Grey and Gray Morality: Difference between revisions

The result of such a conflict depends on where the story lies on the [[Sliding Scale of Idealism Versus Cynicism]]. At the idealistic end, both sides will eventually realize that fighting is futile and end up putting aside their differences to learn from each other and make a new and better world. At the centre, one side usually ends up crushing the other; this brings about peace, but of a hollow, depressing kind, as a faction with noble ideals has been destroyed. At the cynical end, both sides gradually become less sympathetic and more evil as time goes on until in the end, the more evil, cruel, and vicious side annihilates the other, ushering in an era of harsh rule and oppression or both parties [[Kill'Em All|end up fighting to the death]].

 

 

A result of the above is that [[Grey and Grey Morality]] has one potentially great advantage: It can be easier to maintain suspense regarding the ending. In [[Black and White Morality]] situations, the ending is almost always a [[The Good Guys Always Win|forgone conclusion; good wins in the end]], it's just a matter of how. In a Grey-and-Grey situation, either side might conceivably win, or both, or neither.

** The monkeys are really creepy, but their situation makes it kind of understandable why they would resolve to [[I'm a Humanitarian|such drastic measures]].

* ''[[Dorohedoro]]''. With all the [[Villain Episode]], you can't help but realize that the setting is filled with [[Punch Clock Villain|Punch Clock Villains]] and [[Anti-Hero|Anti Heroes]] in a [[Crapsack World]].

** To a lesser extent, the ambitions of the [[Big Bad]] in the obscure video game ''Slayers Wonderful'' can be interpreted as this, as {{spoiler|the scientist Viola (the antagonist) wishes to seal magic in order to stop the warring between humans and those above them.}} Once again, though, it shows [[A Lighter Shade of Gray]].

* ''[[Gundam]]'' has made a point of this trope since [[Mobile Suit Gundam|the original series]]. Although the antagonists, Zeon, are generally seen as more evil than the Federation, the reasons that Zeon went to war are understandable and realistic, and the Federation commits its fair share of atrocities across the series as well. In the end, there are good and bad people on both sides of every conflict, and neither side is wholly Evil or Good.

* By the end of ''[[Martian Successor Nadesico]]'', it has been revealed that Earth was the aggressor in the so-called Jovian war, Nergal was the one who spearheaded and rewrote it, and the Jovian general is just as power-hungry and deceptive as you could ask for. The crew of the Nadesico gets backstabbed until they just don't care anymore, and decide to cut the war short their way.

* ''[[Noir (anime)|Noir]]'', despite its name, actually ''isn't'' [[Black and Gray Morality]]; it's fairly dark, but it's more like slate and charcoal than anything else.

** In the end, {{spoiler|Evening Primrose}} landed in more white territory - when they found out that there is a [[Take a Third Option|third option]] in which {{spoiler|neither Contractors nor Japan are destroyed}}, they went for it.

* ''[[Simoun]]'', from the beginning. It starts with the POV of someone from one of the peripheral, heavily polluted nations talking about why they are invading Simulacrum, and it has examples throughout of both sides doing good and bad.

* Patrick Tilley's ''[[Amtrak Wars]]'' series, with elements of [[Order Versus Chaos]] thrown in.

* Kevin J. Anderson's ''Terra Incognita'' series. Examples ranging the spectrum from the very good to the very evil can be found among both the Aidenists and the Urecari while the Saedrans stay strictly neutral.

* The three empires in the ''Quintara Marathon'' series demonstrate this, at least in terms of the humans who are represented in all three. The Exchange is a free-market free-for-all with the most personal freedom, but minimal social safety nets and an underbelly of corruption and unofficial slavery (in the form of genetically engineered intelligent beings considered as property). The Mizlaplan control a rigid theocracy where they are unquestionably the rulers (and effective gods), inquisitors and priest can use whatever methods they feel are necessary, sexual discrimination against women is part of the system, and where brainwashing into absolute obedience is commonly used, but where most people live peaceful, safe lives without concern about going hungry, crime, or actually being personally oppressed. The Mychol Empire is a dog-eat-dog vicious society with oppression, slavery, and a great deal of violence, but where everyone has the opportunity to rise if they are smart enough.

* In ''[[Lonely Werewolf Girl]]'' no one is really heroic in this tale, Kalix killed her father, Sarapen is batshit insane, the rest of the werewolves downright callous and manipulative, Moonglow cheats on her boyfriend, Daniel is trying to be a [[Dogged Nice Guy]] to Moonglow, Malveria a [[Retired Monster]], and the Avenaris Guild of werewolf hunters are trigger happy sociopaths.

** This could almost be a Trope Namer. While there have been numerous changes in the overall tone of the story over the course of the series, one thing has remained constant: NONE of the factions is a whole lot better than ANY of the others. (The only one who's a whole lot ''worse'' is Dong Zhuo, and even that doesn't become too blatant until 5.) The Empires games take it a step further; you start out dead-center neutral with whoever you play as, and it's entirely up to you how good or evil your reign is. Of course, part of the reason is that, historically, none of the great powers succeeded in unifying China (that would be some 11th-hour Jin Dynasty opportunist named Sima Yan), so it's impossible to say who the "hero" or "villain" really was. It might be a subversion ([[Alternative Character Interpretation|or accurate]]) of how Wei and Shu were portrayed in ''[[Romance of the Three Kingdoms]]''.

* In ''[[Samurai Warriors]]'', especially the second title, the focus is about the battle of Sekigahara. Those who side with Ishida Mitsunari will probably see him as a [[Jerkass]] who snarks a lot and is being redeemed with the values of friendship and honor; and see Tokugawa Ieyasu as a [[Fat Bastard]] who is stealing the throne of Japan while it rightfully belongs to Toyotomi Hideyori. However, those who sides with the Tokugawa know that Ieyasu is instead a 'Fat Gentleman', and he puts a lot of care to his fellow officers and people, condemning the West (especially Mitsunari's ally Kanetsugu) of using pretty words like 'honor and justice' to do underhanded things and robbing the freedom of the people. In fact, ''[[Samurai Warriors]]'' is much grayer than ''[[Dynasty Warriors]]'', the closest we can get of [[Obviously Evil]] is Fuuma Kotarou, and even he's ''still'' grayer than Dong Zhuo.

** [[Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots|MGS4]] further drives the point home when one realizes that the [[Amazon Brigade|Beauty & Beast Corps]] are war-scarred women outfitted with advanced nanotechnology and [[Big Bad|Liquid Ocelot]] is {{spoiler|1=[[Good All Along]] (relatively), is actually ''the'' Ocelot from MGS3 pretending to have assimilated Liquid Snake's personality, and is stopping the Patriots' plans.}} On the good guys' side, Roy Campbell's marriage to Raiden's wife Rosemary {{spoiler|was a facade meant to protect her and their supposedly-miscarried son Little John from the Patriots while Raiden is out fighting}}, and Rat Patrol 01 {{spoiler|1=is the Patriots' [[Unwitting Pawn|Unwitting Pawns]] -- their acronym ("RAT PT 01") can even be rearranged to spell "PATR10T" -- who are meant to eliminate Ocelot before he foils their plans -- [[Spanner in the Works|they simply never expected Old Snake to destroy more than just Ocelot]].}} It also turns out that the black-morality Solid Snake-era Patriots are {{spoiler|nothing more but [[AI Is a Crapshoot|a faulty AI system]] developed by Zero long after he lost faith in humanity following Big Boss's departure, which deviated from the vision of Big Boss, Zero, SIGINT, Para-Medic, EVA and Ocelot -- the original Patriots -- and built an economy [[War for Fun and Profit|based on warfare]], with Zero blissfully unaware (not to mention conveniently catatonic) of what he had wrought}}.

* Ditto for the ''[[Legacy of Kain]]'' series. By the time Defiance rolls around, you're never really sure who's supposed to be the good guy and who the bad guy.