Ragnarok Proofing: Difference between revisions

{{trope}}

 

 

It is, understandably, common in post-apocalyptic fiction [[Ruins of the Modern Age|to show the ruins of society]]. However, many are set several decades, or even centuries or millennia [[After the End]], and the remains of [[The Beforetimes|the pre-cataclysm society]] are in remarkable condition. Buildings and objects will never fall apart due to neglect, and any [[Lost Technology|pre-cataclysm devices or vehicles]] that the characters find will work just fine.

If only one thing inexplicably survives, such as in a [[Time Travel]] or [[Earth All Along]] setting, it's known as [[The Constant]].

 

 

 

The History Channel produced a television special documentary film and TV series ''[[Life After People]]'' where scientists and other experts speculate about how the Earth might be like if, suddenly, humanity no longer existed.

 

{{examples}}

* Played straight & subverted in the Sankei Newspaper ''[[Astro Boy]]'' serial. When he [[Time Travel|travels back in time]] to the era of [[The Vietnam War]] he eventually shuts down due to the fuel he runs on not having been invented yet. He winds up at the bottom of the Mekong river & isn't found for decades, but a quick refill has him up & about again with no difficulty (though he was in a box at the time). When he runs out of fuel a second time due to its prohibitive cost, though, he falls down on a mountain & by the time his "birth" comes around again he is nothing more than a rusted-out shell.

* The eponymous mecha of ''[[Cannon God Exaxxion]]'' lay buried on Earth for over 2000 years before being excavated by the hero's father. Perhaps justified, in that it was kept in a giant space-packing crate and the mech itself is practically indestructible.

* The main premise of ''[[Yokohama Kaidashi Kikou]]'' is partly about people (and [[Ridiculously-Human Robots]]) having to cope with just how little Ragnarok Proofing actually exists in the real world.

** One memorable [[Heartwarming Moments]], however, shows the [[Robot Girl]] blown away by the beauty of a submerged Yokosuka, streetlights still operational.

** Another reason why there aren't any other relics from the "Dark History" is because {{spoiler|the Moonlight Butterfly ''destroyed everything else''.}}

* Played partially straight (but [[Justified Trope|Justified]]) in ''[[GaoGaiGar]]'', when the missing ChoRyuJin is dug up after sixty-five million years, his body is completely fossilized, but his AIs are found to still be in working order. It turns out, however, that he had some serious [[Applied Phlebotinum]] they were using specifically to keep himself alive long enough to be found again.

* Averted in ''[[Tsubasa Reservoir Chronicle]]'', where one universe features an entire world in ruins from acid rain and pollution, most buildings already starting to crumble from the carbonic acid and lack of human maintenance.

** A flashforward to a few centuries hence shows nothing but desert. The aversion is partially suspended for a single building, justified by its having a magic reservoir underneath it- and it was ''partially'' decayed.

** And when you consider the fact that the AI is not only increasingly self-aware but had managed to keep itself functioning for {{spoiler|''27 million years''}}, even as all its systems break down, it's could also be a case of [[And I Must Scream]].

* The supply hatches in ''[[7 Seeds]]''.

* Humorously averted in ''[[Slayers]]''. In her first appearance, Martina reactivates a war golem made by her ancestors during the last great Mazoku War, which took place 1,500 years previous. As she gloats over its immense power, the golem starts malfunctioning, due to the fact that its 1,500 years old and hasn't been maintained in at least 1,000.

 

* In ''[[Kyon: Big Damn Hero]]'' the SOS Brigade uses a lost dimensional anchor created millions of years ago. It works perfectly fine.

 

 

* ''[[Battlefield Earth]]'' is one of the worst offenders. The Earth has been taken over by aliens for a thousand years, and the characters escape into the ruins of Denver, Colorado. Not only are all of the buildings still standing, but books are still readable, computers still work, and military jets that should have crumbled into dust centuries ago are completely operational. And they have perfectly working jet fuel, which has a shelf life of 40 years. And as if that weren't bad enough, the characters even encounter an abandoned shopping mall where frozen chickens can still be found in the supermarkets.

** This is a major divergence from the book, wherein civilization was pretty much completely gone, buildings crumbling, machines rusted to junk, books decayed to the point of falling apart. Although the book has [[Doorstopper|other problems]].

** Well it's not like all that much time passed, the ruins being a result of an earthquake and the squalor fitting their "living down and dirty" philosophy (remember, they could all join in a life of boring comfort on the surface if they wanted).

* ''[[Waterworld]]'' is another major offender. It's been long enough for people to forget that there ever was dry land. The ruins of pre-cataclysm society have spent all this time ''underwater''. Despite this, <s> anyone</s> the Mariner can just swim down to a former city and come back up with perfectly working artifacts. The "smokers" have completely operational jet skis and sea planes, and even large stashes of cigarettes, which have a shelf life of a few weeks.

*** One should also note that they didn't skimp on the quality when it came to food as well, as evident by WALL-E feeding a cockroach a ''seven hundred year old Twinkie bar. Still intact. With the cream filling still inside.'' Effective preservatives, then.

*** I think the Twinkie part was played less for realism and more for humor. As the joke goes, "What are the only two things that could survive a nuclear apocalypse? Cockroaches and Twinkies."

* Semi-averted in ''[[The Time Machine]]'' (2002) when Alexander Hartdegen finds the library from 2030, but in the year 802,701; the building itself is in ruins, but the artificial intelligence ''Librarian Vox 114'' is still unbroken and semifunctional.

** Barely. His sanity was hanging on by a thread. Fortunately he got repaired and was able to fulfill his programming, happily teaching kids in the sunlight.

** The eggs were covered in a layer of "protective mist," which may have functioned as a stasis field. No explanation as to why the ancient beacon shuts itself off in the 57 years between Alien and Aliens, though...

* Justified in ''[[9|Nine]]'', as the stitchpunks evidently hadn't inherited the Earth all that long ago, and the extinction of life right down to bacteria would've averted biological forms of decay, leaving only slower forces like erosion to degrade humanity's leftovers.

* The film adaptation of ''[[The Road]],'' even though the exact timeframe is never specified, shows a rather grimy, realistic take, given that most ''everything'' has either broken down completely or on the verge of becoming so. Even the [[Survivalist Stash|only intact bomb shelter for miles]] that the protagonists find has lights functional enough to stay on for a few seconds.

* The film version of ''[[I Am Legend]]'' shows with [[Scenery Gorn|graphic realism]] what a {{spoiler|seemingly}} abandoned New York City would look like three years. Parts of the city are flooded, the power's long gone while decay and vegetation spread across the rest of it. The only signs and leftovers of civilization still functioning are pretty much those which Neville maintains.

* Marvin from [[Douglas Adams]]' ''[[The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy]]''. Thanks to [[Time Travel]], his subjective age is 37 times the lifespan of the universe, and the diodes on his left side were never replaced in all that time.

** This was [[Played for Laughs]] though. The diodes had been causing him pain since before he was first separated from his human companions so, given his [[The Eeyore|miserable outlook]] they would be the only thing on him that was never replaced.

* In the [[Ray Bradbury]] story ''There Will Come Soft Rains'', a futuristic house is shown with still working robot technology after a nuclear war has wiped out humanity, since it has been programmed to do a certain amount of self-maintenance. Too bad it runs out of water trying to put out a fire in itself, since there isn't any water service anymore, and its [[Failsafe Failure|backup systems]] don't prove effective enough.

** There's no indication how long ago the war took place. It's implied that it was recent, since the family dog, suffering from radiation sickness, is allowed to enter the house.

* Semi-averted in George R. R. Martin's ''[[Tuf Voyaging]]'', where Tuf finds an EEC seed-ship which has been abandoned for over 1,000 years, which is somewhat functional as the original crew had shut it down for long term storage including automated repair robots, but which required significant repairs to make it fully operational. But only semi-averted, in that things like air lock door seals and handles still worked perfectly even after being exposed to vacuum for a millennium.

** Actually, that is literally the best possible way to store devices like that.

* Averted in [[Terry Pratchett]]'s ''[[Strata]]''. An artificial world has survived for several thousand years, maintained by a sophisticated AI and an army of robots that have managed to keep it and themselves in working order, but they can't keep it up forever; eventually there will just be too many worn-out parts for them to replace. ("What do you do when the robot that repairs the robot-repairing robots breaks down?") The protagonists arrive just as things are reaching that point and the world is on the verge of final breakdown.

** In fact it is revealed in the end that {{spoiler|they arrive ''because'' the world is on the verge of final breakdown and they've been brought there as a result of the central AI's desperate attempt to get outside help.}}

'''Sajaki:''' From what I gathered on the surface there's very little in the fossil record to substantiate that.

'''Sylveste:''' But there wouldn't be, would there? Technological artefacts are inherently less durable than more primitive items. Pottery endures. Microcircuits crumble to dust. }}

* In ''Empire of the East'' by [[Fred Saberhagen]], set thousands of years [[After the End]], the heroes search for a magic metal elephant to help them in the war. The elephant turns out to be a <s> completely</s> mostly operational nuclear-powered battle tank from before the nuclear holocaust. The armament is dead and the chemical-protective gear crumbles when touched, but the controls still light up, the engine roars, and none of the drive mechanism is broken. This is rare enough on a tank that hasn't been maintained since last ''week''.

* [[H.P. Lovecraft]]'s Elder Things and the Great Race of Yith were said to have colonized the Earth about [[Ancient Astronauts|a billion years ago and 200 million years ago, respectively]]. Yet, there are remarkably intact ruins of their colonies on Earth discovered by humans ''much'' later on. ''The Shadow Out of Time'' even has the protagonist uncovering Yithian ''books'' from a millions-of-years-old ruins in the Australian desert. Then there's ''At the Mountains of Madness'' where an entire Elder Thing city is found relatively intact in Antarctica, along with exceedingly well-preserved Elder Thing bodies. May be [[Hand Wave|explained]] as the Elder Things and Yithians being very advanced aliens and possibly in possession of insanely durable materials construction and preservation technologies, but still...

* The Great Ship from [[Robert Reed]]'s ''Great Ship'' universe spent a couple billion years drifting towards the Milky Way. Aside from superficial damage to the exterior hull, all the on-board systems work perfectly fine with no damage.

* Averted with Antrax, the titular [[Big Bad]] of the second book in ''[[The Voyage of the Jerle Shannara]]''. Antrax is a [[Master Computer|sapient supercomputer]] guarding knowledge of the technological age that preceded the current [[Shannara]] 'verse, and its outpost's automated defenses still work after several hundred years. However, it's noted that Antrax is self-maintaining, and that it's reaching its limits despite this (particularly with its power supply).

 

*** If there's no life on the ship, you don't really need life support - so as long as the ship remains sealed (or just bits) then it isn't beyond reason that there is still some breathable air in at least some compartments.

** Or TNG's ''Time's Arrow'' where {{spoiler|Data's head}} is found to still be in working condition after about half a ''millennium''. Underground. With a postmortem-programmed message still recorded and intact inside. That was programmed using a steel file. Not only was it still working, it was returned to service and seems none the worse for its advanced age, throughout the remainder of the series and movies!

** Played straight in "The Impossible Planet" and "The Satan Pit", where the ruins of a civilisation that imprisoned what could very well be Satan (as well as the prison itself) predating time itself and containing writing even [[Living Ship|the TARDIS]] [[Translator Microbes|is unable to translate]] still stand circa the 41st-42nd century.

* ''[[Red Dwarf]]'' has no end of functional artifacts and living creatures that seem to date back to around the time that Lister left the solar system, give or take a few centuries, including the eponymous ship itself. Given that the show takes place ''3 million'' years after he left, it's amazing they still work so well.

** Of course, with [[Red Dwarf]], minor details like continuity and the laws of physics are frequently discarded in favour of [[Rule of Cool]] and [[Rule of Funny]].

** Actually addressed in the show, for comic effect, Holly's IQ has degraded from 6000 to 6. And attempts to revert this do not go well.

** Also somewhat averted in the above: the MMPR Command Center is less than two hundred years old, and from its exterior appearance in the 1880s, has been continuously under construction and maintenance since then.

* The titular [[Aquila]] was [[Ancient Astronauts|an alien battlecruiser's]] [[Escape Pod|lifepod]] which crashed on Earth thousands of years ago, where it was later found and used to explore the world by a Roman centurion. After that, it then spent ''another'' thousand years or so buried underground before being discovered by two boys - still in fully working order.

 

== Tabletop Games ==

* ''[[Gamma World]]''. Set in the post-apocalyptic ruins of a high-tech civilization, the rules explicitly say that [[Rule of Fun|enjoyment of the players]] and usefulness for the plot are the sole determining factors in whether any given artifact has survived decades or even centuries lying around unprotected in a irradiated mutant-infested wasteland. (A [[Hand Wave]] is of course always possible: the goodies can be locked away in nuke-proof buildings, and the exact amount of time since the apocalypse is left very vague.)

* Averted in the ''D20 Apocalypse'' supplement for ''[[D20 Modern]]''. The rules for determining what characters can find when they search abandoned buildings includes a consideration of how long it has been abandoned. There's even a chance that the building might collapse while the characters are inside.

* Justified in ''[[Exalted]]'': Most [[Lost Technology|First Age technology]] is self-maintaining, so even after hundreds of years of moldering in some forgotten ruin or other, they'll still work perfectly. Since Solars were the only ones who could obtain or create the materials and enchantments that make this possible, however, all [[Magitek]] made since the Usurpation requires periodic maintenance to remain operational.

* [[BattleTech]]: The 'Mechs that are jockeyed around circa 3025 are already possibly hundreds of years old, passed down from generation to generation of pilot families. And they still work. Often times better than the new stuff. Many fans believe some of the absurdly heavy tonnages (you heard me) and large size of various electronic equipment and weapons is specifically ''because'' they're built to last.

** Also, presumably if you're planning to pass a [[Humongous Mecha]] off to you kids, you're going to keep it maintained. Same applies to [[Drop Ships]], which you don't exactly want to be held together by rusty bolts if you're coming down into an atmosphere at Mach 3 inside a ship that is about as aerodynamic as the Sydney Opera House. Unmaintained and poorly maintained [[BattleTech]] technology tends to fail miserably when pushed into combat.

* ''[[Rifts]]'' only uses this a little. Though the physical ruins of some cities and towns still stand a few centuries ''After'' [[After the End]], the chances of finding anything ''usable'' in them is pretty much nil. However, ever so often, a cache of military equipment from the previous age, specifically stated to be Ragnarok-Proofed, is found.

** This has been partially subverted recently, as it's been revealed that many of those caches are much more recent, and were deliberately left for people to find.

 

== Video Games ==

** Probably Justified, as {{spoiler|Those Who Came Before}} are shown to have been incredibly advanced, to the point of being [[Clarke's Third Law|beyond human comprehension]].

* Justified/handwaved in ''[[The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind]]''. The abandoned Dwemer settlements, despite being deserted for thousands of years, are filled with running machinery and weapons and armour in perfect condition, however the Dwemer bent/changed the laws of physics to make their materials impervious to wear, tear and corrosion.

* You can't swing a sword in ''[[Final Fantasy]]'' games without hitting a fully functional relic of a lost civilization:

** ''[[Final Fantasy I]]'' has the Sky Warriors, who built a fabulous Floating Castle, robots, and an [[Global Airship|Airship]] before being obliterated by the Fiends. The Castle was abandoned, the robots were left to fend for themselves in the ruins (one of them even fell from the sky and crashed near a waterfall) and the Airship was buried in a desert, and yet everything is in perfect working order by the time the Light Warriors need to use it.

* One part of ''[[Metal Slug|Metal Slug 3D]]'' has Marco fall into decently preserved ruins of an ancient alien civilization... 8 billion years old.

* Averted with glee in ''[[Super Robot Wars]] Alpha Gaiden'', wherein they are teleported to a strange and distant world with a mishmash of technology, only to discover it is their future, some unknown amount of years. Almost nothing from the past has survived but technology specifically sealed in Mountain Cycles, chambers made to maintain whatever is in it indefinitely.

* Justified in ''[[Halo]]''. The eponymous rings are in perfect working condition, but there's robots to upkeep everything, and factories that build robots, etc. The Forerunners built these things to last.

* In ''[[Mega Man ZX]] Advent'', you can find several artifacts from the original ''[[Mega Man (video game)|Mega Man]]'' series, despite the fact that at least 400 years have passed since then. ''[[Mega Man Legends|Legends]]'' seems to play this straight with its underground ruins full of [[Lost Technology]], but later we find out that while the infrastructure that maintains them is severely compromised, it's still there, just hidden from the common people.

* When you get to the sunken city of Thor in ''[[Tales of Phantasia]]'', long since destroyed by a meteor impact, the shield around it is still working perfectly. So by extension, so are the automatic doors, the TV (and video game system) in the pub, an electronic lock and card reader, the security systems, and the main computer Oz. Justified in that the city's power comes from the Spirit of Light, Aska. After the city's been pulled up from underwater, you can free Aska and have her join you. The city systems still somehow work after that, though...

** Technology made by the [[Precursors|Quartz]], ranging from a simple lever-operated door to an entire mobile fortress, works perfectly after 2000 years in ''[[Tales of Hearts]]''.

** You don't want to know what's in the food that leaves it edible 200 years after a nuclear holocaust.

** One point about the game is that it's set in an alternate universe, where on the one hand technology leapt forward while on the other the cultural and societal mores stayed roughly in the 1950s, back before planned obsolescence was part of every car design. (Let's face it: restoring a '55 T-Bird will likely still be possible in 2055. Good luck doing the same for an '05 Mustang.) It doesn't cover two hundred years of decay, but things were designed to last back in the '50s.

'''Pfhor computer terminal:''' The quality of the machinery is quite extraordinary, and most of the computer terminals are still functional even after two thousand years. }}

** Justified, in that {{spoiler|the S'pht have been so advanced for so long that prior to meeting the Pfhor couldn't conceive of non-cybernetic intelligence. They were originally created to serve as servants of the Jjaro, a race so advanced that they could warp entire planets instantly through space millions of years before the game's timeline.}}

** Of course, you've still got facilities/bits of tech built thousands of years before game start ''in working order'' in 3...

** Probably justified, since they already know that the plan will work due to time shenanigans, as the game never really makes up its mind on how the time travel works. It's a minor plot hole in a game riddled with huge ones. Also, it's a Chaos Emerald, the series' go to [[McGuffin]] for any given miracle required. it could probably not only stop itself from being destroyed, but also protect a sleep mode enabled Omega.

* ''[[Eternal Darkness]]'' features the Lost City of Ehn'gha, constructed by a long-dead race that inhabited the Earth before mankind showed up. It's remarkably intact, though it's use as a Guardian colony may have something to do with that. The resident [[Tome of Eldritch Lore]] also manages to survive for longer than your average book would, but then it is protected by Magick.

* A strangely appropriate trope for [[Ragnarok Online]], where the Juperos Ruins and its machinations are still in surprisingly good shape.

** It's more averted in ''Bioshock2'', which shows Rapture or what's left of it in a ''considerably'' more decayed state to the point that it would be a matter of time before the sea reclaims it altogether.

* In [[Metro 2033]], guns and ammo specifically are Ragnarok-proof, to the point that pre-war guns are considered rare and expensive and military-grade ammo from [[After the End|before the end]] is actually the game's currency, as well as being much more effective than post-war "dirty" ammo.

** Possibly justified with the relatively recent End. Thousands upon thousands of rifles dunked in grease and arsenaled by the Soviet Union are in perfect working order to this day, along with ammunition of similar vintage.

* ''[[Portal 2]]'' takes place several hundred years after the end of the first game, with the protagonist having been trapped in the Enrichment Center in [[Human Popsicle|cryogenic stasis]]. It initially looks like an aversion, as the place is rather thoroughly wrecked, but the portal gun still works as do many of the center's mechanisms. In particular, GLaDOS is still around, and once you restore power, she rapidly goes about repairing the facility. Less explicable is how the {{spoiler|original Enrichment Center}}, four kilometers beneath the surface and abandoned before even the first game without the benefits of a caretaker AI, remains functional.

 

== [[Web Comics]] ==

{{quote|'''Vore''': [[What Year Is This?]] How long was I in there?

'''Vanderbeam''': By our estimation, 1420 years.

'''Vore''': Man! The Japanese build things to ''last!'' }}

* [[Sweet and Sour Grapes (webcomic)|Sweet and Sour Grapes]] hangs a lampshade on this trope, with Silas (a ghost) surprised to see how well the ruins of his old home have held up.

 

== [[Western Animation]] ==

** There's also the cryogenics lab where Fry and others throughout the series are frozen. It remains completely functional and undisturbed while the rest of New York appears to get destroyed several times.

*** Justified in that {{spoiler|The niblonians (specifically Nibbler) froze him on purpose and would be watching over him/protecting him so he can save the universe in the future.}}

* The ''[[Justice League]]'' episode "Hereafter" has the JL's orbital Watchtower's communication system still functional after 75 years in a jungle without maintainance. Prior to that, it spent nearly thirty thousand years in Earth orbit before falling. [[Memetic Badass|Even Batman]] can't build 'em ''that'' good. Vandal Savage even lampshades how absurdly well its held up.

* Lampshaded then subverted in ''[[Avatar: The Last Airbender]]''. An ancient, abandoned city is in pretty good shape, but then it turns out the inhabitants still live there, just in hiding. No proofing, just actual upkeep.

== [[Real Life]] ==

* Currently, teams of scientists, linguists, and anthropologists are struggling to properly identify Nuclear Waste burial sites. It sounds simple at first... until you consider the half-life of this crap will [[They Don't Make Them Like They Used To|far out live any facility or structure that contains it]], the memory of what it was, or our descendants' ability to read the warnings on the labels, leaving us [[Neglectful Precursors]] to our own descendants. As an added twist, future archaeologists might successfully decode the labels, just to brush off our warnings as the [[Sealed Evil in a Can|superstitious ramblings of an ancient, underdeveloped culture]]. ''Damn Interesting'' has an [http://www.damninteresting.com/?p=160 article] on the process.

* The [[wikipedia:Long Now Foundation|Long Now Foundation]] intends to build a clock capable of keeping time for 10000 years.

* Don't forget all the time capsules we've buried, some of which are intended to be opened thousands of years in the future, which are deliberately Ragnarok-proofed.

** Children's TV show ''[[Blue Peter]]'' dug up its 1971 time capsule in 2000. Half of its contents had turned to slush. Oops.

* Egyptian tombs were also deliberate attempts at Ragnarok proofing, as the ancient Egyptians believed the body had to remain intact forever for their afterlife to work properly. They didn't have all that much success, at least in the case of the Pharaohs, as the conspicuous and treasure-filled tombs tended to draw robbers. That being said, the mummies themselves, while they aren't exactly full-fleshed, still have some meat on their bones, which is almost achievement enough for any sort of organic material that old.

** Ironically just dropping a body in the sand will preserve it very well as it will dry out and plenty of soft tissue (skin) will survive. Burying a body in a coffin in sand retains enough moisture to let the body rot leaving just bones (both types of actual remains can be seen in the British Museum). Thus the entire mummification process is an attempt to recreate (and improve) the effect of the very simplest form of burial.

* Any object tossed into the vacuum of space can be expected to last a ''long'' time, as there's nothing to erode it except temperature changes, vacuum effects, radiation and micrometeorites. Supposedly, footprints on the Moon could last as long as ten million years if undisturbed (needless to say, more solid things could presumably last a lot longer), and those of the Apollo astronauts are believed to still be there today. Many of our satellites crash from high atmospheric drag once they expend their stationkeeping propellant, but anything in a stable orbit could easily outlast any artifacts on Earth's surface by a long, long time.

* [[wikipedia:Sword of Gou Jian|The Sword of Goujian]] was discovered in December, 1965, untarnished and still possessing a sharp edge, despite the tomb it was discovered in being soaked in water for over two thousand years. This exceptional state of preservation is believed to be due to the airtight scabbard in which the sword was found.

* Don't forget about the Incan ruins, which have lasted so long because they were built to withstand earthquakes.

* There's actually only one reason that everything we make isn't inherently Ragnarok Proof: economics. With our current technology level, we could use supercooled niobium for electrical storage, germanium as a semiconductor in place of silicon, tantalum for capacitors, iridium contacts and casings to resist corrosion, and that's just for simple electronic devices. If we did, they could all survive corrosion by water, air and living things for thousands if not millions of years, many times longer than what we actually use. The only problem is, no one wants to pay a million dollars for a wristwatch that'll outlive them by a million years, particularly when the march of technology, or fashion, ensures that it'll be obsolete long before their own death. Actually, even before our current level of technology, the majority of whatever current technology happens to be can usually be perfected into ultra-long-lasting versions. There are town clock towers still in service, with a bell that chimes every hour, that haven't needed maintenance in over a century; not bad for a craft that's probably only three centuries old. And then there's all of the old buildings mentioned above. If something is engineered to last, it will last; the only question is how long it's worth engineering it to last, since most people aren't too interested in how long something will last beyond their own lifetime. If you supposed that a society ever reached the point where there was no need to ever improve on a certain design and no market factors rationing raw materials, you'd probably find that those things would be built to last forever.

** There's also the matter of whether we actually WANT things to last that long for non-'not caring beyond our lifetime' reasons. A major archaeological 'resource' for telling things about the lives of Classical and pre-Classical people are shards of pottery and the remains of tools, containers and household objects in other words. While our modern day plastic bottles and powertools will probably be of great interest to archaeologists from the year 4000, we specifically recycle what we can and attempt to make what we can't biodegradable as much as possible not because we don't want to leave anything to future generations, but because we want to leave them resources in addition to useless, easily-replaced junk. And said future generations would probably appreciate our attempts to leave them a habitable, clean world rather than an ancient artefact-rich polluted wasteland.

* Provided they're well stored, Some gramophone records are likely to last thousands of years due to being made of vinyl.

* Microfilm and microfiche are resilient information storage technologies, because all that's required to read them is light and a lens.

** Even then they need careful handling and storage as they use gelatin, the stuff used to cultivate moulds and bacteria in Petri dishes.

[[Category:Older Is Better]]

[[Category:Speculative Fiction Tropes]]

[[Category:Apocalyptic Index]]