Defeat Means Friendship: Difference between revisions

{{trope}}

 

{{quote|''"After a fair and square fight, everyone becomes friends -- That's the Rule of Right of Shonen Manga!"''|'''Ken Matsushiro''', ''[[Yakitate!! Japan]]''}}

From the writers' standpoint, this trope is a way to keep characters around longer. If it's a show about fighting, and if the hero is always getting stronger, what's the use of a defeated enemy? We want to see him fight some more, but he can't fight the hero again because that would be repetitive and we all know he would lose. So instead, he becomes an ally and gets to assist the hero.

 

 

Compare [[Kill Me Now or Forever Stay Your Hand]], another way to win over your enemies. Also compare [[Let's You and Him Fight]] where the two character are heroes who are already on the same side but still fight each other before joining forces, and [[Fire-Forged Friends]], where enemies end up fighting on the same side to become friends. Contrast [[Villain's Dying Grace]].

** Many of the human relationships are this way too. At first, Ash couldn't stand either [[The Rival|Gary or Paul]], but once he'd fought them in the Pokémon League he formed a new friendship, or at least mutual respect, with the both of them. More generally, the [[To Be a Master]] nature of the series means that many non-evil characters are after the same goals as the protagonist, and while they compete against one another there's no real hatred between the majority of trainers.

** This was subverted to hell and back in at least one episode, though. After being tormented the entire episode by a wild Rotom in an abandoned hotel, Ash and Dawn eventually use their combined powers to defeat it, and then are concerned for its safety when it seems down for the count. The Rotom wakes up and looks ashamed, and Ash conjectures that Rotom was just lonely and wanted someone to play with. Rotom nods in agreement... then shocks all of them before darting away, cackling madly.

** The original ''[[Dragon Ball]]'' series could be pretty much defined by this trope, and some of it even carries on to the very end of ''[[Dragonball Z]]''. {{spoiler|Uub anyone?}}

** Avo and Cado from the JUMP Super Anime Tour special have got to be fastest example in the history of fiction.

** MANY other important characters in the show follow this trope ranging from Mai and Mokuba and even to villains like Pegasus and Marik. Seto Kaiba is very unusual in that although he is repeatedly beaten by Yugi and has had the invitation of friendship extended to him by the group more than once, he only admits to respecting Yugi but never would call him his friend.

** ''[[Yu-Gi-Oh! GX (anime)|Yu-Gi-Oh GX]]'' deconstructs this with the [[Light Is Not Good|Society of Light]], who [[Brainwashed and Crazy|"recruits"]] their members by beating them at Duel Monsters. Interestingly, a good deal of the main characters that fall into the Society's sway were trying to use this trope to snap their friends ''out''.

*** That would explain [[Serious Business|A LOT]].

* ''[[Bleach]]'':

** And Mikitaka, but he may or may not be all there.

*** Who, himself, does the same. No, really, he got a Yandere to become a nice girl, and started dating her. By (accidentally) throwing her out of a cliff, then saving her.

* The entire Shuffle Alliance in ''[[Mobile Fighter G Gundam]]'' is assembled in this fashion (except Sai Saici, who fought Domon to a draw rather than being beaten). Main rival Chibodee Crocket goes back and forth between violently beating the hero and having breakfast with him at least three times.

** Naruto ''is'' a [[Warrior Therapist]], so it isn't just that he defeats them.

** Averted with Ino and Sakura, who renew their friendship after fighting to a draw. The nature of their rivalry suggests that a clear victor would have been detrimental to reconciliation. Then again, technically, they '''both''' lost, since as a result of the draw, both failed that attempt at the Chunin exam.

** Also, the younger Toguro is not only fully aware of this fact, he welcomes it. The elder Toguro, on the other hand, is simply unkillable and thus has no reason to care.

** Chu, although he didn't wait for defeat, Rinku, Jin, Toya, arguably Kuwabara (and his posse by proxy, although that's practically manga-only), reluctantly both Shishiwakamaru and Suzuki, Murota, Mitarai, slightly Amanuma, hell all of the seven except Sensui, Itsuki, and Gourmet (did we ever learn his name?), although the Doctor and Sniper just went non-antagonist. AND Sayaka in the pre-resurrection arc, although in the anime she was merely a Spirit-World inspector. Suzuki even went so far as to {{spoiler|provide Kuwabara and Kurama with weapons that they would have been pwned without}}, although technically this was to further his own ends. Yomi became friendlier after the Demon Tournament arc, although he was by no means a friend or ally, as well as Mukuro and Raizen's old friends. Luka {{spoiler|got out of the force-field for hire and switched to doing a radio show with Koto and Juri after nearly being incinerated by Hiei.}} This series exploits the trope almost as much as ''DBZ''.

** Not really, as after defeating them, or not quite defeating them, Yoh has gone to great lengths, (or in one case Anna didn't go to great lengths, just lengths) to help them find what they sought. In two cases, this won Eternal undying loyalty. And Lyserg took ages to figure it out anyway.

* Gokudera Hayato in ''[[Katekyo Hitman Reborn]]'', declaring his [[Ho Yay|undying devotion]] to Sawada Tsuna after the latter defeated the former by [[Crouching Moron, Hidden Badass|going into "Dying Will" mode]].

** Er, not to mention that Gokudera was about to die from setting off his own dynamite, and Tsuna saved his life?

** After being defeated by defeated {{spoiler|Gokudera, Gamma seems to be going this way}}

* In ''[[Outlaw Star]]'', Gene Starwind earns Suzuka's allegiance this way, though it's been theorized she was really just tired with the life of a hired assassin. This incident is especially interesting because Gene ends the fight by literally disrobing her.

* Arguably subverted in ''[[Hellsing]]''. Everyone Alucard kills becomes one of his [[Summon Magic|summoned monsters]]. They have no choice in the matter, and definitely aren't too happy about it.

** Also arguably subverted with {{spoiler|the Iscariot organization in the final chapter. At first it seems that Iscariot, who lost almost everyone during the war, have formed a somewhat friendly relationship with the Hellsing organization afterward. It turns out that they're really just waiting until they've properly rebuilt themselves to launch their next crusade.}}

* The girls from ''[[Magic Knight Rayearth]]'' managed to convince the summoner Ascot to stop fighting them after defeating his beasts and teaching him the value of friendship. The fact that he had killed Presea, which ''really'' upset them at the time, was conveniently forgotten.

** Presea's death only occurs in the anime. In the manga, it's his idea of letting his beasts use the unconscious Hikaru and Fuu as toys that really upsets Umi, especially when he calls them stupid for trying to protect Umi.

* In ''[[Mahou Sensei Negima]]'', Kotaro becomes [[The Rival]] after Negi defeats him during the Kyoto arc. Chisame and Chachamaru also become relatively good friends after their massive hacking battle during the Mahora Festival arc. Later, {{spoiler|Jack Rakan}} is revealed to have had one of these with Nagi in a situation [[Generation Xerox|surprisingly similar to the thing with Kotaro]].

** Rakan appears to be a subversion. His version of this tropes sounds more like "Draw Means Friendship". Just take a look at his fights. He fought Nagi to a draw, Friendship, he fought Vrixas Nagasha, the ancient dragon, to a standstill and they were on good terms since then, his fight with Kage-chan never reached a conclusion so it can be considered a draw, after the fight they went drinking and became friends.

* ''[[Medaka Box]]'' ,being a [[Deconstructor Fleet]] of Shounen tropes, plays with this one too. Medaka actually ''can't'' befriend people without somehow defeating and "fixing" them first. As Ajimu points out, Medaka values her enemies more than her allies. In chapter 118, {{spoiler|Medaka deliberately provokes Zenkichi further after Ajimu convinced him to fight against Medaka by beating the crap out of him and mocking him afterwards. Medaka tells Kikaijima that she hopes Zenkichi will become a [[Worthy Opponent]] that she can defeat and "befriend", and mentions that she should have set him up to be her enemy from the very beginning.}}

* This is standard operating procedure for ''[[Sailor Moon]]''. Usagi believes that there is always a way to solve things without violence or killing and that somewhere inside of them, everyone has some good to them. While there are some villains she has to outright destroy, she has a pretty good track record of turning enemies into friends.

* There's an interesting variant in ''[[Claymore]]''. {{spoiler|Miria}} vows not kill any of her former comrades when she leads a revolt against The Organization. She fights and defeats all of them... only to get butchered horribly when they regenerate. {{spoiler|Her resolve not to kill inspired every single enemy Claymore to defect to her side and they faked her death.}}

* In ''[[Holyland]]'', {{spoiler|Iwado, Shougo, Taka and Tsuchiya}} after their defeat by Yuu.

* In Boorman's ''[[Excalibur (film)|Excalibur]]'':

** Lancelot is seeking to serve the man who can best him in combat. Arthur loses to Lancelot, then cheats by using Excalibur's power to knock Lancelot silly. Lancelot doesn't realize what happened when he wakes up and agrees to join Arthur. Of course, things don't turn out so great in the end...

* When the [[Wrench Wench|mechanic]] [[Mama Bear|mom]] finally accepts the evidence that her son was murdered, she still harbors a grudge against ''[[The Machine Girl]]'', who she previously blamed for it. Before joining her on a vengeful warpath, she's determined to engage the one-armed girl in a fight that culminates in an arm-wrestling match. After she's defeated, the mother immediately makes friends with Machine Girl.

* When Matthias and Balthazar go at it in ''[[The Scorpion King]]'' we ''know'' how it's going to end. Call it a curious form of pre-historic male bonding.

** The aforementioned meeting of Robin Hood and Little John is a subversion of the trope, since John wins but joins Robin's band anyway.

*** Robin got more or less all of his band this way, and he won some and lost some. He considered it necessary to building a good band, as a sort of test to make sure that each new man was both strong and loyal, so that in a pinch they would be competent and true.

** While perhaps a very long bow to draw, it's not impossible that both stories were influenced by the Epic of Gilgamesh. Sumerian culture had demonstrable influence (either directly or through its cultural successors) on all subsequent Old World cultures, except sub-Saharan Africa.

* ''[[Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer]]'', anyone?

"I'm not sure that qualifies as ''sub'' anything." }}

* In Christopher Stasheff's ''[[Warlock of Gramaraye|The Warlock In Spite of Himself]]'', a goon named Big Tom picks a fight with the hero, Rod Gallowglass; when Rod proves he can best him, Tom asks humbly to be Rod's man. Subverted in that {{spoiler|Tom is a canny agent of Rod's enemies, taking advantage of this trope to get close to him}}.

{{quote|'''Belgarion:''' Oh yes. [The Orb] has no conception of the word "impossible". If I really wanted it to, it could probably spell out my name in stars. * Orb twitches* Stop that! That was just an example, not a request. * Belgarion grins sheepishly* Wouldn't that look grotesque? 'Belgarion' running from horizon to horizon across the night sky?

'''Zakath:''' You know something, Garion? I've always believed that someday you and I would go to war with each other. Would you be terribly disappointed if I decided not to show up? }}

* Justified group example in ''[[Council Wars|There Will Be Dragons]]'' by [[John Ringo]]. The inhabitants of a town are rather irritated with the legionnaires stationed nearby. The farmers and craftsmen all work hard for their living, while the soldiers are just lazing around in the woods, and coming to town with lots of unearned money and making trouble... Tension is high and there are fights between townspeople and soldiers. To solve the situation, the legionnaires challenge the town militia to a mock battle, and proceed to beat them soundly. The townspeople realize that the soldiers are not just lazing around, but are training hard to be able to defend the town if needed. And all are friends again.

* ''[[Dave Barry]] Slept Here'' outright parodies this, repeatedly using the term "befriend" to describe [[Gunboat Diplomacy]].

 

== Live Action TV ==

** Though with Shadow and Silver, Sonic never actually defeated them (events with the Last Story seem to imply that their fight ended in a draw), and Silver actually beat Sonic, so basically, you become Sonic's ally regardless of whether or not he beats you.

* ''[[Super Smash Bros.]] Brawl'' uses this as a common means of getting new allies in the Subspace Emissary mode. The odd thing is that you can often fight as ''either'', so it works both ways.

** In ''[[Disgaea]]'', Flonne, Hoggmeiser, Maderas, and Gordon all get converted to Laharl's side after he beats them handily in boss battles.

*** However, Hoggmeiser and Maderas are noted as joining ''without Laharl's approval'', and plenty of the other cases are "Laharl beats the crap out of someone so they'll become his new vassal".

** In ''[[Phantom Brave]]'', killing a few of an enemy type will make it possible to recruit that enemy type.

** In ''[[La Pucelle|La Pucelle Tactics]]'', if you "purify" just about any enemy before killing it, it will join your party and can be fielded immediately if you don't already have 8 units in play.

*** {{spoiler|Cept it does. It just gives you a bad ending on top of it. You get her after going through the bad ending, there just [[Subverted Trope|isn't an actual event of it happening]]}}

** ''[[Disgaea 2: Cursed Memories]]'' has Yukimaru, who joins you after Adell beats her in the tournament and talks her down from probably-very-honorable-but-not-really-wished-for suicide.

* Marcus the super mutant from ''[[Fallout 2]]'' narrates to the player a one-on-one battle between himself and a member of the Brotherhood of Steel. After three days the two combatants reconcile, become good friends, and found a town together. Doesn't quite fit the trope 100%, as Marcus seems to imply that the fight was a draw.

** Arguably this applies to all the mutants in broken hill, who after the death of the master at the hands of the vault dweller, reconcile with humanity and try to live in peace with the towns humans (most of them anyway). Also Marcus becomes friends with the PC, whose grandfather destroyed Unity.

* In ''[[Dragon Age]]: Origins'', this can happen with Zevran, potentially leading to a romance, as well as {{spoiler|Loghain}}.

** Played with in the case of {{spoiler|Loghain}} though; while the player may forgive him for showing remorse as he is defeated, {{spoiler|Alistair}} will most certainly NOT. {{spoiler|He becomes infuriated with the player, reminding them of all the evil Loghain has done in the recent past, contrition or no.}}

== Web Comics ==

* Played with in ''[[Misfile]]'' while most of Ash's races are nothing more than just races (some friendly, some less so), when Ash gets defeated by [[Big Bad|Kamikaze Kate]] it is Kate that declares Ash not only to be her friend, but surrogate "[[Replacement Goldfish|little sister]]".

** Though just about everyone at least suspects that mind control is involved, with most people believing it completely.

* ''[[El Goonish Shive]]'' clearly ''wants'' to subvert it at the climax of ''Sister II'', even using the title "Not Quite BFFs", but no one actually expected it in the first place.

* Played straight in ''[[Our Little Adventure]]''. Pauline the barbarian joins the group after getting defeated in combat.

** Inverted later in the comic when [[Talking Animal|Norveg]] 'defeats' [[Jerkass|Angelika]] by deflecting a thrown bottle at him back at her. Norveg joins her after as her familiar.