people than the other]]. The protagonists usually fight for this better side, and if they don't, they'll switch sides before the end. While the audience roots for the better side, they still have [[Sympathetic POV|sympathy for the opposition]].
The result of such a conflict depends on where the story lies on the [[Sliding Scale of Idealism Versus Cynicism]]. At the idealistic end, both sides will eventually realize that fighting is futile and end up putting aside their differences to learn from each other and make a new and better world. At the centre, one side usually ends up crushing the other; this brings about peace, but of a hollow, depressing kind, as a faction with noble ideals has been destroyed. At the cynical end, both sides gradually become less sympathetic and more evil as time goes on until in the end, the more evil, cruel, and vicious side annihilates the other, ushering in an era of harsh rule and oppression or both parties [[Kill
In some cases, the story will end with both sides [[Enemy Mine|teaming up]] against an [[Always Chaotic Evil|unambiguously evil]] third faction, who may even have been [[Let's You and Him Fight|behind the war]] in the first place. When this villain is defeated, the grey sides almost invariably [[Fire
A result of the above is that [[Grey and Grey Morality]] has one potentially great advantage: It can be easier to maintain suspense regarding the ending. In [[Black and White Morality]] situations, the ending is almost always a [[The Good Guys Always Win|forgone conclusion; good wins in the end]], it's just a matter of how. In a Grey-and-Grey situation, either side might conceivably win, or both, or neither.
Note that the sides often will still be [[Dress
Contrast with [[Black and White Morality]]. Compare [[Both Sides Have a Point]], [[Black and Grey Morality]], [[White and Grey Morality]], [[Black and Black Morality]], [[Full Spectrum Morality]], [[Order Versus Chaos]], and [[A Lighter Shade of Grey]]. [[Feuding Families]] and [[Cycle of Revenge]] stories tend to fall under this, as do many depictions of historical wars. A [[Mob War]] may be this, or may fall under [[Black and Grey Morality]].
Any betrayals within a [[Grey and Grey Morality]] Universe will, by their very nature, be [[Hazy Feel Turn|Hazy Feel Turns]].
{{examples
== Anime & Manga ==
* The entire Mahorafest arc of ''[[Mahou Sensei Negima (Manga)|Mahou Sensei Negima]]'' fell under this, with the main characters unsure of whether they should allow [[The Masquerade]] to be permanently broken. {{spoiler|Negi eventually just accepts that [[Dirty Business|he might be the bad guy in this arc]] and stops the [[Anti
** Later events {{spoiler|show pretty unambiguously that Chao could have improved on the actual outcome, if allowed to win. The best argument against her is "But she might get corrupted by power". Well, and the fact that even when she explained what was going on, she downplayed it to such a level that it didn't seem worth the risk to let her succeed.}}
** Negima ''loves'' this trope, as the [[Big Bad]]'s ultimate goal is to ''save the world''. The only reason Negi opposes him is because said [[Big Bad]] is causing ''massive'' amounts of collateral damage in the process, and Negi wants to prevent that; they're basically fighting over who can do a better job of saving the world.
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* In ''[[Princess Mononoke (Anime)|Princess Mononoke]]'' both Eboshi and the animal spirits only want to protect their people, but both sides are more than willing to kill lots of innocents for that. Even the one character who is closest to being a real villain [[Affably Evil|is a very nice and likable guy]].
** The monkeys are really creepy, but their situation makes it kind of understandable why they would resolve to [[I'm a Humanitarian|such drastic measures]].
* ''[[Dorohedoro (Manga)|Dorohedoro]]''. With all the [[Villain Episode]], you can't help but realize that the setting is filled with [[Punch Clock Villain|Punch Clock Villains]] and [[Anti
* The third season of ''[[Slayers (Anime)|Slayers]]''. Slayers TRY, falls under this, especially compared to the other seasons and most media, although it shows shades of [[A Lighter Shade of Gray]] at times. This particular plot calls out the [[God|Shinzoku]] as cowards, and the [[Big Bad]] and the [[Sealed Evil in A Can|greater being posessing him]] seek to rebuild the world by destroying it first, which affects the [[Always Chaotic Evil|Mazoku]] and what they desire.
** To a lesser extent, the ambitions of the [[Big Bad]] in the obscure video game ''Slayers Wonderful'' can be interpreted as this, as {{spoiler|the scientist Viola (the antagonist) wishes to seal magic in order to stop the warring between humans and those above them.}} Once again, though, it shows [[A Lighter Shade of Gray]].
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* ''[[Simoun (Manga)|Simoun]]'', from the beginning. It starts with the POV of someone from one of the peripheral, heavily polluted nations talking about why they are invading Simulacrum, and it has examples throughout of both sides doing good and bad.
* The battles between the Marines and Pirates in ''[[One Piece (Manga)|One Piece]]'' depends on the person. Both sides have their good, and '''[[Complete Monster|(VERY)]]''' bad members. The Marines believe in two types of justice, moral justice, and Absolute Justice, while pirates can either be in it strictly for the adventure, or are in it for the raping and pillaging. While it still holds true to being good vs. evil, the end of the [[The Alcatraz|Impel Down Arc]] in ''[[One Piece (Manga)|One Piece]]'' shows lights of this with Hannybal. {{spoiler|He desperately tries to keep the prisoners from escaping Impel Down because he well understands that most of these people are the scum of the earth and deserve to be here, and letting them out will cause widespread fear to innocent people.}} In the end, Luffy's intentions are still to undo the evil of the World Government, but this particular arc reminds us that a majority of the pirates in the world are dangerous criminals themselves and that the Straw Hats are a rare group of freedom fighters.
** It would be a stretch to call the Straw Hats "freedom fighters". Luffy himself has said that [[I'm Not a Hero Im|he's not a hero]] and made it clear that he doesn't really care about the government. The crew is mainly motivated by self-interest rather than doing good in any abstract way. Their conflicts with the World Government usually come down to the government [[
* ''[[Steamboy (Anime)|Steamboy]]'' explores the relationship between mankind and science, and aside from the O'Hara Foundation proper, none of the sides (Eddie Steam, Lloyd Steam, Scarlett O'Hara and Robert Stephenson) are shown to be entirely right or wrong.
* ''[[Vinland Saga (Manga)|Vinland Saga]]'' is about [[Horny Vikings|vikings]]. The main character could generously be called a [[Heroic Sociopath]] and doesn't actually care what side he's on. The sides in question change, merge, and are destroyed through various slaughters and assassinations. It isn't so much [[Grey and Gray Morality]] as Gray Stew.
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* In ''[[Neon Genesis Evangelion (Anime)|Neon Genesis Evangelion]]'', opponents NERV/SEELE and the Angels have a common goal: destroy the opponent and initiate Third Impact for their own ends. Eventually, NERV and SEELE oppose each other as well, since they have one slight difference in how they want their [[Assimilation Plot|orange juice]] served.
* Although ''[[Nabari no Ou (Manga)|Nabari no Ou]]'' initially appears to be a case of [[Black and White Morality]], it's actually one of the rare cases where both sides are portrayed as more or less ''equally good'' -- There's an equal number of protagonists {{spoiler|and [[Complete Monster|complete monsters]]}} on each side, and most of them change sides [[Heel Face Revolving Door|at least once]]. In the end, it turns out that Fuuma and Hattori {{spoiler|have been working together all along}}.
* ''[[Naruto (Manga)|Naruto]]'', anyone? There are five major Ninja Villages (and a slew of smaller ones), each calling their sides to be the righteous, superior one, only allying when there's a bigger threat. Don't mind the fact that each and every one of them [[Tyke Bomb|train children]] [[Child Soldiers|into ninjas]] [[Person of Mass Destruction|with techniques capable of leveling cities]]. Don't mind the fact that the Leaf Village mistreats Naruto out of mindless fear, the villains are Orochimaru (If you Wild Guess, you may think of him as a victim. If the village mistreats Naruto for protecting them, why not the snake-looking kid too?), {{spoiler|Pain/Nagato, whose parents, best friend and [[And Your Little Dog, Too|DOG]] were killed by Leaf ninjas}}, Sasuke who isn't wrong for wanting to murder his last family member, {{spoiler|(and the Leaf Village elders who ordered him)}} who massacred his entire clan. And there's [[Well
** On the other hand, very few will disagree that {{spoiler|Tobi}} is an [[Complete Monster|irredeemable asshole.]] Even then, his master plan can be viewed as an attempt to {{spoiler|end all conflict in the world by using his Sharingan on everyone at once.}}
* ''[[Revolutionary Girl Utena (Anime)|Revolutionary Girl Utena]]'' is a perfect example. The student council are all fighting for their own personal goals (none of which are truly good or bad), and this applies to most every other character. Even Utena herself falls into this through most of the story, fighting because she wants to be a prince, and struggling to find her identity amongst it all rather than out of a sense of justice or love.
* ''[[Mushishi (Anime)|Mushishi]]'' is often built around [[Grey and Grey Morality]]: it's irrational to blame an animal for doing what nature made it to do, even if 'what it does' is [[Body Horror|eating eyes, parasitically living in people's ears or devouring fetuses and taking their place]]. The mushi are bizarre and sometimes frightful, but mindlessly innocent, and the Mushishi who handle them can come off as [[Knight Templar]] or [[Well
* ''[[Desert Punk (Manga)|Desert Punk]]'' definitely fits this. Initially, it's a case of Punk fighting against people who are not much worse than him (and occasionally are somewhat better), but the ultimate plot about a rebellion falls squarely into this too. The Oasis Government presides over a horribly inequitable system (which is partly [[Inherent in The System]] because of the wasteland setting) and is involved in various conspiracies to control [[Lost Technology]] and silence those who find out about it. The rebels initially seem to be [[A Lighter Shade of Gray]], especially since sympathetic and idealistic government officials join them, but are made morally ambiguous because of a [[Utopia Justifies the Means]] attitude, which includes hiring unpleasant, even villainous characters to help their cause, one of whom has the outlook of an [[Omnicidal Maniac]] and is just manipulating them to advance his own goals.
* Given [[Real Life]] history, the Nations of ''[[Axis Powers Hetalia (Manga)|Axis Powers Hetalia]]'' are definitely this. As everyone's shown to be good-at-heart in their own ways, not one of them is portrayed as utterly evil, including Ivan/Russia. This doesn't stop [[Dark Fic]] writers from making [[Complete Monster|complete Monsters]] of them, however,
* ''[[Magic Knight Rayearth (Anime)|Magic Knight Rayearth]]'' has each side (or country, in season 2) fighting for what they believe is right. All of them meant well. None of them wanted to deliberately do evil. Yet each one had goals that would have eventually hurt others- even though it may have benefited somebody in the end.
* [[Getter Robo]] villains are at best [[Anti
* The feuding ninja clans of ''[[Basilisk (Anime)|Basilisk]]'' are equally honorable and treacherous. As are the heirs' nannies who instigated the contests with their own intrigues. The [[Treacherous Advisor]] / [[Big Bad]] wasn't in support of either side so much as conflict for the sake of pain and misery. {{spoiler|In that sense, even though defeated, he won in the end.}}
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== Comics ==
* [[Marvel Comics|Marvel's]] [[Civil War (Comic Book)|Civil War]]
* ''[[Watchmen (Comic Book)|Watchmen]]''. Dr. Manhattan is the larval form of an [[Eldritch Abomination]], both Rorschach and the Comedian are [[Heroic Sociopath|heroic sociopaths]] , and {{spoiler|Ozymandias}} is an [[Anti
* IDW's [[Transformers|Megatron: Origin]] miniseries shows the series's iconic [[Evil Overlord]]'s rise to power from a laid-off energon miner through underground [[Blood Sport|gladiator]] to the leader of a rebellion against a corrupt Cybertronian senate, with the Autobot Security Services presented as an incompetent and in some cases fascistic police force under the control of the aforementioned senate.
** Before this the Dreamwave comic series revealed that the Autobot ruling council were servants of the Quintessons, the Transformers' entire history was a lie told to keep the Autobots in line and Megatron, having found all this out, forced the Decepticons to try and free his people and to bring order to the universe, albeit through very [[Knight Templar]] behavior.
* [[World War Hulk]]: Warbound vs Illuminati. The Illuminati weren't guilty of the crime that Hulk was avenging, but they ''were'' the reason he was on Sakaar in the first place.
* ''[[Scalped (Comic Book)|Scalped]]''. Dash is an [[Anti
* ''[[Superman Red Son]]'': [[Superman (Comic Book)|Superman]] is a totalitarian dictator, [[Thou Shalt Not Kill|but values human life enough to never kill anybody]] and - to himself, at least - has humanity's best interests at heart, while [[Lex Luthor]] is totally obsessed with bringing Superman down rather than liberating humanity from Superman's yoke.
* ''[[Alien vs. Predator]]'', in both comics and video games, as the [[Alien]] is not much sentient, the [[Predator]] borders on [[Blue and Orange Morality]], and the humans are most times just doing their jobs. Whoever it's the villain depends on the viewpoint character.
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== Fanfics ==
* ''[[Tiberium Wars (Fanfic)|Tiberium Wars]]'' portrays both the Global Defense Initiative ''and'' the Brotherhood of Nod in sympathetic light, with Nod being presented as desperate and angry and vengeful for the wrongs GDI has perpetuated on them, and GDI being presented as [[Well
* It should come as no surprise, but the crossover fanfic ''[[Renegade (Fanfic)|Renegade]]'' by the same author does the same thing, with the same factions. In fact, both factions are presented as protagonists, with the Brotherhood of Nod intervening in the slaver raid on Elysium and with {{spoiler|Kane himself}} attempting to negotiate a compromise between GDI and the Citadel. Of course, {{spoiler|Nod apparently stole the Tacitus on Eden Prime}}, which ''caused'' said conflict between GDI and the Citadel and allowed {{spoiler|Kane}} to score points by negotiating said compromise, so it might have [[The Plan|been part of the plan....]]
* Fittingly, considering the canon series' [[Grey and Gray Morality]] and [[Black and Gray Morality]] tendencies, the [[Mass Effect]] fanfic The Council Era is entirely these two. The [[Villain Protagonist]] seeks to create a Utopia for the galaxy, and does improve it over time, but he believes that [[Utopia Justifies the Means]] and commits seriously heinous acts in order to marginally improve the galaxy. His [[Worthy Opponent]] in this [[Evil Versus Evil]] plotline merely seeks to create a firm foothold for his newly spacefaring people, the krogans. By exterminating every other species, and turning the krogan into a [[Master Race]].
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* In [[Chung Kuo]], there is no really good side; both the Han rulers and the European rebels commit atrocities as the story progresses
* The War between Manticore and Haven in ''[[Honor Harrington (Literature)|Honor Harrington]]'', with the second Haven revolution in the series resulting in a government led by good people, has become this. Indeed, as this carries on it's lost even much of that, becoming more of a [[Let's You and Him Fight]] between good guys.
* Featured very prominently from the second series onward in ''[[Warrior Cats (Literature)|Warrior Cats]]''. The authors have even gone back to write sympathetic backstories for most of the villains, the most notable being Scourge. Tigerstar and Hawkfrost are also noteworthy because, although they wanted power and did horrible things to get it, they only wanted power because they believed they could do a better job of running the Clans and help keep the forest peaceful (Although Tigerstar's vision for running the Clans was [[Politically
** And then there's ''Sunrise''. [[Broken Base|You could argue all you want over]] who was most responsible for the angst-filled mess that is the ending, but the most reasonable explanation (and the one that causes [[Mind Screw|the least headaches]]) is that ''everyone'' was in the wrong to a certain degree.
** {{spoiler|Hollyleaf also eventually [[Face Heel Turn|goes insane]] and possibly may show up in the fourth series as a [[Knight Templar|self-righteous villain]].}}
* Pretty much everything [[Guy Gavriel Kay]] ever wrote falls under this trope.
** ''[[Ysabel]]'' is closer to [[White and Grey Morality]].
** And ''[[Tigana]]'' covers the whole spectrum. You've got the sympathetic and "good" Devin and Dianora, then [[Anti
* ''[[Animorphs (Literature)|Animorphs]]'' falls under this tropes in the later books. At first it's a pretty clear cut case of the bad guys (the Yeerks, taking over the planet parasitically) and the good guys (the Animorphs, and by extension the Andalites, who also hate the Yeerks). As time wears on, however, it's revealed that the Andalites response to the Yeerks infesting the Hork-Bajir homeworld was to release a deadly virus into the atmosphere of the planet, killing nearly all Hork-Bajir on their homeworld. If the Animorphs fail to stop the Yeerk invasion, the Andalites have plans to do exactly the same thing to Earth. As well as that, some of the Yeerks start to be portrayed as actual characters, with individual motivations and emotions, instead of just a pack of slugs. Even the Taxxons, giant centipede-like creatures get some of this; they're revealed to be total slaves to their own hunger, literally unable to stop eating as long as there is food around. And then there are the Animorphs themselves; over the course of the books they morph from idealistic kids doing the best they can to a hardened guerilla force with no qualms about sacrificing the new bunch of idealistic kids in the name of winning the war. This seems to have been [[Moral of the Story|the point of the series]].
* Steven Erikson's ''[[Malazan Book of the Fallen]]'' has this part of the time, such as in the Malazan/Darujhistan conflict and the Letherii/Tiste Edur Conflict. At other times the series veers into [[Black and Gray Morality]] (the Crippled God vs. everyone else) and even [[Black and White Morality]] ({{spoiler|Anomander Rake vs. Chaos}} in ''Toll the Hounds'').
* [[Philip Pullman]], who wrote the ''[[His Dark Materials]]'' series, is the master of this trope. The story revolves around a mysterious thing called Dust. One side, the adults, believe it is evil and corrupting the innocent children; whereas the children themselves know basically nothing about it but dislike what the adults are doing, so they decide that it's really good. This gets less ambiguous, but it is still possible to read it as the Dust is a [[Necessary Evil]], or an Ultimate Good; and even individual characters are like this. Lyra's mother, for example, is one massive, manipulative bitch who {{spoiler|cuts childrens' daemons away from them (which is like splitting your soul in half}} but, on the other hand, she eventually {{spoiler|sacrifices herself with Lord Asriel, Lyra's father, to take down Metatron and "make the world safe for Lyra."}} Who the ''ultimate'' evil -- the ''most'' evil -- is is another good question; whether it's the Authority, the Church, Mrs Coulter, Dust, the people interpreting the Church's positions, the Knife, the Specters, or Father Gomez and his forces. And as if that weren't enough, they're left with a [[Bittersweet Ending]], too.
** The first book contains the best example of grey and gray morality. Lord Asriel, who is supposed to be an antithesis to the clearly evil Mrs. Coulter who works for the Church, {{spoiler|kills Lyra's friend in order to power his machine}}. This is seemingly ignored in the next two books and Asriel, with his crusade against God, becomes a strictly heroic character.
*** Hardly. Lyra, who is pretty much the author mouthpiece, continues to distrust and dislike Asriel and his methods for the entire series after what happened above. Asriel is depicted as [[Well
* The ''[[Chaos Walking]]'' trilogy is all about this. While Mayor Prentiss is a darker shade of gray, Mistress Coyle and the Answer's methods of stopping him (no matter what the cost) can be those of a terrorist or a freedom fighter. This is heightened when the heroes are forced upon the two different sides, while being aware of how much rubbish the whole war is. Also the fact that it's practically a gender battle heightens the uncertainty of the war. In the third book {{spoiler|they team up in an alliance against the Spackle, even though the Spackle are the ones that were treated so terribly}}
* ''[[The Iliad (Literature)|The Iliad]]'', by [[Homer]], and the rest of the [[Trojan Cycle (Literature)|Trojan Cycle]], making this [[Older Than Feudalism]].
* The ''[[Star Wars]]'' [[Star Wars Expanded Universe|Expanded Universe]] flies up and down the morality scale [[Depending On the Writer]]; most of them have pretty clear bad guys, and with [[Timothy Zahn]] most of those bad guys [[White and Gray Morality|aren't so bad]], but his book [[Outbound Flight]] fits here. There are a lot of major characters, but they end up falling into one of three categories: Jedi and civilians on Outbound Flight, Chiss and captives, and Darth Sidious's agent. None of those are entirely good or evil. Outbound Flight is led by Jorus C'baoth, an arrogant and domineering Master who believes himself to be the ultimate authority, and whom the others are reluctant to contradict. The main Chiss character is Thrawn, who... well, he's at his most heroic here, but [[Officer and A Gentleman|he's]] [[Shoot the Dog|Thrawn]]. Sidious's agent is planning to destroy Outbound Flight, but he doesn't exactly [[Card
* On the one hand DORLA in Kit Whitfield's ''Benighted'' uses police state tactics and functionally, if not officially, operates on a "guilty until proven innocent" mentality. On the other hand they do a dirty, dangerous and very necessary job and get less than zero appreciation for it from the public.
* There's an interesting variation on this trope in Jack Campbell's ''[[The Lost Fleet|Lost Fleet]]'' series: the protagonist wakes up from almost a century in suspended animation, having been "killed" in the first battle of a presumably [[White and Grey Morality|White on Grey]] war, to find the same war still raging, but with both sides reduced to the lowest possible moral levels as a result of ridiculously high attrition and a circle of atrocity and counter-atrocity. Being understandably appalled at this, he goes on to teach his fleet [[An Aesop|about honour and efficiency]] to move it away from Black on Black to [[Black and Grey Morality]] before exploring the mindset of his Syndic enemies (upgrading them from Black to merely ridiculously inefficient dark Grey). And then {{spoiler|it turns out that there are ineffable aliens (with [[Blue and Orange Morality|their own morality altogether]]) [[Let's You and Him Fight|behind it all]]. By the end of the story, Geary only manages to deal with the aliens by completely defeating the Syndics first and getting to the other side of their territory.}}
* [[George RR Martin]]'s ''[[A Song of Ice and Fire]]'' series, sort of. Every major faction, taken as a whole, has flaws and redeeming qualities; no one is unreasonable. In the end, it's the methods they choose to use that decides whether they are a villain or a protagonist:
** The Starks are protagonists because they are [[Honor Before Reason|honourable to a fault]] and seek out diplomatic solutions before entering combat. Despite this, one of their most useful bannermen is Roose Bolton, who is tolerated as a [[Token Evil Teammate]] {{spoiler|until he finally does betray them}}, and testimony from peasants in the wrong place at the wrong time show that lower ranking Stark soldiers [[Rape, Pillage and Burn]] just as much as the Lannisters.
** The Lannisters are antagonists because they hire people like [[Complete Monster|Gregor Clegane, the Bloody Mummers]], {{spoiler|[[Face Heel Turn|and House Frey]]}}. Despite this, it is mentioned several times that the common people loved Tywin Lannister, because while he might be a bad person, he was an excellent ruler, and he gave Westeros a great deal of peace and prosperity while he was Aerys' Hand of the King.
** Renly's followers are protagonists because they fight honourably and have several [[Knight in Shining Armour|noble warriors]] on their side, but are fools who still are fighting a bloody war for personal honor and power.
** Stannis' followers are antagonists because they use incredibly creepy [[Black Magic]] and assassinations to accomplish their goals, but [[Well
** Dany is fighting to back her family's throne, despite it being repeatedly drawn to her attention that her father genuinely was a lunatic, and that the people of the Westeros just want to be left out of the power struggles; at first she believes the lies she had been told about how the commoners secretly prayed for the return of Westeros' "true" rulers, but even when she is disabused of this notion, she keeps going to get revenge on the "Usurpers" and reclaim her birthright, rather than worrying whether "her" subjects actually care enough to want another brutal civil war. She has also done a great deal of sacking and pillaging to get where she is now.
** Generally the medieval fantasy setting and the accompanying [[Values Dissonance]] means that any one of the lords seems phenomenally egotistical and self-righteous by today's standards, which is one of the reasons {{spoiler|[[The Spymaster|Varys]]}} is such an interesting character; he genuinely does seem to care about the realm as a whole more than the pissing contests between the squabbling nobles.
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* In ''[[The Kingdoms of Evil]]'': The main character is put in charge of all the evil in the world. Next up, figure out what the hell evil actually is.
* Jodi Picoult's ''[[My Sisters Keeper]]''. On the one hand, we have a mother who is desperate to save her daughter's life, even if it means subjecting her other daughter to a variety of increasingly invasive medical procedures against her will. On the other hand, we have a girl who doesn't want to undergo dangerous and painful medical procedures anymore and wants to be seen for herself rather than as replacement body parts for her sister, even if it means taking away her sick sister's last chance at survial. Welcome to the world of no right answers, folks.
* In ''[[The 39 Clues]]'' book series, even [[Brother
* The first book of the ''[[Artemis Fowl (Literature)|Artemis Fowl]]'' series has this in spades. Artemis freely admits that he's a greedy, manipulative villain, but he aims to use the gold from his kidnapping/extortion scheme to find his [[Disappeared Dad|lost father]] and his mother is millimeters away from a nervous breakdown. [[The Fair Folk|The LEP]] just want their officer back without paying any gold, but they go through some very dark means to get it and even intend to kill Artemis if none of their other plans succeed.
* The soldiers and rebels in ''[[Beachwalker (Literature)|Beachwalker]]'' are both portrayed as having sympathetic members, and the book entirely avoids taking sides in their conflict, focusing instead on the specific combatants and civilians in the protagonist's immediate sphere of influence.
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** For added gray bordering on [[Fridge Horror]], consider {{spoiler|Boyd's stated reason for harvesting Echo's spinal fluid. If the antidote he could have synthesized was used properly it could potentially have saved thousands of people from being wiped, imprinted, bodystolen, and killed and may have severly mitigated the eventual downfall of civilization depicted in the season ending episodes.}}
* ''[[Farscape (TV)|Farscape]]'' will be like this when it's not in outright [[Black and Grey Morality]] mode.
* In ''[[Merlin (TV)|Merlin]]'', the boy wizard himself and Arthur are definitely good guys. But they support a [[Knight Templar]] king who would execute Merlin if he knew the truth, often against [[Designated Villain|designated villains]] with a legitimate grievance, and Merlin often makes some [[What the Hell, Hero?|questionable choices]] to balance his nature against his support of the king. Why? In Arthur's case, family loyalty; in Merlin's it's just [[Because Destiny Says So]] ("destiny" in this case being a dragon with a fairly major grudge against Uther himself). Hence, when {{spoiler|Morgana decides to side with Morguase}}, it's very hard to see it as a [[Face Heel Turn]], and the script doesn't really make much attempt to present it as such.
* ''[[The Wire]]'' is one of the finest examples of this trope in any medium. While you may arguably root for the cops to make their case, it's impossible to see even ''most'' of the cops as good guys. And the criminals get far too many humanising moments to possibly be considered bad guys. Creator David Simon said he wasn't interested in doing [[Black and White Morality|good vs. evil]] anymore; the results were as far in the opposite direction as can be done. While the politics remain consistently gray, as do the inner workings of the police department, in the conflict on drug kingpins, whenever [[Complete Monster|Marlo Stanfield]] and his crew are involved, the show arguably crosses over into [[Black and Gray Morality]].
* ''[[Dexter]]'', especially when it comes down to Dexter vs. Doakes in season 2. In the words of the man himself:
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** French singer Jean-Jacques Goldman titled one of his songs "Entre gris clair et gris foncé" ("Between Light Gray and Dark Gray"). Specifically, its lyrics are about the increase of ambiguous morality in fiction.
{{quote| ''[[Good Is Boring|Dulled good guys]], [[Evil Is Cool|troubling bad guys]]''<br />
''Devils aren't so [[Colour
''Nor whites [[Light Is Not Good|wholly innocent]]'' }}
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* ''[[Battle for Wesnoth]]'' has this in the campaign Descent into Darkness. You control a young mage apprentice who takes up dark magic (read: animating corpses) to defend his town, and is exiled. His sister, the town guard, holy knights who show up for no reason but to piss you off in the hardest mission of the campaign all wish to have him killed. He takes revenge on them. In the end, it's mostly black versus black or black versus grey (with you playing the part of a very borderline black) but until they drop an anvil on you and have you fight endlessly repeating (and rather easy) battles against random commanders, you never genuinely know who to root for.
* This is the theme of the ''[[Tales Series]]'' series. Ever since ''[[Tales of Phantasia (Video Game)|Phantasia]]'', the seemingly vilest of antagonists has at minimum a lofty goal in mind, and the most noble of protagonists is either hiding something, misguided, or aiding and abetting someone who is either hiding something or misguided.
** ''[[Tales of Phantasia (Video Game)|Phantasia]]'': Dhaos [[Well
** ''[[Tales of Symphonia (Video Game)|Symphonia]]'': {{spoiler|Mithos}} simply wanted to save the world [[Knight Templar|from its own racist self]] by holding back progress and running "human ranches", and everything else he does is either for this for for {{spoiler|[[Dead Little Sister|Martel's sake]]}}. [[Idiot Hero|Lloyd's]] actions lead to much death and destruction as he changes the system, and {{spoiler|Mithos}}'s fears of technological abuse [[And Man Grew Proud|is proven right]], as the next 4000 years between ''Symphonia'' and ''Phantasia'' can attest to.
** ''[[Tales of the Abyss|Abyss]]'': {{spoiler|Van}} only wanted to [[Screw Destiny]] and destroy the Score, the near-mindless obedience of which has caused the destruction of his native Hod. {{spoiler|Mohs}} is determined to follow the Score to the letter, believing it to be the Auldrant's ''only'' path to progress. On the heroes' side, [[Spoiled Brat|Luke]] is a [[Jerkass]] extraordinaire, [[Mysterious Waif|Tear]] keeps to herself all the time, [[The Lancer|Guy]] trusts {{spoiler|Van}}, [[Hot Scientist|Jade]] was once a morally-ambiguous scientist, [[Gold Digger|Anise]] is a gold-digger {{spoiler|with good reason}}, and [[Royals Who Actually Do Something|Natalia]] is {{spoiler|revealed to be an adopted commoner}}. The only thing that kept Luke and company with [[A Lighter Shade of Gray]] is their [[Character Development]] (especially Luke's {{spoiler|traumatic}} transformation from spoiled brat to a more reasonable guy).
** ''[[Tales of Vesperia|Vesperia]]'': {{spoiler|Alexei}} simply wanted to use Zaude to end the world's reliance on blastia {{spoiler|which is slowly killing it -- unaware that it is actually ''the'' seal to an [[Eldritch Abomination]]}}. {{spoiler|Yeager}} is an amoral mercenary who {{spoiler|gives his earnings to an orphanage and has adopted two girls to be his sidecicks}}. On the heroes' side, [[Vigilante Man|Yuri]] is more than willing to [[Necessary Evil|stain his hands with blood in the name of justice]], while [[Knight in Shining Armor|Flynn]] believes in the power of law and order [[Lawful Stupid|to the point of overlooking the basics of morality]]. As for the overarching plot, it comes down to a debate between preservation of nature at humanity's expense versus alteration of nature to suit human needs at expense of other lifeforms.
* The war between the [[Order Versus Chaos|Messians and Gaians]] in ''[[Shin Megami Tensei I]]'' and ''[[Shin Megami Tensei II]]'' works a little like this, if you don't see it as Evil: the former are basically a well-meaning, [[Lawful Good]] people ruled by a group of genocidal [[Knights Templar]], and the latter are mostly a bunch of [[Chaotic Evil]] anarchists ruled over by a few wiser demons that either want to stop the Messians from carrying out their [[Utopia Justifies the Means]] plan or wish to achieve true freedom from the oppressive reign of [[God]]. The closest thing to a compromise that you can achieve is deciding to [[Kill
** In ''[[Devil Survivor (Video Game)|Devil Survivor]]'', it gets even more complicated. Agree to serve God, and you bring about world peace and freedom from sin by going [[Knight Templar]] on humanity and eradicating sin. Become the King of Demons, and you lead demonkind against God, but risk the annihilation of humanity should you be defeated. Or you can give the power of Bel to humanity as a whole, leading the world into a technological revolution powered by enslaved demons, or abandon the throne and return the world to normal. So long as you make a choice and don't [[Screw This, I'm Outta Here|shirk your responsibilities]], no choice is the wrong one.
* In the first ''[[Deus Ex (Video Game)|Deus Ex]]'', while the [[Big Bad]] [[Corrupt Corporate Executive]] with [[A God Am I]] complex Bob Page is definitely evil, the ending has you choose to follow the advice of one of three opposing factions, each insisting that [[Well
** In the sequel, ''[[Deus Ex Invisible War (Video Game)|Deus Ex Invisible War]]'', while certain factions may come across as more or less positive, all have philosophies it's possible to sympathize with, while also being somewhat morally dubious. In the end you must pick between them, with no defined "good" or "bad" choice. You can also follow your own path and kill everybody, which backfires horribly (duh).
** The prequel, ''[[Deus Ex Human Revolution (Video Game)|Deus Ex Human Revolution]]'' continues the tradition by asking you to side with one of three competing viewpoints regarding human augmentation and subsequently nudge the public interest in that direction... But you also get a fourth choice where you can refuse all of them and leave the world's to decide it's own fate (of course being a prequel to the first Deus Ex, the results are pretty much foregone no matter what you decide).
* The three player factions (Humans, Mutants, and Biomeks) of ''[[Auto Assault]]'' were set up to be like this, but when you really look into it the Humans turn out to be the biggest bastards of the bunch, even if they were originally doing it to ensure their survival.
* ''[[Command and Conquer]]'' started off with GDI as heroic good guys fighting against the evil [[Cult|Nod]]. However, later games revealed that Nod actually has reasons for fighting, and a number of the higher-ups in GDI are rather dodgy.
** There's a major [[What the Hell, Player?]] moment in C&C 3, as if you're playing as GDI (the ''"good"'' guys), on the last mission you can choose to use a bomb that will kill hundreds of millions and destroy all of Europe. For this, the rational General who seemed like a pretty stand-up guy resigns in disgust, and the slimy politician (whose incompetence was [[Evil Plan|all part of Kane's Plan]]) ''promotes you''.
* ''[[Ace Combat]] 5'' has a war between superpowers [[Eagle Land|Osea]] and [[Lzherusskie|Yuktobania]] at war with one another...until it becomes known that Belkans had been infiltrating high-ranking positions in the two countries, and essentially setting up the war so they'd destroy each other as vengeance for losing the last one. By the end, both superpowers team up and collectively beat the tar out of the interlopers.
** For ''[[Ace Combat]] Zero'', while the Belkans do not seem to have overt good going for them, Cipher can slide along the scale of greyness depending on how many crippled or civilian targets he goes after. {{spoiler|A World With No Boundaries}} are [[Well
* ''[[Sid Meiers Alpha Centauri]]'' isn't so much about "being neutral" as about "being way too worried about surviving in this [[Death World]] of [[Mind Rape|mind raping]] worms and deadly fungi." However, the playable factions in the game run through the entire gamut of [[Character Alignment]]; according to those pages, the dominant alignment is [[True Neutral]] (with a total of 4 factions), and frequent references are made to factions being [[Shoot the Dog|forced to forget morality]] when it comes to survival, despite the character being a good governor and [[Pet the Dog|caring about their people]].
** Attempting to lump any of those factions into anything resembling an alignment has more to do with the player's agreement with that faction's rhetoric than actual in-game observation. Example: Lady Deirdre Sky and the (supposedly) peace-loving tree huggers actually breeding and using said mind-raping worms as a military, or Chairman Yang really just promoting social harmony. Once you've played a game where Brother Lal (leader of the so-called "Pacifist" faction) or Lady Deirdre are that game's evil empire who starts dropping planet busters on you when you start picking apart their faction (a war which almost invariably occurs because -they- declared war on you for not giving in to their extortion demands), you begin to understand that Alpha Centauri truly does live this trope.
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* In the ''[[Fallout 3]]'' DLC, ''The Pitt'', the two factions the Lone Wanderer encounters fit this trope. Wernher, the leader of the slave rebellion, wants to steal the cure to the mutations that ravage The Pitt to use it as a bargaining chip for the freedom of the slaves. Ashur, the ruler of the Pitt, considers his Raider army and slave-based workforce necessary evils that have given The Pitt safety and industrial power beyond compare; he hopes to use the cure to heal the inhabitants of the Pitt and allow them to have healthy children again, meaning they would no longer need slave labor because they would have a homegrown workforce. The player can side with either faction.
** The reason for Ashur's taking his sweet time working on the cure? {{spoiler|It's his daughter, who was born with a immunity to the radiation.}}
** Also the Enclave, who changed a bunch of genocidal Nazis from the old Fallout games into [[Well
*** But the game hints us that {{spoiler|only those who grew up in The Vaults and Enclave members are unaffected by the HEV probe, thus innocent and even good hearted ghouls and people who grew up in the Wasteland (who present slight mutations) will be needlessly wiped out. Leaving the Government personnel and the Vault dwellers to rule the wasteland}}. So, if anything, I'd say the Enclave's actions are of a darker shade of grey. Broken Steel confirms something even worse: anyone who has ever been outside a vault in their life dies from the mutated FEV strain.
** Also in ''[[Fallout New Vegas]]'' the conflict between the New California Republic, Caesar's Legion and Mr.House is promised to be this. The NCR is supposed to be [[The Federation]] which is expanding too fast and can't properly feed or protects its country or its inhabitants, Caesar's Legion is a ruthless, but effective organization that provides absolute safety, limiting true freedom to only strong human males, and business tycoon Mr. House fell JUST short of completely protecting the Vegas area before the bombs fell and wants to protect and rebuild Vegas to its former glory, but idealizes a sterile vision of the Old World and demands large amounts of payment. To make it even more grey and gray karma will not be the main change that occurs due to your interactions between the three factions, instead it will be your reputation. [[Dark Horse Victory|Of course, there's also the option of siding with none of the groups...]]
* The ''[[Suikoden]]'' series, most notably ''[[Suikoden II]]'' is praised for this trope, presenting the characters as humans in a compromising situation, instead of personifications of good or evil. It is very rare to find a hero who is completely morally sound (except possibly the main characters), yet it is also rare to find a villain who is purely and irredeemably evil (...except [[Complete Monster|Luca Blight]]). While this keeps the stories from becoming too simple or cliche, it also gives an interesting human perspective to the bizarre and often supernatural happenings that occur.
* In ''[[Yggdra Union]]'', every major army is neither perfectly good or perfectly evil--even the bandits are just taking advantage of others to survive, the character who engineered the constant wars is a [[Well
* ''[[Sigma Star Saga]]'' has this in spades: you, the heroic human character, are ordered to do some pretty horrible things by your superior, while the Krill, supposedly aliens hell-bent on Earth's destruction, are actually pretty decent people (with a few glaring exceptions) who harbor no particular ill will towards Earth at all. {{spoiler|Turns out that there's a couple of [[Government Conspiracy|Government Conspiracies]] on ''both'' sides of the conflict who are the truly evil ones, and the vast majority of both humans and Krill are good.}}
* ''[[Ar Tonelico]] II: Melody of Metafalica'' is a great example. Despite the fact that almost every character holds the same moral stance from beginning to end, pretty much every antagonist in the game will be considered a valuable ally at some point and nearly every ally gets a respectable stint as an antagonist. Even [[The Hero]] is arguably a [[Well
* ''[[Halo]]'' probably qualifies:
** The [[The Federation|UNSC]] is fundamentally benevolent, but somewhat heavy-handed with its colonies, and willing to resort to questionable methods for survival.
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** The second has even more moral ambiguity. We're given the choice between the Aotou Gang, who are run by an [[Obviously Evil]] [[Jerkass]] but whose rank and file are shown to be likable fellows who are easily swayed; the town magistrates, who act like [[Knights Templar]], but truly love their town; and the town militia, who are the working stiffs just trying to live their lives, but who are also involved with prostitution and minor drug dealing.
*** On the other hand, [[Complete Monster|Kyojiro Kagenuma]] really IS as insane and just plain evil as she appears to be. That she has her own ending (and it's a major [[Kick the Dog]] one) is telltale.
* ''[[Final Fantasy XII (Video Game)|Final Fantasy XII]]''. To elaborate, on the villain's side we have the machivellian, [[Affably Evil]] [[Evil Prince|Prince]] who wants to become the emperor and restore order to the empire, the [[Well
** This is Squall's worldview in ''[[Final Fantasy VIII (Video Game)|Final Fantasy VIII]]''. "There is no good or evil; just two sides with different views." Although, the world this time around turned out to be more [[Black and Grey Morality]].
* The ''[[Assassin's Creed (Video Game)|Assassin's Creed]]'' series makes this very clear. While the Assassins are made out to be selfless shadow figure heroes of the people and the Templars the [[Big Bad|evildoers]] of the world, it would be more accurate to say both parties seek for a world of peace and prosperity, they just apply different methods.
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* ''[[Final Fantasy Tactics]]''. In the beginning, two princes are fighting each other for the throne. Since it is basically the [[Wars of the Roses|War of the Roses]] in the form of Final Fantasy, neither side is really good. Later in the game it becomes more like [[Black and Gray Morality]] once the Church and {{spoiler|Delita}} start playing more significant roles in the war. {{spoiler|Delita, while ultimately a hero that saves the kingdom from falling into utter chaos, still uses any and every Machiavellian method available to him in order to accomplish his goals. The Church is basically controlled by Satan}}. The only white to be found is Ramza and his fate is {{spoiler|[[Crapsack World|to become a footnote in history]]}}.
* Used heavily in the ''[[Golden Sun (Video Game)|Golden Sun]]'' games, though it doesn't quite become apparent until ''The Lost Age'', where all the antagonists of ''The Broken Seal'' are revealed to have been working for good ends, and trying to defy a system that if left in place will result in the decline and ultimate end of the world of Weyard, but whose supporters (rightly) fear the abuse of Alchemy unleashed.
** In ''Dark Dawn'', the effects of releasing Alchemy are starting to take hold, the world is being reshaped, some heroes of the earlier games are [[Dude, Where's My Respect?|reviled for their efforts]], and the heroes of ''this'' game have to stop and debate whether or not to rescue a known criminal from a [[Cruel and Unusual Death]]. In the last instance, Karis [[Lampshade Hanging|has to explain this trope]] to Amiti (who [[The Ingenue|really is just that naïve]]).
*** Really, there is only one truly evil character in the whole series. Too bad that he's [[The Chessmaster]]...
* In ''[[Rift]]'', you've got the [[Knight Templar|oh-so-devout]] Guardians versus the [[Mad Scientist|innovative and self-reliant]] Defiants, [[The Usual Adversaries|trying to thwart each other at every turn]]. Both sides have skeletons in their closets, both sides are ostensibly trying to hold off [[The End of the World As We Know It]], and it's even difficult to point out either side as [[A Lighter Shade of Grey|the darker or lighter gray]].
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== Western Animation ==
* ''[[Justice League]] Unlimited'': For the Cadmus Story Arc, Cadmus is presented as rather dodgy, but with legitimate fears about the dangers of superheroes. The heroes, meanwhile, had a habit of putting the good of their own members ahead of that of unpowered individuals most at risk of supervillains.
** Notably, this went so far that {{spoiler|the writers were forced to have [[Hijacked By Ganon|a more 'traditional' supervillain]] take over the [[Big Bad]] seat, because they had no way to finish the arc in a satisfactory way with the time given without massive [[Motive Decay]] to make Cadmus [[Card
* ''[[Exo Squad]]''. The Neosapiens do perform atrocities and Phaeton is pretty much a [[Card
** If you like to know the background for the [[Space Pirates]] they were a prison labor force that were abandoned once the Neo Sapiens were made and {{spoiler|were driven crazy by their secret homeworld Chaos.}}
* ''[[Tom and Jerry (Animation)|Tom and Jerry]]''. Though Tom is usually the [[Designated Villain]], you can't overlook the fact that Jerry is extremely sadistic, and sometimes isn't even provoked. But that still doesn't excuse Tom, who often brings his punishment upon himself, and at the beginning of the majority of the episodes is bullying Jerry. At times its hard to tell who the victim is; sometimes its neither of them.
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