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Overrated and Underleveled: Difference between revisions
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*** Franklin Payne ([[Gentleman Adventurer]]!) is hyped continent-wide for his famous and daring expeditions. By the time you qualify to invite him, any gunslingers currently in the party could have been better developed and better equipped, and all other character types are more effective in their specialty and still broadly useful. Franklin is a nice chap for such a [[Glory Hound]], and entertaining to listen to, but he's a little late for the [[True Companions]].
* Garland in [[Breath of Fire III]]. The story presents him as a extremely powerful warrior with skills way above the strongest warriors in the world. He always joins the annual Warior Tournament as a solo entry, while the standard is to register a team of three. Balio and Sunder, the duo of the previous two [[Hopeless Boss Fight]] you have, tremble by just being stared hy him. Turns out he eventually joins your party in the third battle against the duo, and after killing them, casually remarks that he was eventually planning of disposing them. Turns out that, in-game wise, he's just the standard [[Mighty Glacier]] character who is easily outranked by Ryu. He has a plethora of Fire spells but his magic is so low that even his strongest spells can't match the power of his standard attack.
* Surprisingly, Char Aznable....sorry, Quattro Bajina, in [[Super Robot Wars Z]] is a variation on this, he's one of the best pilots in the game(He usually is. In fact, here he's probably second in Z only to [[Super Dimension Century Orguss|Kei]] ) but rather than getting his own top of the line mobile suit, he's got the OK Hyaku Shiki, which is not very good compared to the units you get late game. [[Game Breaker|UNLESS you do what many do and put him in the]] ''[[Turn
** Quattro in general really, most prominent in [[Super Robot Wars Alpha]] Gaiden, his stats is some of the worst in comparison Gundam main characters including normal pilots like Kou Uraki and even Loran Cehack. And like in Z, he only get the Hyaku Shiki, and Sazabi is Easy Mode only unit that is decent at best.
* Rather disappointingly enforced by paladin Artix of ''[[Dragon Fable]]'' In his own movie (Artix VS The Undead), Artix was shown to slay hundreds of Undead with a swipe of his sword. In game however {{spoiler|he is a level 3 Paladin who seems weaker than your main character, bar his four-hit Light combo}}.
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** Said special ability (item, actually) was stated to cost a good chunk of an entire nation's budget.
** It should at least be noted that he joins your party for a short while before this, and he's a good 40 levels higher than your party by that point (assuming the player isn't grinding). He drops to around the same level as you when his artes are sealed.
* The ''[[Fire Emblem]]'' series of tactical [[RPG|RPGs]] has more instances of this than can be conveniently listed. The reason is primarily a result of the games' mechanics -- since [[Final Death|death is permanent]] in this series, late recruits exist only to give the careless and the inexperienced a fighting chance in the later levels. As a result, the experienced knights, powerful generals and legendary warriors of the world (who come later in the game) are almost invariably weaker than the rank novices, random mercenaries, and inexperienced students (who join early) raised to the same level. Almost without exception, a character who starts out at level 5 and is raised to level 15 will be far stronger than a character who starts at level 15, even if the character who starts at level 15 is renowned for his peerless strength and skill. (The only exceptions are [[Game Breaker]] units who join on the final chapter of most games.) Too many specific examples to list, but a few are Cecilia, Dayan, Juno, and Niime from ''FE6''; Vaida, Karel, Karla, Renault, and Marcus from ''FE7''; Innes and Duessel from ''FE8''; and Elincia's retainers from ''FE9''. There's actually a bit of [[Fridge Brilliance]] regarding them, as you'll read.
** Karel in particular since in ''Fire Emblem 7'', he is referred to as the "Sword Demon" and his supports with Dart and Karla show how skilled he was, yet a well-leveled Lyndis or Guy can outclass him. In ''Fire Emblem 6'' though, he has actually grown far more but can still be outclassed by Rutger or Fir if leveled correctly.
*** Karel is an [[Eleventh-Hour Superpower]] - he's got the best growth rates, but he can only use it once. You'll notice that in Fire Emblem 7, he joins at a lower level than in Fire Emblem 6, [[Fridge Brilliance|So obviously he was training]].
** Same with Lucia and Bastian, the retainers of Elincia in PoR/RD. While both have excellent growth rates, they also have atrocious base stats for their high levels. The third, Geoffrey, is ironically the lowest leveled despite being the head knight, and his base stats are much better suited to his level.
*** Although, the trope is notably averted with Stefan, who, while a much higher level than the rest of your team at that point, has a stat spread that's more than adequate for his level (except for his paltry Luck score). This trend continues in the sequel, where he's among the last units you recruit in the game, but is no less effective than his fellow swordmasters (still has low Luck, though). It might have to do with his [[Guide Dang It|recruiting requirements.]]
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** Zero, the "Legendary Hero" from ''[[Mega Man Zero]]'', was violently awoken from his 100 year rest and has forgotten most of his fighting techniques. True to his series heritage, he recalls most of his techniques [[Mega Manning|after beating a boss and mimicking its attacks.]]
** Played extremely straight in ''[[Planescape: Torment]]'' - The Nameless One doesn't so much learn new skills as he remembers what his previous incarnations knew... and some of those were ''absurdly powerful''.
* Used in ''[[Knights of the Old Republic]]'': Carth is "one of the Republic's best pilots," "a hero of the Mandalorian War and a legendary soldier." He's only a couple clicks higher than your starting character. Bastila? The paragon of Padawans and key to the war effort - at ''less'' of a starting level than you will be at that point. The "amnesia" excuse shows up to explain why {{spoiler|you, the ex-Dark Lord and galaxy-feared Badass}} are unpowered and a rather pathetic fighter for a few levels. And in the second game, damage and age are used to explain the low starting levels for Canderous and the droids when Exile finds them.
* ''[[Kingdom Hearts]]'' actually zig-zags this trope quite a bit, often starting you at level one with no abilities by putting you in control of a different character, while playing the trope straight and explaining ''why'' it's played so.
** In ''[[Kingdom Hearts: Chain of Memories]]'', Sora enters Castle Oblivion just days after beating the final boss of the first game. If you remember, by then Sora had become quite the capable fighter, but {{spoiler|Marluxia}} informs him that right as he entered Castle Oblivion, he forgot all of his abilities and had to re-learn them. However, at the end of Chain of Memories, Sora is {{spoiler|put to sleep for a year, having his memories also siphoned off during the events of 358/2 days}} and by the events of ''[[Kingdom Hearts II]]'', is level one again and has to re-learn all his magic while also picking up new tricks. [[Fridge Brilliance|It's easy to assume he still knew these; just didn't immediately remember them right off the bat.]]
* Magus from ''[[Chrono Trigger]]'' is an infamous case, as he is an incredibly powerful dark wizard who fights your party frequently, but upon joining your party becomes a run-of-the-mill spellcaster who has to learn all of his Dark spells over again. This is justified by having the game's [[Big Bad]] drain him of most of his power shortly before he joins the heroes, but we all know it's really because [[Good Is Dumb]]...[[Completely Missing the Point|and because the game's easier enough without having a character with six thousand health in a game where the health cap is nine hundred and ninety nine.]]
* In ''[[Neverwinter Nights]]'', the novice players are tasked by Lady Aribeth to defend the city. Aribeth is a legendary fighter and defender of the realm. In a major plot point she later {{spoiler|[[Face Heel Turn|turns heel]] and the players must fight her}}. Fortunately, by this time the players have been adventuring for a few months and any one of them could mop the floor with Aribeth without much difficulty.
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* Justified in ''[[Final Fantasy VII]]'', where Cloud Strife is introduced as SOLDIER First Class, and is clearly much weaker than SOLDIER Third Class, and is only stronger than the regular MP. The reason? {{spoiler|Cloud was ''never'' in SOLDIER, and is repressing his actual past due to trauma and being experimented on by Shinra}}.
** However, by the end of the game, Cloud is, in fact, more powerful than any other SOLDIER, including Sephiroth.
* Continuing with ''[[Final Fantasy IX]]'', we have the character Beatrix. Being the general of an entire army, she can take quite a few hits from the party before she falls, {{spoiler|and in fact [[Heads I Win, Tails You Lose|can't be defeated at all]]}}. However, in the short time you fight alongside her, she is just about as strong as just any other party member, and it shouldn't take more than a few hits to K.O. her. Of course; she doesn't have as much health as she appeared to have .
* ''[[Final Fantasy X]]'' has this occur very blatantly in a plot-relevant [[Mini Game]]: While the original members of your Blitzball team are certainly not the best players out there in the long run, the extremely-hyped, won-the-championship-many-years-in-a-row Luca Goers are a highly competent, tough to beat team... at level 1. They also have pretty much the worst stat growth in the game, rendering them ineffective by the time players' levels are in the teens. The first, story-mandated, match against them needn't be won, which is good because winning largely involves praying they never get the ball, but by the second or third league season, they shouldn't even pose a challenge. The Al Bhed Psyches, on the other hand, start and remain a formidable team, and their starting goalie is a prized recruit for players who seriously pursue Blitzball; however, the story never actually makes much of their abilities, even having them try to win by cheating in a [[Cutscene]]-only match. They're also the first team the pathetic Aurochs defeat in ''ten years'' in the storyline, making it even more confusing once you play them normally.
** Another occurrence in ''[[Final Fantasy X]]'' is Auron. The cutscenes present him as incredibly [[Badass]], and he's already done the whole Pilgrimage thing once, so in all logic would have done the inherent [[Level Grinding]] too. But since he's one of the main characters, he's the same level as everyone else. Of course {{spoiler|coming back as a revanant might have something to do with that.}}
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* In the original ''[[Phantasy Star]]'', your ally Odin has a reputation as a "man of great strength." He's weaker than all your other party members, including the [[Squishy Wizard]].
* Every single character in the ''[[Dawn of War]] II'' campaigns. Tarkus and Avitus are warriors almost as accomplished as the legendary Davian Thule, [[Everyone Calls Him "Barkeep"|the Force Commander]] and Thaddeus are highly successful despite their relatively young age, and Cyrus is older than all of them, ''trained'' most of them, and was even a member of [[Church Militant|The Inquisition]]'s Death Watch. All of them are level 1. ''Chaos Rising'' introduced Jonah (powerful enough to survive direct, solo contact with the Tyranid [[Hive Mind]], yet no stronger than the player), while ''Retribution'' has the former right-hand of the Chapter Master and a Space Marine so renowned he is known only as [[Red Baron|The Ancient]] (level 1 again).
** The fact the Ancient turns out to be {{spoiler|Tarkus}} means he's been afflicted by this trope twice.
** The characters being level 1 holds no actual significance. The first game had no leveling system. Level 1 is only relative, since they are still Space Marines. Also, being in the Death Watch is no significant demonstration of skill. It is not an elite unit, but one put together from multiple units. If you look at the actual Death Watch Kill Team stats from the game, they are basic Space Marines with access to higher grade equipment.
*** Still, the fact that they have to gain experience and "learn" their special abilities/get better equipment fits this trope.
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** Explained away in-game as having to summon the champions every time a new battle starts, creating a fusion of the summoner and champion who has to learn how to use their powers and abilities again. Killing minions and champions presumably assists this process.
* Since the party characters in each timeline of ''[[Radiant Historia]]'' don't overlap 100%, the levels of those characters that don't appear in both timelines tend to lag behind those that do (As all experience gained remains even if you go back and forth in time or change timelines, probably because doing otherwise would have been very difficult to program). This is especially true of Rosch, who isn't playable in a significant fraction of the timeline he ''is'' a member of the party in, what causes him to lag even further behind.
* Ulfric Stormcloak in [[The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim]], should the player pursue the Imperial questline. The game practically turns Ulfric into a king-slaying, [[Loud of War|Thu'um throwing]], [[Memetic Badass]], if dialogue is to be believed. Yet when an Imperial-Alligned Dragonborn storms his castle, his own [[The Dragon|Dragon]] is harder to kill than him. <ref> The meta reason takes this trope literally. In the game, all NPCs are leveled based on when the player first encounters them. And Ulfric is the 3rd character you see in the opening sequence. So, you're essentially fighting what would be a challenging enemy, ''if you were at level 1''.</ref>
* Rodi, one of your three main characters in ''[[Shining the Holy Ark]]'' was the first boss and managed fairly well against the combined might of three "experienced" mercenaries. However we he joins your party he's back down to the low levels. [[Handwaved]] with the fact some rocks falling on his head caused [[Laser-Guided Amnesia|amnesia]].
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