Dragon Ball GT/Headscratchers: Difference between revisions

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* GT is perhaps one of the few shows with a '''Gainax Beginning'''. First and most important, why is Pilaf even alive? Considering all that happened in Z, he should have been killed by Buu and not revived later. No Pilaf, NO GT!
** '''Gainax Beginning, Gainax Middle, Gainax Ending'''. Does DBGT stand for Dragon Ball, '''Gainax Tour'''? Well, Look around.
* Goku's skin tone has completely changed to a very tanned complexion for no reason. Nobody else seems to have had any such issues.
* Why did Goku lose his instant transmission technique when he was turned into a child? Apart from being a convenient way of justifying the "Grand Tour", why could he only use it as a Super Saiyan 4?
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* What does being in a smaller body have to do with losing the ability for Instant Transmission, Goku? An [[Ass Pull]] only to be restored later by another Instant Aging [[Ass Pull]] with Super Saiyan 4?* GT doesn't even make sense on the relative strengths of the characters. When Kaioshin wants to restore Goku's power, Old Kaioshin tells him there's no way he can replenish the energy supply of a Super Saiyan 4. But next episode we see 3 Super Saiyans and a normal Pan do precisely just that, all of whom shouldn't even add up to Super Saiyan 2! I mean it should reasonably take at least 10000 of them to match the power of a Super Saiyan 4.
** It gets worse in the Shadow Dragon saga where just the 3 Super Saiyans alone have enough energy to ''overload Goku'' '''beyond his normal Super Saiyan 4 limits''', never mind that GT shows him to be far stronger than all of them in '''base form'''!!
* This is another one on Power Levels. Kid Goku in '''base form''' beats Rildo's base and claims it was stronger than Buu!!?? That's an increase beyond Super Saiyan 3! And so Kid Goku being stronger than 2 Super Saiyan 2s? In DBZ, after seven years of afterlife training, Goku's real boost came from Super Saiyan 2 and 3. His Super Saiyan form was only marginally stronger in Buu Saga and the exponential power growth in any level more or less stopped once he mastered it.
** Speaking of Rildo, if he's stronger than Buu, then how do you reconcile that with what happened in Z. I mean are the Kais not even remotely worried about the fate of the universe?
** Super Saiyan Goku seems to be absurdly stronger than what the Super Saiyan level itself ought to permit. On the other side we have Vegeta, who in spite of all his training is somehow far weaker at Super Saiyan 2 and goes out in one shot against Super 17!
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* Why was Majuub not able to beat super 17 all my himself? Both half of super 17 are weaker than ssj2 and both half of majuub are about ssj3 level.you do the math something doesn't add up.And yet Goku as ssj1 did better than him when fighting super 17 .looks like only Goku benefited from all that training they did.
* Isn't there any way to destroy the dragonballs without killing their creator? Can't Piccolo just deactivate the black star Dragonballs, or at the very least modify them? How come he just forgot about them like that? In that case, the whole plot in DBZ of getting Dende to be Earth's guardian would be totally unnecessary, wouldn't it?
* For some reason, characters in GT, while stronger in theory than Z in fact seem much weaker when you compare the intensity of the fights to DBZ.
** I must say I disagree with this point completely - the fact they are more powerful is ''why'' the fights are less intense. They now do so much damage with each punch; cause so many injuries with one ki wave that the battles are over far quicker. Lets take a real life example: World War 1. Our lack of technology, tactical planning, foresight and abundance of manpower still led to the second most devastating war in history, stalemating into four years of trench warfare. ''Now,'' imagine if you will, what would would happen if [[WW 1]] was repeated in the 21st century? ''nuclear warfare.'' I can guarantee the main battle wouldn't last four years just as I can guarantee if you put the Dragonball GT era Z Fighters against any of the Dragonball Z era enemies it wouldn't have been a Saga-spanning 30 episode battle.
** It's the intensity of the battles and the collateral damage it just doesn't add up to things like Goku's base being now as strong as Majin Buu. Most of the fights with the Shadow Dragons for one. Omega fires blasts strong enough to blast both the Super Saiyans out of their senses, they end up flying into buildings where they barely break the glass. Also Frieza lifted far bigger things than Goku did as a Super Saiyan 4. Contrast that to the other headscratcher about the fight with Android 17, which seems to be almost exaggerated by comparison. No it doesn't seem like nuclear war to [[WW 1]].
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*** It has more gravity on the surface. The planet could be much denser than Earth but also much smaller, giving it a smaller mass. This would give it larger gravity on the surface but less of a pull at long distances.
* Mr. Buu turns Satan and Pan into candy and ''eats them to keep them safe''(!!??) inside him so they can get to planet Vegeta. But even more, Mr. Satan seems to be quite ok and even speaks as a piece of candy. Who was the only one powerful enough to do things like that before? '''Vegetto'''... What?
** I'm going to guess the handwave here is that because Buu ''wants'' him to retain his free will as a candy; Hercule has no problem whatsoever in doing it. You could also say that seeing as Vegetto was transformed by Super Buu fused with Gohan/Piccolo/Trunks/Goten as opposed to the relatively weak fat Buu it's far easier to resist whatever magics are behind this technique. For the record I agree with you that it's another one of GT's notorious plot holes but if you stretch credibility to breaking point it ''is'' possible to explain this in-universe.
* The fight with Super 17 is grossly exaggerated in effects compared to all the other fights in the DB universe. One punch from Goku throws Super 17 to ''the other side of the planet'' and one from the android sends him into space and beyond. Ki blasts are now able to circumnavigate the globe. Compare this with the Shadow Dragon saga where Super Saiyan 4 Goku is trying to run for his life from Omega Shenron's blasts just powerful enough to blow up parts of the roller coaster in an amusement park.
* Anyone noticed that once 4 Super Saiyans restore Goku's Super Saiyan 4 power, he has no injuries on him, despite the fact that he was badly hurt just moments before?
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** And they're only saved by [[Deus Ex Machina]] raining down and shorting him out. Absolutely disgraceful.
* When the Shadown Dragons are released, the rest of the cast goes home without so much as an offer to help and it's all up to Goku to go fight them? Were they happily taking a nap when he was fighting 6 out of 7 dragons all by himself?
* Shadow Dragon Saga. [[New Powers as the Plot Demands|How did Goku's eyesight just come back by itself all of a sudden?]]
* Yamcha has said several times he wanted to get married more then anything else, got giddy at the thought of starting a family as late as the Android saga, and Future Trunks briefly mentions that Yamcha finds a new love in his timeline. With these things in mind why is Yamcha consistently shown to be single, even shown to be living alone in Diablo Desert with Puar back in [[Dragon Ball GT]]? Are we to believe that Yamcha just gave up on his lifelong dream in addition to already giving up on Martial arts?
** [[Canon Discontinuity|The canonicity of DBGT is debatable]]. At the end of the Cell Saga Yamcha mentions a girlfriend, so he was not single. Maybe he was unlucky and they broke up during the timeskip (since she's never seen nor mentioned again).
* The 10x Super Kamehameha isn't very consistent. It started out as two blue spheres combined into one (actually this makes it less powerful than charging an attack with two hands together). And while it does nothing to hurt Baby at first, after Baby's fired an equally powerful blast at Goku and knocked him flat, it suddenly kicks in and attacks him from inside out, trashing him. If the dub line is to be believed, Goku was expecting all this to happen. What in the world was that all about?
** And then later in the series turns into this orange red beam.
* The level of collateral damage just doesn't add up to the characters' power levels and the energy they ought to be putting into their attacks. In most cases, they're actually causing less damage on the Earth then most fights in Z. I can understand the [[So Last Season]] thing in Dragonball Z, but this is going beyond all reason.
* The more you look at GT, the worse it gets. In the last episode we see Yamcha in the desert and Tien and Chaoutzu training off near a waterfall. Oh yeah, they were totally not bothered by all that happened in the Baby Saga, being possessed, the earth exploding, Super 17 and the Dimensional Collapse and all the villains leaving hell, and least of all the Shadow Dragons and all that negative energy around the globe. Talk about throwing in the towel. GT just forgot they were even there!
* How the hell did Dr. Gero and Dr. Myu manage to make a perfect copy of 17? In hell?!?
* Why didn't everyone use the Blutz Wave Generator, shouldn't Bulma have given everyone a chance after seeing what it did to Vegeta? I don't get why she'd use it on Shenron when she could've covertly enhanced everyone with steroid waves.
** At the very least she could have used it to restore Goku's and Vegeta's energies for another fusion. But no.
* Just what happened to Gohan's Mystic power-up when GT rolled around? Did he lose it when he got pulled out of Buu? It just faded away? He was just damn uninterested in fighting anymore when he grew up?
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** IIRC, the Black Star balls were Kami's Dragon Balls, beta version, with one giant drawback. Of course, how one could figure out that drawback without a planet or three going "Boom"... [[Bellisario's Maxim|let's just not examine this too closely.]]
** If ''I'' remember correctly, Pilaf said they were made before the split. Besides, if they were solo Kami's, then the balls would be inert, since by that time, Kami has long since fused with Piccolo.
** Also, Pilaf's an idiot.
*** You don't need to be Kami to make the balls, you just need to be from the Dragon Clan. Guru wasn't Kami of anything, if you recall. That explains why the Black Star balls were active after Kami had fused with Piccolo, because that was his original state when he created the balls
**** The Black Star balls were made by the Nameless Namek; they became inert when he split into Kami and King Piccolo. Remember Piccolo Jr ceased to exist after the Cell saga from a biological point of view - as far as the balls are concerned he is the original creator. ''It's clearly said in the episode they appear''. Incidentally it actually makes perfect sense from a real world perspective; the Nameless Namek was as strong as Android 17 AKA a thousand times stronger than Guru or Kami. Makes sense his Dragon Balls would be stronger in every single way.
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* How was it that Pilaf,Shu,and Mai was able to hold Goku off long enough to summon Black Star Shenlong? I know Goku was tired after fighting ubb.but he and uub was able to heavily damage the lookout while in The Hyperbolic Time Chamber IN BASE FORM Without the need to punch dimensional holes through it like gotenk and majin buu,Yet couldn't beat pilaf and his mooks in under 30 seconds? Mr.popo alone could have handle them. as meantion before Why Mr.popo and Dende didn't try to get back the Black Star Dragonballs while Goku was fighting them? they just stood there!
* How is it that Android 18, after lecturing Super 17 on his "cowardice" for allowing mad doctors to decide his actions, witnessing his clear look of turmoil over it, and seeing him finally snap and kill Dr. Myu after the latter runs his mouth, never actually thinks about trying to convince her brother to stand down? We could've seen a [[Heel Face Turn]] which would produce a very valuable ally that could've come in handy for the final arc so that Goku didn't have to do 90% of everything. (Wait, maybe I just answered my own question…)
** That you did. Dragon Ball GT was designed to make Goku the hero and everyone else seem like losers. At the end of Z Gohan and Gotenks were the strongest fighters in existence. Come GT and instead of expanding their characters, the writers pull Super Saiyan 4 out of their ass which just happens to make everything and everyone before it look redundant. Even after other Super Saiyan 4's appeared he was ''still'' responsible for the killing blow against the most powerful enemy in history. And what was the final shot of the series? Goku the only Z Fighter alive. Basically the writers sought out anyone or anything as strong as Goku and ground it under their heels.
*** Wait... Wouldn't SSJ3 Goku be just as strong as, if not stronger than, SSJ3 Gotenks? Not just that, but Vegito was far outclassing Super Buu after it absorbed Gohan (who recently had his full potential unlocked), even before turning into a Super Saiyan. Plus, even without the Potara, Goku and Vegeta could still fuse into Gogeta via Fusion Dance, if Goku could convince Vegeta to...
**** SSJ Gotenks was roughly even/superior to SS3 Goku. Goku was scared to fight Super Buu, and SS3 Gotenks dominated him. SS3 Goku is nowhere near SS3 Gotenks. Base Vegetto beating Super Buu w/Gohan is filler, in the manga he turns Super Saiyan immediately.
**** I agree with the previous poster - Gohan and Gotenks ''were'' the strongest fighters at the end of Z. There is absolutely no evidence outside of the movies that Vegeta knew and/or could perform the fusion dance reliably before GT which takes Gogeta out of the equation, the Potara earrings were destroyed meaning that Vegetto was for all intents and purposes dead and Gohan, already as powerful as Super Buu, still had both his Full Power and Super Saiyan 2 transformations in reserve. Fact is, Goku got ''lucky'' against Kid Buu. If it wasn't for the Spirit Bomb and his health boost from Porunga Goku would have been annihilated.
***** Wasn't it stated that the Fusion Earrings lead to a stronger form than Fusion Dance did? So even if Gotenks reached [[SS 3]], wouldn't Vegito still be classified as the strongest being in (canonical) DB lore?
* The last part of our [[Gainax Ending]]. Goku has no tail if you observe. Only God knows why. Whether he's even alive or dead is also a big mystery.
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* The Shadow Dragon Saga again. While fighting against Naturon Shenron, Goku ''has trouble pushing a building in base form''. And he's supporting the entire weight of it by pressing against ''window glass'', so yeah, it must be [[Made Of Unobtanium]], if not at least very strong glass. Then he has to go to Super Saiyan 4 just to lift it, which he and Piccolo or anyone else could have done waaaaaaayyyy back in DBZ's ''Saiyan Saga''.
* Why did Goku age back to adulthood when in SSJ4 form? Was it just [[Rule of Cool]], or did it have an in-universe justification?
** If I recall correctly, it was because his Super Saiyan 4 form was stronger than the Red Shenron. That may just have been [[Fanon]], though.
*** Which is itself a pretty bland [[Hand Wave]]. There's no way for the Nameless Namek to be stronger than Goku SSJ3, or else Piccolo should have been able to fight with Fat Buu. I guess it's another [[Plot Hole]] for [[Dragon Ball GT]].
**** Not really. Shenron can't affect anyone who's stronger than its creator, but was it ever stated that the Black Star Shenron had the same limitation? It could be that, as an unofficial (non-Kami/Guru/Planetary Sponsor) dragon with ''huge'' drawbacks, it could affect anyone who wasn't stronger than ''itself''. That's starting to get close to [[Fan Wank]], however, and is completely invalid if it was stated to have the same limitation and completely moot if it was a different reason.
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* After fusing with Buu, Uub now has all the powers of Majin Buu, so why can't he heal Goku (who's been blinded by Ice Shenron) if he can at least heal himself? He doesn't even have to restore his energy, just get his eyes back up and functioning.
 
* [[Gainax Ending]]: The ending, the biggest Headscratcher of 'em all not including the beginning. In retrospect, it's so sudden and bizarre that it's nothing short of a [[Mind Screw]]. What happened to Goku in the last 2 episodes? He's clearly dead from that huge energy ball, then suddenly he's alive again somehow able to talk to everybody on earth, then when he's charging the spirit bomb he cannot be killed by Omega at all, despite direct hits (Wasn't that the spirit bomb's weakest point?). We're not even sure if he's dead or [[Back Fromfrom the Dead]] because there's not even a halo to give us any idea (How that is even possible under the circumstances is itself a mystery). Then after the bomb's thrown, he's dead again, apparently brought back to life, then suddenly he just leaves without even saying goodbye. Vegeta knows something's up, then suddenly we see his clothes left on the ground. But in DBZ when [[No Body Left Behind|they die]], they die with their clothes (In fact, that shot is ''out of sequence'' and is shown after the end of the next couple of events). But then he's off to visit Roshi and Piccolo, who both also know something's changed about him, but a mere "Are you...?" [[Shrug of God|is not very helpful]]. When they take their eyes off him for a second, there's suddenly no one there. Then the Dragonballs merge into Goku, then he disappears. Where does he go? Why did he have to go? Was there no other alternative? What happened to him?
** He doesn't return for 100 years, and if you leave aside what you saw in A Hero's legacy, it's not clear if he's alive or dead. Theories include [[Ascended to A Higher Plane of Existence]] or that Goku became Shenron himself. And is he isn't even remotely bothered by the fact that almost everyone he knew is dead.
** A Hero's legacy was made earlier just after the Baby Saga and they intended Goku to be clearly dead and be the Spirit Advisor to Goku Jr. At that time, no had any idea how GT was going to end or just how they were going to get there, they hoped to stop with Baby Saga. But [[Executive Meddling]] (which is why GT even existed) wanted to rush two more sagas in production because producers wanted the series to coincide with the release (and marketing) of Dragon Ball: Final Bout for the Playstation. [[Ending Fatigue|Viewer ratings began to go into landslide around the Shadow Dragon Saga]] so they abruptly [[Cut Short]] the series and rushed out a hastily written ending out the door. Yes. Seriously.