39,327
edits
Muscles Are Meaningless: Difference between revisions
m
Mass update links
m (remove unneccessary quote box template) |
m (Mass update links) |
||
Line 2:
[[File:Negima_c89_Negi_decks_a_giant_clean.jpg|link=Mahou Sensei Negima (Manga)|right]]
In [[Real Life]], a person's size is [[Pint
Of course, writers like to take this as an invitation to go completely nuts. In fiction, you won't get lucky if you try to gauge a character's strength by their muscles. Seriously, don't try it. You will only embarrass yourself. Betting money is right out.
Line 8:
* [[Mind Over Matter]]. A psychic uses telekinesis to augment his own physical strength.
* Inner Power. It's a common spiritual idea that inner strength equates physical strength. This is often used as a justification in universes where [[Ki Attacks|the spirit is the true source of a character's strength]].
* [[Weak but Skilled]]. The seemingly weaker character is stronger because of his superior technique. This can work as a realistic justification until people [[Charles Atlas Superpower|start shattering mountains]] and punching out [[Did You Just Punch Out Cthulhu?|giant monsters]].
* [[Bishonen]] + [[Beauty Equals Goodness]]. You can't have your [[Troubled but Cute]] hero grow huge muscles without risking certain death at the hands of the [[Fan Girl|Fan Girls]].
* [[Super Strength]]. Characters may have big muscles in comic books to denote being super strong, but elsewhere this is often an exception. Sometimes even in comics books.
Line 18:
See also: [[Bishonen Line]], [[Cute Bruiser]], [[Little Miss Badass]], [[Boobs of Steel]], and [[Amazonian Beauty]] for specific character design examples. May overlap with [[The Gift]], [[Hard Work Hardly Works]] and [[Waif Fu]]. See [[Monstrosity Equals Weakness]] for a when this, and the other side of it, is case across the board.
{{examples
== Anime & Manga ==
* ''[[Dragon Ball (Manga)|Dragon Ball]]'', of course. Soon justified by [[Ki Attacks|ki energy]], but even before that, Goku could destroy rocks as a child when he was still the size of a watermelon and had stubby arms like a baby.
** This actually addressed as a plot point in the Cell Saga. Vegeta and Future Trunks had reached a certain ascended version of the basic Super Saiyan, but while it was an insane increase of power, [[Square
** There's also very early on the contrast between Vegeta and Nappa. Nappa, who's huge and brawny, is less than half as strong as the short Vegeta.
** Probably the most striking example, though, is Mr. Satan, who's legitimately strong, extremely muscular, and has a [[Badass Mustache]], but happens to be in a series where ki power beats muscle power ten times out of ten.
Line 29:
*** Videl is actually one of the straightest examples of this, as even before she learned basic ki manipulation she was at least as strong as her father Mr. Satan, despite being a slender teenage girl with none of his huge muscles. As for why Gohan doesn't accidentally snap her in half, it's probably for the same reason real-life weightlifting champions can pet a kitten or pick up an egg without crushing it. Controlling your strength to use only the amount you want to for the task at hand is not difficult.
** The DBZ characters are, however, very muscular for the most part. It turns out that anything that boosts your ki energy will probably also build muscle mass. Really, once you start blowing up planets with mystical ki energy, physics can go out the window and nobody will care.
* The complete dependency on Shinsoo in ''[[Tower of God (Webcomic)|Tower of God]]''. It is the one thing defining power and musclemass really means absolutely nothing. Not only does the [[Square
** Yuri and her clan, the Ha, is also a traditional case of being [[Charles Atlas Superpower|physically very strong]] while having a fairly feminine frame. Other characters, especially the damage dealing Fishermen can strengthen their body temporarily while inducing Shinsoo into their body.
* The CP9 of ''[[One Piece (Manga)|One Piece]]'' have the huge guy Blueno, but he's one of the weaker ones. By far the most powerful in the team is the lean (though tall) and attractive [[Knight Templar]] Rob Lucci. And then there is, of course, Luffy himself, who is one of the strongest people alive and has arms like sticks. Funnily enough, there was at least one occasion where he flexed his arms to reveal muscles larger than his head.
Line 48:
** Most obviously present in tiny 11th Vice-Captain [[Killer Rabbit|Yachiru]], the only shinigami that ''might'' be more terrifying than [[Blood Knight|Kenpachi]]. She's also able to lift Kenpachi over her head and carry him as if he were an empty cardboard box, despite the fact that he's twice her height and six times her weight.
** Nnoitra is very skinny, but is clearly much stronger than Grimmjow, and can go toe-to-toe against Kenpachi.
* This is all over the place in the [[Tournament Arc]] of ''[[Mahou Sensei Negima (Manga)|Mahou Sensei Negima]]''. Just of the eight of eighty we see get through the qualifying royales seven of them are either [[Waif Fu|a slender young woman]], [[Pint
* Present in ''[[Fushigi Yuugi (Manga)|Fushigi Yuugi]]''. Even with all the superpowered warriors, there isn't a single highly muscular character. What else would you expect from a shoujo [[Reverse Harem]] anime?
** A specific case of this is Nuriko, whose power is super strength, yet {{spoiler|he's skinny enough to convincingly crossdress as a woman.}}
Line 54:
* L from ''[[Death Note (Manga)|Death Note]]'', who is 5'8" and weighs 110 lbs, is quite strong, and fights using capoeira. He even states at one point in the series, while in a serious fight with Light Yagami, that he is stronger than he looks.
* ''[[Soul Eater (Manga)|Soul Eater]]'' uses the combination of a healthy 'mind, body, and soul' to define strength and point out that it's not purely down to physical power. Characters who are shown to be extremely strong physically do not always appear as such; Maka and Kid for example, though the latter has the excuse of being a god. It doesn't hurt to be muscular, however, as characters like Black Star (especially) and Stein show.
* [[Inuyasha (Manga)|Inuyasha]] is pretty trim under that kimono, but he can uproot large trees and use them as weapons, pick up and carry a bolder larger than he is tall, etc. Even for a [[Half
** His brother Sesshomaru counts as well. The ''very first thing'' we see Sesh pull in the manga is placing his hand lightly on a big, muscular man's head... and ripping it clean off without even a hint of effort. He's not any ''less'' muscular than Inuyasha (both of them do have some muscle tone, which is more than can be said of many [[Bishonen]]), but he isn't any ''more'' so, either.
** [[Word of God]] states that Sesshoumaru's ''arm strength alone'' is about as strong as Inuyasha in full demon mode. We're talking about all the strength in a single arm here.
Line 69:
* Who's the strongest character in ''[[Durarara (Light Novel)|Durarara]]''? Is it Simon, the huge black [[Husky Russkie|Russian]] sushi tout known to be capable of lifting men his size with one hand? Nope, it's Shizuo the skinny, blonde ex-bartender. A skinny, blonde ex-bartender that can throw vending machines four stories high. This is due to the fact that, beyond lacking the mental limiters most people have to [[Heroic RROD|keep them from ripping their body apart via overexertion]], most of Shizuo's muscular structure is so dense and compact that most bladed weapons have trouble penetrating it beyond a centimeter.
** It's stated in the anime that Simon is better that Shizuo in a one on one fight. He's the only one who can stop Shizuo's rampages, albeit with some trouble; he does it and comes out with some bruises and a black eye. Shizuo is stated to be better in a street fight however, due to an advantage in speed and his nigh invulnerability.
*** His body is THAT awesome because he literally broke every single bone in his body multiple times in his youth, due to the super strength and [[Hair
* ''[[Pokémon Special (Manga)|Pokémon Special]]'': Bruno of the Kanto Elite Four is a muscled powerhouse who trains alongside his Pokémon, always searches for the next big fight (Lorelei interferes when he faces Red, much to his chagrin before he gets brainwashed), and poses the Kanto Dex Holders no end of trouble. His disciple, Hoenn's Brawly, looks to have half the muscle he does, but has the same level of strength, which he pools with his determination to outmuscle Mack's [[Mind Rape]] when Groudon goes on a Magma-assisted rampage in Mossdeep.
** On the subject of Gym Leaders, Chuck and Bruno are on the big end, the former knowing a vast array of martial arts and takes up the same Fighting Gym Leader habit of training with his Pokémon. In case you think he sucks as a teacher, one of his disciples is Green, who while not demonstrating his talents in martial arts on-panel is hardly a slouch at commanding Pokémon. And if Brawly wasn't "scrawny" enough, then Maylene of Sinnoh manages to ''top'' that, being a skinny teenaged Pettanko who can cross blows with a Riolu - which, as we know, grows into Lucario, which is (literally) [[Made of Iron]]. This troper sees ''bad things'' happening to Team Galactic should she have to get involved.
Line 85:
* ''[[Rurouni Kenshin (Manga)|Rurouni Kenshin]]'':We have Sanosuke, a lean hand-to-hand combat fighter. Yet he's strong enough to lift a heavy zanbato and clash with muscular monk Anji. Anti-hero Saito, who can beat Sanosuke into a bloody pulp, and Shishio, who has enough power to send Sanosuke flying, are also quite slender.
** Averted with Seijuro Hiko, Kenshin's master, who seems a tall and slender man... until he takes off his coat, revealing a huge muscled body. [[Word of God]] says that some fangirls were disappointed at him not being a Bishounen.
* In ''[[Ranma
* Averted humorously in ''[[Ghost in The Shell Stand Alone Complex (Anime)|Stand Alone Complex]]'' when Batou, jokingly, tells the Major she should switch to a male prosthetic body like his because it would give her more strength. She challenges him on the spot and he brings his fists up ready to spar. Knowing that he's ''correct,'' she hacks his brain and makes him punch himself out.
** The joke here being that the Major doesn't need more strength when she has her far more effective brain.
* Pretty much all [[Magical Girl Warrior]] anime, from ''[[Sailor Moon (Manga)|Sailor Moon]]'' to ''[[Pretty Cure (Anime)|Pretty Cure]]'', give their heroines [[Super Strength]] upon [[Transformation Sequence]] without significant changes to muscle mass or tone.
* In ''[[Rosario to Vampire (Manga)|Rosario to Vampire]]'', [[Super
* ''[[Black Lagoon (Manga)|Black Lagoon]]'': [[Bald Black Leader Guy|Dutch]], the Lagoon Company's leader, is a fairly muscular guy but gets easily overpowered by the thinner [[Ninja Maid|Roberta]]. Ultimately, the much more trim Revy is the only match for her.
* In ''[[Koihime Musou (Visual Novel)|Koihime Musou]]'' very few characters are drawn muscle-bound but some of the smallest characters are among the strongest. Chouhi is only as tall as Kannu's chest but can carry a battering ram [[Up to Eleven|plus the half dozen or so people using it]] with one arm. While suffering from a cold. Kyocho is similarly a very small-sized character with no visible muscle but uses a [[Epic Flail|kendama with a huge metal ball that must weigh as much as she does]] in combat. Both easily qualify as [[Pint
* Just about every single [[Shoujo Demographic]] that involves action, including the male characters and even in series that don't have the supernatural excuse. You can be a pretty boy and still have a good amount of muscle but not in shoujo.
* In ''[[Fairy Tail (Manga)|Fairy Tail]]'', size and muscle mass is hardly ever an indicator of strength, barring a few exceptions like [[Badass|Gildarts]]. The incredibly thin Sol was able to overpower [[Heroic Build|Elfman]] with ease, and so could [[Ms. Fanservice|Mirajane]].
Line 104:
** So common in fact that when [[Supergirl|Kara Zor-El]] returned in 2004, writers were easily able to tease the fan base with the idea that the slender 16 year old girl might be stronger than her full grown powerfully built cousin Superman. Turns out, he just holds himself back [[World of Cardboard Speech|due to living his whole life in a world made of cardboard.]]
* [[X-Men (Franchise)/80s Members/Characters|Rogue]] is drawn as an athletic woman, but rarely with muscles anywhere approximating what she can do. Justified in that [[Power Parasite|she stole the strength powers from]] [[Ms. Marvel (Comic Book)|another hero]].
* ''[[Runaways (Comic Book)|Runaways]]'''s [[Pint
* ''[[Spider-Man]]'' possesses incredible strength but also possesses a thin physique that earned him the nickname "Puny Parker".
Line 123:
* [[Sherlock Holmes (Film)|Sherlock Holmes]], though not in the same manner as listed below. Twice, Holmes is able to take on people much, much stronger than him by calculating where the best places to hit/slap them are, going through the scenario in his head beforehand.
** Doesn't work quite so well with the big French guy, who wipes the floor with Sherlock. It takes two to bring him down.
* In ''[[Kung Fu Panda (Animation)|Kung Fu Panda]]'', all of the [[Five
* In ''[[How to Train Your Dragon (Animation)|How to Train Your Dragon]]'', Astrid doesn't seem to have much muscle mass at all, and yet she can still hurl giant hammers with enough force to knock out dragons.
* In ''[[The Guardian (Film)|The Guardian]]'', a movie about the US Coast Guard's rescue swimmers, one of the candidates is extremely well built and is washed out on the first day due to cramping up during a swim. [[Kevin Costner]]'s character dismisses him with a comment that muscle doesn't float.
Line 134:
* [[Sherlock Holmes]] is tall and wiry, but he is also extremely strong. After a burly man threatens him in "The Speckled Band" by bending an iron poker, Holmes casually straightens it.
* Ditto [[Erast Fandorin (Literature)|Erast Fandorin]]. Except that he has the justifying bonus of having been trained in ninjutsu for six years, meaning he can kill pretty much anything with his bare hands while hiding his strength under [[Bishonen|frail, bishie]] looks..
* ''[[Redwall]]'': [[Continuity Drift]] makes it hard to tell whether the animal characters are supposed to be human-sized, animal-sized, or somewhere in between, but it's pretty clear that animals which are smaller in the real world tend to be at least a ''little'' smaller within the canon than animals which are larger in the real world. It seems to be a rule that the [[What Measure Is a Non
** The size difference between animals appears to have decreased between books. The original had Cluny vs. Matthias and Cluny was far larger, and Constance was even bigger than he was, indicating a roughly accurate size difference that continued through the early books. About halfway through the series or so the difference seems to have changed from a normal person fighting a T. Rex to a smallish person fighting a tiger or something. Actual physical strength doesn't appear to be different except in extreme cases like badgers etc.
* Elves and Riders in the ''[[Inheritance Trilogy]]'' are often capable of feats of strength (and speed and magic too) beyond that of most humans, including humans with way bigger muscles. Eragon himself notes this in Brisingr by comparing his muscles to his cousin Roran's much larger muscles.
Line 197:
** Same thing that applies to Axel, goes with Larxene.
*** This is lampshaded early on in the first game, with Maleficent openly stating that "the boy's strength is not his own". It's implied that a combination of the Keyblade's magic and [[The Power of Friendship]] is what allows him to kick so much ass.
* Pick ''any'' [[One
* Link from ''[[The Legend of Zelda]]'' is generally on the small side and, even as an adult, doesn't get much bulkier than "wiry [[Bishounen]]" (and, if you're willing to go outside canon and take ''[[Soul Series|SoulCalibur II]]'' as a visual reference, barely grazes even ''five feet''). He also generally lacks any super powers beyond an [[Determinator|absurd level of courage]] and maybe a few acquired spells. So how is it that the guy can fight toe-to-toe with the [[Large and In Charge|hulking]] [[Big Bad]] or spontaneously perform backflips while wearing ''chainmail''? And that doesn't even get into the time he out-Sumo Wrestled a ''giant rock creature'' because he was wearing heavy boots.
** Although ''[[The Legend of Zelda Twilight Princess (Video Game)|Twilight Princess]]'' Link does seem a bit more built. Justified in his being a farmhand prior to his adventure. Manual labor does a body good...
Line 217:
* While not as scrawny as some of the other video game characters listed, in ''[[Team Fortress 2 (Video Game)|Team Fortress 2]]'', the Scout is able to sending enemies flying with a baseball bat, including the [[Mighty Glacier|Heavy.]]
* Cloud from ''[[Final Fantasy VII (Video Game)|Final Fantasy VII]]''. He's 5'7", making him the shortest human male in the cast. Also, while having very well defined muscles, is much smaller than [[The Big Guy|Barret]] or even Cid. Yet he's significantly stronger than anyone else in the party and in ''[[Final Fantasy VII Advent Children|Advent Children]]'' he ''carries'' Barret ''one-handed'' at high speed.
** If Cloud doesn't count because of all his mako enhancements, then Tifa most definitely does. She looks like a waif, but she can keep pace with Jenova-enhanced [[Super Soldier|Super Soldiers]], and unlike Cloud, she has [[Badass Normal|nothing going for her but]] [[Bare
* Similarly, Fenris of ''[[Dragon Age II (Video Game)|Dragon Age II]]'' is an elf, which in this game means very thin and lanky, but specializes in two-handed weapons which not only include greatswords but hammers and axes as well. Helps that he has [[Applied Phlebotinum|Lyrium]] laced throughout his body.
* In ''[[Saints Row the Third (Video Game)|Saints Row the Third]]'', at your complete whim you can change your hulking, muscular beast of a character to a stick-like [[Pretty Boy|bishie]] twerp on the spot via [[Magic Plastic Surgery|plastic surgery]], but you can still drop kick grown men, throw people across a highway, and manhandle a [[Elite Mook|brute]] with a baseball bat like it's no big deal.
Line 238:
* Disney's [[Hercules (Disney)|Hercules]], especially in the beginning of the toon. Initially he is quite small and thin but superstrong no matter what.
* Bamm-Bamm as an infant on ''[[The Flintstones]]''. [[The Pebbles and Bamm Bamm Show (Animation)|Later, he becomes a buff teen]].
* Ed, Sarah, and Rolf from ''[[Ed, Edd 'n' Eddy (Animation)|Ed, Edd n Eddy]]'' have virtually no muscles but are incredibly strong, but Rolf does when he flexes or becomes enraged.
* [[The Life and Times of Juniper Lee|Juniper Lee]] displays remarkable super strength compared to her appearance. Justified in that she's the [[The Chosen One|Te Xuan Ze]] and her super strength is magical.
* Stewie Griffin of ''[[Family Guy (Animation)|Family Guy]]'' can brutalize adults and fire an automatic weapon with no recoil problems despite being a baby. And then he'll get his ass whooped by an infant younger than him.
* June from ''[[Ka Blam! (Animation)|Ka Blam]]!''. Judging by her usually adorable appearance, no one could believe that she's pretty buff.
* In ''[[Avatar: The Last Airbender (Animation)|Avatar: The Last Airbender]]'', Jun beats some huge guy at arm wrestling easily. Then again, she is badass.
* [[Johnny Bravo (Animation)|Johnny Bravo]], despite being a muscular [[Top Heavy Guy]], is regularly shown to be beaten by people at the most half his size.
* [[Dave the Barbarian (Animation)|Dave the Barbarian]] is a very tall muscular guy but he's a total wuss who can't fight worth a damn and always gets his ass kicked by people and animals smaller than him.
* On ''[[Total Drama Island (Animation)|Total Drama Island]],'' shrimpy, geeky [[Dogged Nice Guy|Cody]] seems to have super strength. Aside from his [[Crowning Moment of Awesome]] knocking out [[Jerkass|Duncan]] in one punch, in TDDDDI he was hanging off a cliff, holding up himself, the muscular Tyler, the even-more-muscular DJ, ''and'' almost-three-hundred-pound [[Big Eater]] Owen. Shockingly, he was actually able to pull up all of their weight (though the cliff edge couldn't, which is why they fell anyway).
* In ''[[Silverhawks (Animation)|Silverhawks]]'', [[Genius Bruiser]] [[Brother
== Truth In Television ==
* [[Bruce Lee]] was about 160 pounds at his heaviest, and slimmed down in later years. By his movie-making prime, he was about 135-140 pounds, 5'7, and could do pushups with a 250 pound man standing on his back. [[Truth in Television]] indeed. On the other hand, his muscles might not have a lot of mass, but certainly have definition.
* Joseph Greenstein, known professionally as [[Pint
* [http://coelasquid.deviantart.com/art/Abdomination-How-to-draw-beef-132538271 Coelasquid breaks it down for you.]
* When someone is armed with the right knowledge (where to strike) and the training to match, a heavily muscled opponent can go down as easily as anyone else.
| |||