Anti-Hero: Difference between revisions

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** Yami Yuugi from the early manga. Example: A guy steals a playing card from Yuugi. Yami Yuugi comes out to drive him permanently stark raving mad. Whenever he gets out, someone is gonna die or go nuts. Not to mention the fact that he is ''smiling'' as he lights people on fire, condemns them to insanity, etc.
** Yami Yuugi from the early manga. Example: A guy steals a playing card from Yuugi. Yami Yuugi comes out to drive him permanently stark raving mad. Whenever he gets out, someone is gonna die or go nuts. Not to mention the fact that he is ''smiling'' as he lights people on fire, condemns them to insanity, etc.
** Seto Kaiba in the anime, certainly. First he's a villain. Then Yami Yugi does some freaky shit to his mind and he becomes a sympathetic villain who's just trying to save his brother (and his company), and admits to respecting Yugi. Then he gets kidnapped and Yugi and his friends save him and they team up to beat the bad guys. Then he's a kind of antagonist again but he keeps helping Yugi beat the bad guys. Then they all have to team up to beat ''more'' bad guys. Then in the movie he seems to be a bad guy but he's actually a puppet for the [[Big Bad]] and helps Yugi to defeat said Big Bad when he's freed from its control. Then he opens a school to help young people learn to duel. [[Heel Face Revolving Door|Make up your mind, man]]! He's been on one side since day one. [[Yu-Gi-Oh!: The Abridged Series|The side where he can screw the most rules.]]
** Seto Kaiba in the anime, certainly. First he's a villain. Then Yami Yugi does some freaky shit to his mind and he becomes a sympathetic villain who's just trying to save his brother (and his company), and admits to respecting Yugi. Then he gets kidnapped and Yugi and his friends save him and they team up to beat the bad guys. Then he's a kind of antagonist again but he keeps helping Yugi beat the bad guys. Then they all have to team up to beat ''more'' bad guys. Then in the movie he seems to be a bad guy but he's actually a puppet for the [[Big Bad]] and helps Yugi to defeat said Big Bad when he's freed from its control. Then he opens a school to help young people learn to duel. [[Heel Face Revolving Door|Make up your mind, man]]! He's been on one side since day one. [[Yu-Gi-Oh!: The Abridged Series|The side where he can screw the most rules.]]
{{quote| ''He's more like an [[Anti-Hero]], the worst kind of hero there is! They give us villains a good name!''}}
{{quote|''He's more like an [[Anti-Hero]], the worst kind of hero there is! They give us villains a good name!''}}
* Sagara Sousuke from ''[[Full Metal Panic]]'' fits this trope's description pretty well. Somewhat of a [[Heroic Sociopath]], all that really matters to him is Kaname's safety and completing his missions. Empathy and strict moral principles aren't really qualities that fit in to his personality. He is ''definitely'' against [[Save the Villain|saving villains]], has a naturally violent nature and [[Thou Shalt Not Kill|sees absolutely nothing wrong in offing people]] or [[Shoot the Dog|Shooting The Dog]], ''tries'' to be a [[Ineffectual Loner|loner]] (though he tends to [[Magnetic Hero|fail at that]]), is both ''very'' [[Chaste Hero|chaste]] and [[Celibate Hero|celibate]], and has [[Combat Pragmatist|rather dubious combat methods]]. For example, would a normal person turn a theme park mascot into powered armor designed for police use (and lament that he "lost out on one of his investments" when the police doesn't buy it)?
* Sagara Sousuke from ''[[Full Metal Panic]]'' fits this trope's description pretty well. Somewhat of a [[Heroic Sociopath]], all that really matters to him is Kaname's safety and completing his missions. Empathy and strict moral principles aren't really qualities that fit in to his personality. He is ''definitely'' against [[Save the Villain|saving villains]], has a naturally violent nature and [[Thou Shalt Not Kill|sees absolutely nothing wrong in offing people]] or [[Shoot the Dog|Shooting The Dog]], ''tries'' to be a [[Ineffectual Loner|loner]] (though he tends to [[Magnetic Hero|fail at that]]), is both ''very'' [[Chaste Hero|chaste]] and [[Celibate Hero|celibate]], and has [[Combat Pragmatist|rather dubious combat methods]]. For example, would a normal person turn a theme park mascot into powered armor designed for police use (and lament that he "lost out on one of his investments" when the police doesn't buy it)?
* Accelerator from ''[[To Aru Majutsu no Index]]'' becomes this in the Last Order arc.
* Accelerator from ''[[To Aru Majutsu no Index]]'' becomes this in the Last Order arc.
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* Cassie Hack in ''[[Hack Slash]]''. Her motivation is mostly admirable, but her tactics and personality are... not role model material.
* Cassie Hack in ''[[Hack Slash]]''. Her motivation is mostly admirable, but her tactics and personality are... not role model material.
* [[Batman]], [http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=SR2c8r6jgMQ Marvel/DC Happy Hour]:
* [[Batman]], [http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=SR2c8r6jgMQ Marvel/DC Happy Hour]:
{{quote| I may seem like a cool [[Vigilante]] crusading for [[Justice Will Prevail|justice]], but I know myself well enough to know this: I'm one of the [[Crimefighting with Cash|richest]] men in the world, and yet I have absolutely nothing. I'm obsessed, emotionally distant, [[It's Not You, It's My Enemies|incapable of maintaining any kind of relationship]], and when I die, I'll just be an old man with no wife, no children, no family. Because no matter how many times I close my eyes, all I can see is the blood of my parents on my hands. I believe in what I do, but I'm no role model. I wouldn't wish this on anyone. That sound ''cool'' to you, [[Spider-Man|Parker]]?}}
{{quote|I may seem like a cool [[Vigilante]] crusading for [[Justice Will Prevail|justice]], but I know myself well enough to know this: I'm one of the [[Crimefighting with Cash|richest]] men in the world, and yet I have absolutely nothing. I'm obsessed, emotionally distant, [[It's Not You, It's My Enemies|incapable of maintaining any kind of relationship]], and when I die, I'll just be an old man with no wife, no children, no family. Because no matter how many times I close my eyes, all I can see is the blood of my parents on my hands. I believe in what I do, but I'm no role model. I wouldn't wish this on anyone. That sound ''cool'' to you, [[Spider-Man|Parker]]?}}
** Never mind the fact that Batman ''does'' have family. It's even called the Bat-family and stretches from Alfred, to Robin, to Huntress, to Catwoman, to fucking Superman. Batman has the best kind of family, one of chosen friends.
** Never mind the fact that Batman ''does'' have family. It's even called the Bat-family and stretches from Alfred, to Robin, to Huntress, to Catwoman, to fucking Superman. Batman has the best kind of family, one of chosen friends.
*** ''[[Batman Beyond]]'' gives us the image of Bruce Wayne just like that - an old man with no wife, no children, and no family except for his dog.
*** ''[[Batman Beyond]]'' gives us the image of Bruce Wayne just like that - an old man with no wife, no children, and no family except for his dog.
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* [[Moon Knight]], occasional hero, frequently just a crazy bastard.
* [[Moon Knight]], occasional hero, frequently just a crazy bastard.
* Shadow, from [[Sonic the Hedgehog (comics)|Archie Sonic comics]]. [[Lampshade Hanging|Lampshaded]] in issue #133.
* Shadow, from [[Sonic the Hedgehog (comics)|Archie Sonic comics]]. [[Lampshade Hanging|Lampshaded]] in issue #133.
{{quote| '''Eggman''': Shadow? What do you want?<br />
{{quote|'''Eggman''': Shadow? What do you want?
'''Shadow''': Your death, Eggman. I'm going to snap you like a twig, then use you for kindling.<br />
'''Shadow''': Your death, Eggman. I'm going to snap you like a twig, then use you for kindling.
'''Eggman''': Not if I avoid you like the... devil? Wait a second! Good guys [[Thou Shalt Not Kill|don't kill]]! Isn't there a [[Recycled in Space|hedgehog moral code]]?<br />
'''Eggman''': Not if I avoid you like the... devil? Wait a second! Good guys [[Thou Shalt Not Kill|don't kill]]! Isn't there a [[Recycled in Space|hedgehog moral code]]?<br />
'''Shadow''': Sonic holds such beliefs. Then again, he's a hero, I'm not. }}
'''Shadow''': Sonic holds such beliefs. Then again, he's a hero, I'm not. }}
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** {{spoiler|Unfortunately, the group Joshua Carver kills off was so vitally connected to the world and its affairs that everything goes straight to hell, literally and figuratively. So it is painfully clear that [[Failure Is the Only Option]]}}.
** {{spoiler|Unfortunately, the group Joshua Carver kills off was so vitally connected to the world and its affairs that everything goes straight to hell, literally and figuratively. So it is painfully clear that [[Failure Is the Only Option]]}}.
* Cynosure's resident go-to guy, Grimjack is willing to do whatever needs to be done to do a job. But despite his gruff exterior, he has a soft spot for people who had the same kind of troubles he had in his past, and has been known to let a deserving person slip out. In the end, he will end up doing the right thing.
* Cynosure's resident go-to guy, Grimjack is willing to do whatever needs to be done to do a job. But despite his gruff exterior, he has a soft spot for people who had the same kind of troubles he had in his past, and has been known to let a deserving person slip out. In the end, he will end up doing the right thing.
{{quote| The name's John Gaunt, a.k.a. Grimjack, and I'm the guy you hire when you need an asshole on your side.}}
{{quote|The name's John Gaunt, a.k.a. Grimjack, and I'm the guy you hire when you need an asshole on your side.}}
* All ''[[The Metabarons]]''. Steelhead in particular tends more towards [[Villain Protagonist]] in his darker moments.
* All ''[[The Metabarons]]''. Steelhead in particular tends more towards [[Villain Protagonist]] in his darker moments.
* Jason Todd, The Red Hood, could be considered an antihero.
* Jason Todd, The Red Hood, could be considered an antihero.
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== Literature ==
== Literature ==
* Severus Snape from [[J. K. Rowling]]'s ''[[Harry Potter (novel)|Harry Potter]]'' novels. He's a bastard, a known former Death Eater...and Harry never quite knows which side he's on until the final chapters of the last book. JK Rowling, when asked if she thought Snape a hero, said:
* Severus Snape from [[J. K. Rowling]]'s ''[[Harry Potter (novel)|Harry Potter]]'' novels. He's a bastard, a known former Death Eater...and Harry never quite knows which side he's on until the final chapters of the last book. JK Rowling, when asked if she thought Snape a hero, said:
{{quote| '''JK Rowling:''' Yes, I do; though a very flawed hero. An anti-hero, perhaps. He is not a particularly likeable man in many ways. He remains rather cruel, a bully, riddled with bitterness and insecurity — and yet he loved, and showed loyalty to that love and, ultimately, {{spoiler|laid down his life because of it}}. That’s pretty heroic!}}
{{quote|'''JK Rowling:''' Yes, I do; though a very flawed hero. An anti-hero, perhaps. He is not a particularly likeable man in many ways. He remains rather cruel, a bully, riddled with bitterness and insecurity — and yet he loved, and showed loyalty to that love and, ultimately, {{spoiler|laid down his life because of it}}. That’s pretty heroic!}}
** Sirius Black probably counts as well - even though he's a [[Team Dad]] and a generally nice, though [[Knight in Sour Armor|cynical]] man.
** Sirius Black probably counts as well - even though he's a [[Team Dad]] and a generally nice, though [[Knight in Sour Armor|cynical]] man.
* The outlaw protagonists of ''[[Water Margin]]'', and especially Song Jiang.
* The outlaw protagonists of ''[[Water Margin]]'', and especially Song Jiang.
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* The protagonist of William Barton's ''[[wikipedia:When Heaven Fell|When Heaven Fell]]''.
* The protagonist of William Barton's ''[[wikipedia:When Heaven Fell|When Heaven Fell]]''.
* In Steven Brust's ''[[Dragaera]]'' novels, Vladimir [[Taltos]], an assassin for a criminal outfit who has been known to destroy souls ''on accident''. Lampshaded in ''Issola'':
* In Steven Brust's ''[[Dragaera]]'' novels, Vladimir [[Taltos]], an assassin for a criminal outfit who has been known to destroy souls ''on accident''. Lampshaded in ''Issola'':
{{quote| ''Better watch out. These things are cold-blooded killers.''<br />
{{quote|''Better watch out. These things are cold-blooded killers.''
''I hate to say this, but so are you, boss.''<br />
''I hate to say this, but so are you, boss.''
''Yeah, but I'm a nice guy.'' }}
''Yeah, but I'm a nice guy.'' }}
* John Taylor of the Nightside novel series can accuratly be described by this trope since in his world [[Might Makes Right|power and reputation is everything]] he wont hesitate to kill someone in a brutal or cruel way to uphold his reputation because the baddies are hesitant to attack if their scared shitless. He's a nice guy but still not at all that nice and he isnt exactly [[Incorruptible Pure Pureness|Mr.Mercy]] and certainly not [[Too Good for This Sinful Earth]] and though he may be powerful he aint Superman so he cant afford to have his enemies think hes weak.
* John Taylor of the Nightside novel series can accuratly be described by this trope since in his world [[Might Makes Right|power and reputation is everything]] he wont hesitate to kill someone in a brutal or cruel way to uphold his reputation because the baddies are hesitant to attack if their scared shitless. He's a nice guy but still not at all that nice and he isnt exactly [[Incorruptible Pure Pureness|Mr.Mercy]] and certainly not [[Too Good for This Sinful Earth]] and though he may be powerful he aint Superman so he cant afford to have his enemies think hes weak.
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** Malcolm Reynolds demonstrates a mixture of altruism and ruthlessness, along with a powerful loyalty to his crew. When a defeated opponent [[The Last Thing You Ever See|threatens to hunt down and kill Mal]] -- and by extension, [[Band of Brothers|Mal's crew]] -- Mal's response is to kick him into the engine of his ship. He is glad to make use of [[The Woobie|River's]] [[Psychic Powers]], bringing her along on dangerous jobs, but at the same time is willing to [[Honor Before Reason|risk his life to keep her safe]]. He has no problems returning a cargo of critical medicines he's stolen once he realizes how badly they are needed, but also has no issue with gunning down murderers and war criminals in cold blood.
** Malcolm Reynolds demonstrates a mixture of altruism and ruthlessness, along with a powerful loyalty to his crew. When a defeated opponent [[The Last Thing You Ever See|threatens to hunt down and kill Mal]] -- and by extension, [[Band of Brothers|Mal's crew]] -- Mal's response is to kick him into the engine of his ship. He is glad to make use of [[The Woobie|River's]] [[Psychic Powers]], bringing her along on dangerous jobs, but at the same time is willing to [[Honor Before Reason|risk his life to keep her safe]]. He has no problems returning a cargo of critical medicines he's stolen once he realizes how badly they are needed, but also has no issue with gunning down murderers and war criminals in cold blood.
*** Mal acknowledges his position on the Sliding Scale when he wins a duel against a "gentleman", and [[To the Pain|has the humiliated man on the ground, at his mercy]].
*** Mal acknowledges his position on the Sliding Scale when he wins a duel against a "gentleman", and [[To the Pain|has the humiliated man on the ground, at his mercy]].
{{quote| "Mercy is the mark of a great man." *pokes with sword* "Guess I'm just a good man." *stab* "Well, I'm all right."}}
{{quote|"Mercy is the mark of a great man." *pokes with sword* "Guess I'm just a good man." *stab* "Well, I'm all right."}}
** Then there's Jayne Cobb, though he's arguably more of a [[Heroic Comedic Sociopath]].
** Then there's Jayne Cobb, though he's arguably more of a [[Heroic Comedic Sociopath]].
** Most of Mal's crew fits under this, and they're saved from being [[Designated Hero|Designated Protagonists]] by way of [[Honor Before Reason]]. Sure, they may be petty criminals working under the radar of a [[Lawful Evil]] government, but they at least make an effort to do the right thing.
** Most of Mal's crew fits under this, and they're saved from being [[Designated Hero|Designated Protagonists]] by way of [[Honor Before Reason]]. Sure, they may be petty criminals working under the radar of a [[Lawful Evil]] government, but they at least make an effort to do the right thing.
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* Team [[Leverage]]: Running down the list, we have an [[The Alcoholic|alco]][[Off the Wagon|holic]] ex-insurance agent who [[The Chessmaster|plans and runs cons]], a [[Con Man|grifter]], a [[Genius Bruiser|hitter]] with a ''[[The Atoner|very]]'' [[The Atoner|dark past]], a [[The Cracker|computer hacker]], and a [[Impossible Thief|world-class cat burglar]]. [[They Fight Crime]] and are heroes to many people, but their methods are less than legal, and have involved hurting some innocent folks, as well.
* Team [[Leverage]]: Running down the list, we have an [[The Alcoholic|alco]][[Off the Wagon|holic]] ex-insurance agent who [[The Chessmaster|plans and runs cons]], a [[Con Man|grifter]], a [[Genius Bruiser|hitter]] with a ''[[The Atoner|very]]'' [[The Atoner|dark past]], a [[The Cracker|computer hacker]], and a [[Impossible Thief|world-class cat burglar]]. [[They Fight Crime]] and are heroes to many people, but their methods are less than legal, and have involved hurting some innocent folks, as well.
* The titular character from [[Sherlock]]. Sure, he assists the police rather than criminals, but he makes it very clear that his primary motivation is to solve cases and relieve boredom, not to do the world any kind of good.
* The titular character from [[Sherlock]]. Sure, he assists the police rather than criminals, but he makes it very clear that his primary motivation is to solve cases and relieve boredom, not to do the world any kind of good.
{{quote| '''Sherlock''': I may be on the side of the angels, but don't think for one second that I am one of them.}}
{{quote|'''Sherlock''': I may be on the side of the angels, but don't think for one second that I am one of them.}}




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* Kain from ''[[Legacy of Kain]]'' is generally considered an anti-hero, having apparently doomed the world and subjugated the human race to the point of extinction, but apparently did so since the original choice would have doomed the world either way and is technically trying to save the world.
* Kain from ''[[Legacy of Kain]]'' is generally considered an anti-hero, having apparently doomed the world and subjugated the human race to the point of extinction, but apparently did so since the original choice would have doomed the world either way and is technically trying to save the world.
* ''[[Max Payne (series)|Max Payne]]'' eventually comes out as a hero (at least in the first game...), but he freely acknowledges that he's not trying to be a good guy about a quarter of the way through the first game. He's way beyond trying to do something good, and is only doing what's left.
* ''[[Max Payne (series)|Max Payne]]'' eventually comes out as a hero (at least in the first game...), but he freely acknowledges that he's not trying to be a good guy about a quarter of the way through the first game. He's way beyond trying to do something good, and is only doing what's left.
{{quote| '''Max''': There was no glory in this. I hadn't asked for this crap. Trouble had come to me in big dark swarms. The good and the just were like gold dust in this city. I had no illusions. ''I was not one of them''. I was no hero. Just me and the the gun and the crook. My options had decreased to a singular course.}}
{{quote|'''Max''': There was no glory in this. I hadn't asked for this crap. Trouble had come to me in big dark swarms. The good and the just were like gold dust in this city. I had no illusions. ''I was not one of them''. I was no hero. Just me and the the gun and the crook. My options had decreased to a singular course.}}
** He also acknowledges, indirectly, his own choices and course in his life with a simple line in Max Payne 2:
** He also acknowledges, indirectly, his own choices and course in his life with a simple line in Max Payne 2:
{{quote| '''Max''': Shooting a gun is a binary choice: either you pull the trigger or you don't.}}
{{quote|'''Max''': Shooting a gun is a binary choice: either you pull the trigger or you don't.}}
* Shadow the Hedgehog in all the games he's been in, though first appearing as an enemy in ''[[Sonic Adventure 2]]'', became a [[Villain Decay|mere rival of Sonic's]] in later games.
* Shadow the Hedgehog in all the games he's been in, though first appearing as an enemy in ''[[Sonic Adventure 2]]'', became a [[Villain Decay|mere rival of Sonic's]] in later games.
** Team Chaotix from the same series. They'll do good, but they expect to be paid-handsomely. Of course, Vector at least has his better moments, such as finding a kid's lost toy for free.
** Team Chaotix from the same series. They'll do good, but they expect to be paid-handsomely. Of course, Vector at least has his better moments, such as finding a kid's lost toy for free.
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* Zero from the Megaman Zero series toes the line on this, as he isn't afraid to kill whatever stands between him and his goal; even his girlfriend, Iris, although the event scarred him mentally. As he said in Megaman Zero 4, "I never cared about justice, and I don't ever recall calling myself a hero... I have always only fought for the people that I believe in. I won't hesitate... If an enemy appears before me, I will destroy it!"
* Zero from the Megaman Zero series toes the line on this, as he isn't afraid to kill whatever stands between him and his goal; even his girlfriend, Iris, although the event scarred him mentally. As he said in Megaman Zero 4, "I never cared about justice, and I don't ever recall calling myself a hero... I have always only fought for the people that I believe in. I won't hesitate... If an enemy appears before me, I will destroy it!"
* In the flash game series ''Sonny'', the titular protagonist is one of these, only saving a mountain village from a cult in exchange for finding his way to a town on a map in the second game. When he first meets the guy who offered to help him perform the above task, his response is along the lines of "Get out my way or die". He also helps out a fellow zombie in the first game who was trying to fight off humans that chase him, immediately fights soldiers in revenge when they shoot and kill someone helping him at the beginning, and hesitates when a traveling companion suggests that they kill a human warrior [[Enemy Mine|that just helped them against a common threat]].
* In the flash game series ''Sonny'', the titular protagonist is one of these, only saving a mountain village from a cult in exchange for finding his way to a town on a map in the second game. When he first meets the guy who offered to help him perform the above task, his response is along the lines of "Get out my way or die". He also helps out a fellow zombie in the first game who was trying to fight off humans that chase him, immediately fights soldiers in revenge when they shoot and kill someone helping him at the beginning, and hesitates when a traveling companion suggests that they kill a human warrior [[Enemy Mine|that just helped them against a common threat]].
{{quote| '''Veradux''': Alright, {{spoiler|the Baron's}} gone. Let's kill this whoopy superhero and leave!<br />
{{quote|'''Veradux''': Alright, {{spoiler|the Baron's}} gone. Let's kill this whoopy superhero and leave!
'''Sonny''': But why? He helped us.<br />
'''Sonny''': But why? He helped us.
'''Veradux''': Listen Sonny. [[Humans Are Bastards|To them, we're monsters.]] Now we can either be alive monsters, or dead ones. You choose. }}
'''Veradux''': Listen Sonny. [[Humans Are Bastards|To them, we're monsters.]] Now we can either be alive monsters, or dead ones. You choose. }}
** Given [[Crapsack World|the setting,]] the other party members are antiheroes as well, one example being outlined above.
** Given [[Crapsack World|the setting,]] the other party members are antiheroes as well, one example being outlined above.
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* ''[[Ronin Galaxy]]'': Cecil, despite having all the optimism and badassery that ideal heroes ought to, he only keeps that up for as long as it’s convenient (or safe) for him to do. When he’s outmatched he has no problem with {{spoiler|kicking his opponent in the [http://www.roningalaxy.com/comics/chapter-1/page-36/ crotch.]}}
* ''[[Ronin Galaxy]]'': Cecil, despite having all the optimism and badassery that ideal heroes ought to, he only keeps that up for as long as it’s convenient (or safe) for him to do. When he’s outmatched he has no problem with {{spoiler|kicking his opponent in the [http://www.roningalaxy.com/comics/chapter-1/page-36/ crotch.]}}
* Riff from ''[[Sluggy Freelance]]'' is in many ways a [[Badass]] who saves his friends and the world at large from aliens, vampires, and the like. Thing is, thanks to his [[Mad Scientist]] experiments and reckless behavior, he's probably endangered the human race more times than he's protected it. What else do you call a hero who's on record saying this?
* Riff from ''[[Sluggy Freelance]]'' is in many ways a [[Badass]] who saves his friends and the world at large from aliens, vampires, and the like. Thing is, thanks to his [[Mad Scientist]] experiments and reckless behavior, he's probably endangered the human race more times than he's protected it. What else do you call a hero who's on record saying this?
{{quote| '''Riff:''' "I literally summon demons to keep myself from buying a shotgun and permanently emptying a Taco Bell!"}}
{{quote|'''Riff:''' "I literally summon demons to keep myself from buying a shotgun and permanently emptying a Taco Bell!"}}
* Special mention needs to go to Abbey from ''[[Gnoph]]''.
* Special mention needs to go to Abbey from ''[[Gnoph]]''.
* In ''[[Dan and Mab's Furry Adventures]]'', Abel's side story has Devin, who has a tragic past which constisted of his father walking out him and his mother and his mother's last words being how much she wanted to kill him. He now spends his time protecting travelers in the forest wheter they want to be or not. He is a [[Deadpan Snarker]] and in his own words "an asshole". {{spoiler|Pity he was killed off... until he came back as an undead.}}
* In ''[[Dan and Mab's Furry Adventures]]'', Abel's side story has Devin, who has a tragic past which constisted of his father walking out him and his mother and his mother's last words being how much she wanted to kill him. He now spends his time protecting travelers in the forest wheter they want to be or not. He is a [[Deadpan Snarker]] and in his own words "an asshole". {{spoiler|Pity he was killed off... until he came back as an undead.}}