My Little Pony: Friendship Is Magic/Headscratchers/Season 2: Difference between revisions

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* Did anyone else think that when Twilight Sparkle got corrupted, that she would become a techhead instead? After all, the obvious offense against Magic is...but my real Headscratcher comes from the lesson of this story; Friendship is hard, but if you work at it you will persevere. This is all well and good, but the problem rears its head when we look at the circumstances that their friendship is threatened. It was totally from an outside force for which they had no control over their actions and weren't acting in their frame of mind. If they had been led into those corruptions from a sense of need to lie or be cruel or be greedy or grumpy in their own personalities, then one could argue that it was their personality and they could be held responsible, but not in this case.

** Twilight was corrupted because she gave up. That's why fighting for their friendship is the lesson. Twilight didn't try to fix them, she just pressed ahead on her own.

** Fair enough. Which leads me to wonder why her strength of enduring friendships would be something to attack. For the longest time, if we are being fair, she resisted. Also, being as smart as she is, you would think she would realize her friends were being manipulated...which goes back to the second question, really. They were being manipulated.

*** She definitely knew ''something'' was wrong, and that it was Discord's fault, but she pegged all her hopes on being able to befriend the crap out of him with the Element Cannon. When that failed, she just gave up until Celestia spammed her with her own letters. To more directly answer the opening 'scratcher, for all of Discord's [[Mind Rape]], he was taking a trait that already existed and turning it [[Up to Eleven|up to about fifteen]]. As one WMG on the Mane Characters page put it, each of them (except possibly Rainbow Dash) had already acted against their Element at least once - all Discord did was let that part out to play for more than a CMFIS (Cutie Mark Failure Insanity Syndrome, in case you aren't in the know)-induced breakdown (OK, Applejack's lies were mainly to keep a surprise party secret). Meaning that yes, they ''were'' lead into those corruptions from their own flaws, just aggravated by Discord.

*** That also assumes that the opposite was there to begin with. I would feel bad if the girls were brought low because of this apparent weakness. I will certainly agree with Rainbow Dash, Rarity, and (sorry 'bout this, cutie) Fluttershy though I would call her more psychotic and desperate more than cruel. They certainly showed the opposite traits. Twilight hadn't before Season 2, and I don't think Pinkie did. She was paranoid and schizophrenic [[Played for Laughs]], but I'm not sure I'd call her grumpy, would you?

*** And as for Twilight, she absolutely ''did'' demonstrate her "Discorded" traits in Season 1...way back in the pilot. Meeting the other members of the Mane Six allowed her to get past that mindset, but with them all having abandoned her, there was nothing left to keep her from reverting to the introverted loner with no time for or interest in making friends. The additional signs of depression can be attributed to the old aphorism "you never know what you've got until you lose it."

 

*** Although there are the provisos that [[God Does Not Own This World]] and said God no longer being directly in charge of the series, [[Word of God]] disagrees with you. According to Lauren Faust, she ''was'' corrupted by something. Her own jealousy and resentment allowed it to corrupt her, but there was an outside force that catalyzed the change from "jealous, resentful Luna" to "Nightmare Moon." It's not clear ''what'' did it, and given the direction the series has been taking, it might never be revealed. Popular guesses include Discord (though the timeline doesn't seem quite right for that), or Tirek or whatever his G4 equivalent is. (With the caveat there that there's no indication that there ''is'' a G4 Tirek or anything equivalent, although turning a pony into a "Wicked Mare of Darkness" is certainly his '''style'''.)

 

** Why are you so bent on [[Draco in Leather Pants|putting leather pants on Discord]]? If you want a Family Friendly Explanation, then Celestia is wrong and Discord isn't Chaos incarnate: As his name indicates, he is DISCORD incarnate, AKA the OPPOSITE of harmony. One of the elements of harmony is friendship, so he befriending ''anyone'' would be against his own nature (That is, true friendship, not the playful destruction he caused).

*** I think I phrased that wrong because I was tired. I meant why couldn't they have ruled Equestria even if they aren't best friends/a couple, they could have done it like a president and vice president.

 

== 2.04 Luna Eclipsed ==

** Celestia is kind of a troll, maybe she didn't realize that her sister wouldn't take it in good fun like she would. Or maybe it was part of her "master plan" to not only teach Twilight a lesson about friendship, but to show her sister how to have fun.

** Could easily be simply a tradition the ponies themselves started, at first starting as an actual appeasement. Later simply a tradition. Luna might have simply heard of it and went 'oh, I need to FIX this'.

* How's Tank going to live with Rainbow Dash in Cloudsdale despite being a turtle (thus, can't walk on clouds), or is it going to stay the night with Fluttershy?

** Twilight can probably just cast that cloudwalking spell on it, and it has the helicopter to get from cloud to cloud.

** Umm... [[Incredibly Lame Pun|Shellicopter]], anyone?

* How did Gummy appear in Rainbow Dash's dream? All the other pets were making noises but Gummy can't make any kind of sound so he shouldn't have appeared. It's a pretty silly and pointless question, but this troper was just wondering.

** I don't know though, I felt they really only turned up as Mare Do Well when Rainbow Dash started getting so full of herself that she started botching the "hero-ing" part of being a hero. The crashing balloon? She herself blew it off to do autographs, and Mare Do Well got down to business. (side note: episode didn't say who was in costume that time, but we know it wasn't twilight because she was in the crowd, and given the situation was probably Pinky.) The Runaway wagon? Applejack waited until after Rainbow boasted and after she failed to save them. Applejack not then stepping up and trying to save the wagon would have been irresponsible, but she did wait and give Rainbow Dash her shot at it. The collapsing construction site? Actually took both Rainbow Dash AND Pinkie working in tandem to save everypony, even though Pinkie did save more than RD. The Dam? Rainbow made a bad situation worse before Mare Do Well got there, and it took Twilight to save the day. In my mind, the only thing the 5 are really guilty of is using the costume to make the point. Rainbow really was either screwing things up or getting in over her head on her own by the time Mare Do Well showed up.

*** The part that really got to me was the one where they all laughed at her, despite seeing her clearly distraught. Not only does this ''directly'' contradict the message of "Lesson Zero", but it destroys any hints of innocence in their actions. That and Fluttershy showing up, which didn't even serve a purpose - she was clearly just there to make Rainbow Dash ''more'' jealous and upset.

***** I think in that scene they were just trying to test whether she'd learned the lesson in humility they had for her. If she'd been willing to agree with them they would probably have come clean at the first opportunity, but instead she continues to act unimpressed while obviously seething with jealousy.

*** They used the costume for a reason: If they hadn't, Rainbow Dash would have accused them of stealing her spotlight, and would have quickly challenged every one of them, for another "Iron Pony" competition. Fluttershy showing up was so Rainbow couldn't narrow it to who it really was.

*** You also have to keep in mind that all the ponies were already in full "party mode" when they decided to crash the garden party. Twilight and Fluttershy got into party mode while they were hanging around friends that they were comfortable with, and that enthusiasm spilled over. It's not like they went ''straight'' to the garden party and acted like that; they were acting appropriately for their own party, and they failed to adjust when they changed venues. And given that when the only thing on your mind is "party party party" you aren't really thinking clearly.

** I think you're completely correct in your initial assessment. That scene, and to a lesser extent the Grand Galloping Gala, really bugged me. My first thought on watching that scene was, "Holy s***, were every one of the Mane cast raised by wolves?" Pinkie Pie actually started redecorating. Step back from the show for a second and think about how assholish you'd have to be to go to somebody else's party and start changing the decorations. That's beyond mere obliviousness, and bordering on needing to get some professional help. Can you imagine rolling into your hypothetical college fratboy movie night, redecorating, and ''changing the music''? You probably wouldn't admit to knowing them, not because you'd feel like shriveling up, but because you'd be afraid of getting your ass kicked. Every one of them displayed a complete lack of etiquette, and (in Dennis Miller's words) I don't mean the kind of psychotic Emily Post lunacy where they don't know how to use the 85 Goddamn forks arrayed around their dinner plate. I mean like basic courtesy, and acknowledging the existance of others as separate beings with their own desires.

**** If Twilight Sparkle was trolling, that actually makes it ''worse''. Trolling implies that it was deliberate, i.e., that she actually knew that she was being rude to the other guests and embarrassing to Rarity. (This leaves aside that trolls, at least as the internet uses the term nowadays, are just bullies that take advantage of anonymity to avoid retribution, rather than the jocks in high school who used muscle and reputation to escape the same. It's not an attractive character trait.) Remember, the only reason this had a happy ending is that it happened that Fancy Pants was cool about it. Rarity is trying to make it in the world of high fashion. I don't understand aesthetics or the appeal of fashion, but even I know that it's a highly reputational business. If Fancy Pants hadn't intervened--and Twilight had no way of knowing that he would--Rarity would be ''ruined''. The only thing she could have done with Carousel Boutique would have been to burn the place down and collect the insurance money. That doesn't make Twilight Sparkle a good understanding friend (the point of the episode), it makes her a passive-aggressive bitch. As far as being able to kick out the Garden Party, I doubt it. The Princess letting Twilight make use of an unused room in the palace isn't the same as being willing to kick out somebody who probably had a room reserved. Aside from the pure rudeness of throwing somebody's plans into disarray, it'd make the Princess look like a petty jerk, and I doubt she's ruled for 1000 years by yanking around important people for little to no reason.

*** Why do you think she'd be "ruined"? At the absolute worst, Rarity would just go back to relying on Ponyville business, which was clearly enough to keep her afloat for however long she ran her boutique before she started getting famous clients.

** You just answered your own question. She was tied up, she couldn't cast any spells.

*** Gee, I must have never noticed when she performed an interprative dance every time before she cast any of her other spells. Oh wait, she didn't, because she '''just has to think hard enough''' to cast a spell. And maybe she did use a spell during the scene cut, it just didn't occur to her until 20 seconds later.

** Perhaps she automatically teleports anything she's touching, so she'd just teleport the tree and rope with her as well.

*** [[Forgot I Could Fly]]. There, I just explained this and every single instance similar to it that has or will happen in the series.

*** Maybe she was told the story before. Now, she was worrying because Granny would likely tell another nonsense story to the whole class as she often does, embarassing her horribly. Her happiness stems from how now the rest of the class knows and is delighted, along with dodging a huge bullet there. Also, two words about Apple Family pride; Applebuck Season.

**** Applebuck Season was about Applejack's ''personal'' pride, not the pride of her family in general. In fact, bragging at all seems to be a thing quite frowned upon among them. As for the above question, I can see Applebloom asking Granny Smith exactly that, and her replying with either [[You Never Asked]], or that she honestly didn't feel it was worth mentioning, that it was just the way things played out as opposed to something boast-worthy. Given how absent-minded Granny Smith can be, it seems quite in-character for her to regard something monumentous as natural or unremarkable.

** Someone named their child Filthy and another child was named Stinkin'. Some ponies just aren't good namers. Besides, maybe Granny Smith just went as Smith? Or Smith Apple? Or some other apple reference I don't know.

** I've seen the name "Anny Smith" floating around, which I guess would be most reasonable, considering that it still works as a reference to the apples.

 

== 2.15 The Super Speedy Cider Squeezy 6000 ==

** The Apples never said they had any problems with the income their cider generates as of now; merely that they have a limited supply of their very popular product. Some customers were disappointed that they didn't get their share, but not to the point were they'd do more than grumble. In fact, they seem perfectly willing to start lining up for miles the next day just to increase their chances of getting a cup. There'd be no reason to deliberately drive some away, especially considering that the family depends on repeat business. Besides, the Apples are all straightforward ponies; they'd see such a tactic as dishonest and reject it out of hand.

** The cider sales are what keep them afloat during the Winter. It's not supposed to make them a profit, so increasing the price would not be a suitable solution.

**** But they don't have an unlimited amount of apples, so the long run might not be long enough to ensure profit. Furthermore, even if they would make a profit, the split just wasn't fair. The Apple family would be doing all the work maintaining the farm, growing the apples and harvesting them. Furthermore, even though they already have the apple trees, the farm still has a lot of expenses. They may have to purchase fertilizer, and of course, there's maintenance of the barn, fences, signs, tools, they have to buy things like barrels, and more. Not to mention they need enough money left over to support a family of four. Big Apple Acres is more than just the orchard, they have a lot more to support. And as seem in the episode, the Flim Flam brothers cared only about profit, not quality or integrity. Would you really want to work with someponies like them?

*** As stated a few times, the expenses from running and maintaining the farm, and feeding the family, are all expenses they make already, regardless of whether they make cider. The initial idea was that if the brothers had offered something that was more enticing (like a relatively-reasonable 50/50, since they're bringing unprecedented technology they literally can't get anywhere else to the table), then they probably would've been able to discuss a real business relationship with the Apples, instead of sparking an immediate feud. As for integrity, of COURSE nopony would want to work with them if they knew the brothers for more than 30 seconds. They're jerks, but if they HADN'T been jerks, they would've offered some a split that's not insulting, and could've made something great happen. Quality, though, is a different story. Until they "cheat" at the competition, their cider is implied to actually be delicious. Granny Smith drinks some and clearly looks worried that they actually have an equal product. They very clearly put great care into making sure their machine turns out a quality product consistently. They only stopped caring about quality because they started panicking about potential loss, and they probably figured losing would've made them look even worse than having an undrinkable product.

** Because they'd hit a bottleneck with Granny Smith and Rarity inspecting the fruits and the mill only capable of juicing so many at a time. Better to split the crew among the various tasks according to their talents for better overall efficiency at all four steps than to attempt to focus on the sheer volume of one part of the process.

** We don't know how magic works exactly. It's possible that certain spells can only be performed under certain conditions. For instance, maybe in Applebuck Season Twilight had to spend a couple hours ''preparing'' the mega-apple-picking spell before she could actually use it. If so, then such a spell would be worthless in a timed competition like this.

*** Selling cider directly from the source not only allows them to set their own prices, it gets ponies to come directly to the farm and familiarize themselves with the Apple family. Doing so ensures repeat business and allows them to move other apple products while the crowds are still there. They can combine advertisement, seasonal product selling, regular products sold, and the full portion of the profits all by cutting out the middle man. Of course we don't see any additional products sold, but it would be a perfect opportunity.

*** Well, rather than sell it to a middle man, why not spend all of their time making the cider while trusted, responsible family friends like the Mane 6 work the stand. Make the cider within eyesight of the stand, interact with the customers during breaks, but also make more product, thus sell more product, get a better profit, and don't leave anywhere near as many dissatisfied customers, so the Flim Flam Brothers can't get the entire town behind them. In fact, if they got the whole gang to help work the stand, they could run 5 lines at a time while they have enough stock, thus shortening the lines so even if you get turned away you haven't wasted as much of your day waiting on it. Or if they prefer, have the trusted family friends do the cider making while the family works the counter. Either way, they make a LOT more product, without losing any of that family business feel.

**** The problem with having the Mane 6 help is that they already ''have'' jobs. Even if they're willing to help, they may well be too busy next year or the year after that.

* Flim and Flam's names are probably supposed to indicate their nature, but…how? They're certainly not nice, but they're not ''dishonest'' either. Their machine works exactly as they claim it does, and until they press that button, nothing indicates their cider is of lesser quality. Granny Smith tries some of it, and her reaction suggests that it is indeed as good as her family's, though she's not about to say so. Even when the brothers ''do'' put quantity over quality, they're perfectly willing to lower the price of the cider, if only to get ponies to buy it. So while they're definitely ruthless and callous towards the Apple family, what evidence is there that they're actually cheating anyone?

* How the hay do the hospital ponies keep up with Rainbow Dash? She's shown that she can easily outrun all the ponies in Ponyville except Applejack and Pinkie Pie. They should be falling further and further behind.

** Well, the pain from her wings could had crippled her running speed, and the one time we really saw her run against someone else was during a marathon, this was a sprint. Ponies also tends to demonstrate greater physical abilities when pushed, having a thief break into your establishment, especially after a patient claimed he was robbed sure seems like a great way to push the medical staff and a security guard... and an insane patient, apparently.

*** But that's just it: In that race she repeatedly demonstrated that she could go from way behind the pack to way in front of it, even ''without'' her wings. The only pony who could actually keep up with her was Applejack.

*** Doesn't stop her from still feeling pain from her crippled wing, though. Ever felt that stab in the ribs while running?