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What Measure Is a Non-Badass?: Difference between revisions
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* [[Unlucky Everydude|Ganta]] from ''[[Deadman Wonderland]]'' is often lamented to be a useless, cowardly pansy, with many fans much preferring [[Ensemble Darkhorse|Crow]] (who is often declared the most [[Badass]] character in that series). They seem to be ignoring the fact that Ganta is only 14 (compared to Crow, who is obviously much older than him) and was just a normal student who never really got into fights, and who is also ''new'' to Deadman Wonderland.
* Yukki from ''[[Mirai Nikki]]'', in that he is a young boy who was forced into a very violent world. He spends the first 20-30 chapters crying and running away. Then he [[Break the Cutie|gets broken]] and [[Took a Level In Badass|takes a Level in Badass]].
* Canada from ''[[Axis Powers Hetalia]]''. Partly as a case of [[Misplaced Nationalism]], many Western fans have a tendency to turn him into a [[Memetic Badass]] and [[Deadpan Snarker]] instead of the fairly nice, unassertive guy he is in canon.
** China is also bashed once in a while because of his "girly" looks and voice, and he also gets some "revision" to make him more snarky and assertive (though not nearly as much as with Canada). Even though he's shown to [[Cute Bruiser|have martial arts skills]] in canon and ''[[Super Strength]] rivaling America's'' in the anime.
** Poland's [[Keet]] behavior and penchant for ponies and skirts makes him ''hated'' in some circles. Him being one of the few nations who will fearlessly stand up to [[Psychopathic Manchild|Russia]] will be conveniently ignored by them.
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* Many parts of the ''[[Naruto]]'' [[Fan Dumb]] utterly embody this attitude as applied to pretty much ''any'' character: any time a character appears to be something less than a [[Badass]] who accomplishes everything without any effort whatsoever, you have hoards of people saying how they must suck as a character because they are "weak". In the rare occasions where they don't, they'll bitch that the writer sucks for not making them "badass enough" or turning them into [[Mary Sue|Mary Sues]].
** Sakura is the most outstanding example, in both part 1 and 2. In part 1 she was rather useless and bossy. Not a good combination. Realizing this, she [[Took a Level In Badass|Takes A Level In Badass]] to catch up. What most people fail to realize is that, although she did get trained in combat, she was mostly trained as a [[The Medic|Medic]], a very important role. Some of this derivates from the fact that she's still bossy towards Naruto and her using of her super-strength to punish him over the stupidest reasons, even though this greatly lessened too after the time skip.
** Uzumaki Naruto, due to a combination of this trope and [[Moral Dissonance]] spanning from his upgraded role as [[The Messiah]], started suffering from this sometime around chapter 450. Which is funny considering that 10 chapters previously, he beat {{spoiler|Pain, who was ''very'' powerful}}, and in his next fight he {{spoiler|[[Curb Stomp Battle|stomps]] the [[Eldritch Abomination|Nine-Tailed
* Orihime of ''[[Bleach]]'' gets a similar treatment, being bashed for being [[The Medic]] and a largely non-combatant. Though this likely stems partially from the fact that her powers are much more amazing and she isn't using them to her full potential, and probably more so [[Die for Our Ship]] related reasons.
* This ''somehow'' happened in ''[[Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann]]''. Many of Kamina's fanboys (which is about 90 percent of the people that watched the show), refuse to acknowledge Simon as the main character, simply because, according to them, he's not as badass as Kamina... despite the fact that the show made it clear that Simon far surpassed Kamina by the end of the show, and without Simon's help, Kamina wouldn't have made it as far as he did. Hell, in the {{spoiler|[[Lotus Eater Machine]], ''Kamina himself'' admits that Simon has surpassed him.}} [[Misaimed Fandom]] at its finest, ladies and gentlemen.
** Probably due more to [[Replacement Scrappy]] Syndrome, for those who actually dislike Simon anyways. In terms of badasstry, Simon has done WAY more than Kamina has if only for the fact that he has much more screen time. May also have to do with Kamina's more moronic and over-the-top personality (note that moronic is not diminutive since fans love the fact that he acts like a moron).
** Additionally, Rossiu is considered [[The Scrappy]] by a large number of fans because he's the [[Only Sane Man]] and more subdued and cynical than the rest of the cast.
* Alphonse Elric from ''[[Fullmetal Alchemist (manga)|Fullmetal Alchemist]]'' gets hit pretty hard with this in [[Fullmetal Alchemist (anime)|the 2003 anime version]]. He's not weak, but he's much more reluctant to fight than his brother, and has a much quieter personality in general. He's still a main player whose actions have a direct effect on plot development, but many fans dislike him for not being proactive or badass enough.
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** Thing is, Index can be [[Badass Adorable]] when she wants to. People just ignore that.
* Out of the fans of [[Fairy Tail]] who prefer Erza over Lucy, a good portion of them were heavily influence by this.
* If you follow an anime series in which the heroine is bullied or abused (specially by her classmates or her family) and doesn't resort to beating them up as a result... please think twice before reading the comments and/or reading about it on blogs. Mikan from ''[[Gakuen Alice]]'', Tohru from ''[[Fruits Basket]]'' and Nanako of ''[[Oniisama e...]]'' are specially hated by stupid watchers who blame ''them'' for the hardships they go through "because they're weak whores who don't fight back".
* Shouma Takakura from ''[[Mawaru Penguindrum]]'' gets potshots that range from mere affectionate jokes to straight-up bashing for not being as action-geared as his older brother Kanba. {{spoiler|Even more so after episode 19.}}
* Kaoru of ''[[Rurouni Kenshin]]'' is the head of her own dojo and is [[Informed Attribute|ostensibly]] a national-level fencing champion. But hanging around Kenshin and Sanosuke and the caliber of villains they fight means she is constantly outclassed.
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== [[Film]] ==
* Played with, and possibly subtly [[Deconstruction|deconstructed]] in ''[[Death Proof]]''. The initial group of women that run into Stuntman Mike are treated as annoying, [[Developing Doomed Characters|disposable types]] while the second group are the heroines we cheer for. No matter that the second group prove themselves to be irresponsible jackasses (such as abandoning one of their own to a seriously creepy possible rapist simply so they could whiz around in a car for a few hours); since they are indisputably [[Badass]], we like them more than the theoretically more sympathetic (but non-[[Badass]]) first group.
* Take any of [[Steven Seagal]]'s later movies; the most common complaint will be that he hardly does any real fighting anymore since he's gotten older and put on weight. As if the acting, writing, and production values wouldn't be terrible if he'd managed to stay as fast and fit as he was in his first few films. Though this is perhaps what inevitably happens when you build your entire early film career on the fact that you're a total badass.
** The fact the he is often replace with a double for a little of reason as ''walking'' hasn't helped.
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== [[Live Action TV]] ==
* Because of the mystery surrounding the character and his agelessness, many ''[[Lost]]'' fans built up Richard Alpert as the answer to the entire show, the most powerful character, and, among some fans, a literal [[Memetic Badass]] and the show's version of Chuck Norris. Fans on [[
** The beginning of season 6 had {{spoiler|"Fake Locke"'s first act after killing Jacob being to ''beat up Richard'' in front of the Others for no apparent reason other than to establish his authority}}. That didn't go over well with the aforementioned people.
* This often happens on ''[[Survivor]]'' where people make it to the finals but are told they're not badass by the jury despite that the game's Slogan is "Outwit, Outplay", and "'''Outlast'''". They tend to forget that ''last'' "O"...
** Natalie White was considered this on ''[[Survivor]] Samoa'', particularly by her aggressive competitors who were with her in the last tribal council. Then jury-member Erik stands up and delivers a speech in which he points out that since she's still in the game, she must be doing ''something'' right, and furthermore, did it in a way that didn't sacrifice her integrity. Meanwhile, [[Out of Focus|Mick]] claimed to deserve votes (Natalie didn't), while Russell Hantz just sociopathically bullied his way through the game and finished by boasting "These two suck - Aren't I awesome?" to the jury. This speech may well have contributed to her 7-2-0 win. Much of a [[Base Breaker]] as it was, compared to the ''following'' season, this would be ''nothing.''
** Sandra Diaz-Twine in ''Heroes vs. Villains'' had this by the [[Base Breaker]] fans as well as Russell Hantz himself. Russell claims that Sandra being able to win ''twice'' is somehow proof that the game's rules are flawed, because she would be ''terrible'' at physical challenges and have ''zero'' personal immunities under her belt, yet was good enough with people to know what was up, and was able to play the lesser of three evils. ("I hate Russell, too.") Meanwhile, Parvati already had a pretty loyal fan base and played a game more people approved of, as opposed to Sandra who [[Xanatos Speed Chess|went with the flow]]. Some Sandra supporters even pointed out that Sandra ''had'' more allies in the jury (including the entire Heroes tribe) and [[What an Idiot!|Russell should have considered that]] -- Parvati ''did'' realize this and [[Cassandra Truth|tried to get Russell to see this too]], but he kept on insisting that Sandra had no chance of winning... just like he insisted that Natalie had no chance of winning in ''Samoa''. Cue the [[Humiliation Conga]].
** Becky likely received no votes because of the final four tie-breaker where she and Sundra took two hours to make fire. Never mind that she ''and'' Sundra helped Yul and Ozzie go on a chain of immunity wins when the mutiny reduced their tribe to four.
** In fact, the ''Survivor'' players accused of being this are [[Double Standard|almost always female]]. Matthew, Rupert, Bob, and Fabio were criticized by some for their lack of strategic play compared to others, but not ''nearly'' as much as the above listed females were.
** Overall, "niceness" tends to be an extremely underrated trait among a vocal portion of the fanbase who complain whenever a strategic player is beaten by a less strategic but more likeable one and call these "nicey nice" winners "undeserving" winners who won only because they were facing bitter juries who didn't appreciate the strategy of their opponents. This not only ignores that more often than not, these so-called "strategic" players had horrible jury performances (Sugar from ''Gabon'', Twila from ''Vanuatu,'' Russell from ''Samoa'' and ''Heroes vs. Villains'', Sash from ''Nicaragua'') compared to the strategic winners who knew how to read and work the jury (Chris from ''Vanuatu'', Todd from ''China'', Parvati herself from ''Micronesia'') or bring along opponents even more disliked than them (Brian from ''Thailand'', Rob from ''Redemption Island,'' Danni from ''Guatemala''), but also that niceness ''has'' proven to be a valuable asset multiple times like how Bob's fatherliness endeared him to Sugar and Fabio's likability compared to his opponents was most likely the major reason for [[Na Onka]] voting for him in the end in spite of having regularly made fun of him in earlier episodes.
* Dr. Keller suffered from this a bit in ''[[Stargate Atlantis]]''. While the other doctors in the show are also pretty non-action-oriented, Keller's fragility, especially when contrasted with Teyla's hardy survival instincts in the episode "Missing", do make her a boring character for some. To be fair, she isn't a soldier, but Rodney's been pretty badass since his big sacrifice in the second episode, so Keller does look pretty weak by comparison.
* This happens a ''lot'' with Guinevere in the ''[[Merlin (TV series)|Merlin]]'' fandom, with her portrayal caught in a quagmire of [[Die for Our Ship]], [[Real Women Never Wear Dresses]], and a [[Misaimed Fandom]] that believes Morgana is a great feminist icon. Where to start? On the surface, Guinevere is essentially portrayed as a [[Shrinking Violet]], a stark contrast to Morgana as a [[Spirited Young Lady]]. Morgana gets to do lots of cool things: [[Action Girl|sword-fight]], telekenetically throw people through the air, [[Tyrant Takes the Helm|stand up to King Uther]] and wear [[Gorgeous Period Dress|gorgeous costumes]]. Guinevere's role is to be Arthur's [[Love Interest]], Merlin's [[Black Best Friend]], and is often accused of being an [[Extreme Doormat]].
** However, this is a ''huge'' simplification of each woman's characterization and [[Character Arc]]: namely that Morgana's [[Sliding Down the Slippery Slope|fall into evil]] was marked by her [[It's All About Me]] attitude in which she ranks her own grievances and pain against the needs of others and begins a [[Roaring Rampage of Revenge]] against not just Uther, but ''everyone'', including innocent people. In contrast, Guinevere (who is also deeply wronged by Uther when he has her innocent father executed) rises above her inner turmoil and explicitly refuses wallow in hate. Many fans seem to have ''completely'' missed the juxtapositioning of Guinevere's declaration that she would never seek vengeance against Uther because: "that would make me just like him" with the recent observations by ''several'' characters that Morgana is now no different from Uther. It also fails to take into account the fact that Morgana is quite often a [[Faux Action Girl]], with plans that are ill-thought out and fail ''constantly'', whereas Guinevere's attempts at proactivity have a far higher success rate (retrieving the morteus flower from the dungeon, arguing on behalf of the women in Ealdor, escaping Helios's men by submerging herself in the river). Though Guinevere has played the [[Damsel in Distress]] a few times, Morgana has been in similar situations just as often ([[Dude in Distress|as have all the male characters]]) and is extremely [[Weak-Willed]] given the consistency [[Hypnotize the Princess|with which she is placed under enchantments]]. Guinevere, on the other hand, has the ''unprecedented'' move of removing an object of enchantment from her body of her own free will (and thus breaking the spell she was under).
*** It's a classic example of style over substance - in this case, Guinevere's decency, patience and kind heart is no match for Morgana's glamourous life-style. As [http://www.racialicious.com/2011/10/18/fandom-and-its-hatred-of-black-women-characters/ this] article puts it:
{{quote|''Merlin fandom seems to believe that Morgana’s treacherous magical girl ass is a more empowering role model for women than Guinevere’s steady, quiet strength''.}}
== [[Tabletop Games]] ==
* In any tabletop RPG, it's not uncommon for certain character builds to be considered badass or overly strong. In some cases this is simply because conventional player wisdom expects them to be (such being the case with many late-game Wizard builds in 3rd edition Dungeons and Dragons) or because the setting declares them to be so (street samurai in Shadowrun, juicers in RIFTS). However, every gamemaster runs a game their own way and a character that is theoretically badass on paper may turn out to be useless because the challenges the party faces aren't in their area of expertise.
** To use one of the aforementioned examples, a street samurai in Shadowrun is a cyberwared-rocking, face-destroying nightmare of a combat monster... until the party realizes stealth, enginuity and kill-free missions work out better. The end result is a screwed-out player rocking back and forth in his/her seat, looking utterly useless.
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== [[Video Games]] ==
* The Protagonist of [[Kingdom Hearts]], Sora, seems to be somewhat of a [[Base Breaker]] because of this. He's goofy, naive, and lacks angst ''and'' ambition, and is incredibly gentle and empathic. His attitude sort of screams the opposite of badassery. He is also quite possibly the second most powerful individual in the universe, beaten out by a reality warping physical god. Without training or preparation, he has accomplished more than three of his (formally trained) predecessors put together. His combat prowess is ridiculously inflated in Kingdom Hearts 2's [[Action Commands]], but this serves only to highlight the dissonance.
* ''[[Max Payne 3]]'' has been met with tremendous backlash for various reasons, but among them is that Max is now well into middle age, heavier and bald.
* Eliwood from ''[[Fire Emblem Elibe]]''. He says he doesn't like war that much. [[Sarcasm Mode|Clearly, he must be a pansy]].
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