Fate stay night/Headscratchers: Difference between revisions

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* On Fate route, when Archer faces Berserker by himself he looses, we already know that since he used a lot of mana healing the wound that saber inflicted on him and because of that he wasn't able to use UBW (because if he was able he should be able to easly defeat him, as gil pointed the fact that berserker is weak to [[Storm of Blades]]) Then if he wasnt able to defeat it via UBW why the hell he didn't traced Berserker's Sword and used Nine Lives Works? As heaven feels shows shiro defeated berserker nine times using Nine Lives Works (well Duh) using archer's power, so if shiro was able why the hell archer wasn't able to do so?

** Because Dark Berserker is explicitly weaker than Heracles in top form, he doesn't have anyone directing him, and he's blind to boot. Berserker's tactics may be [[Attack! Attack! Attack!|fairly straightforward]] while he's under Mad Enhancement, but he's still normally lucid enough to defend himself if need be. In dark form, he was basically blind, rabid, and confused, and ran straight into Shirou's attack (and it didn't help him that he paused a split-second when he heard Ilya's voice, long enough for Shirou to finish him). Also, even if Archer had access to UBW, he would still have had a helluva time fighting Berserker straight-up. It's not that Heracles is weak against [[Storm of Blades]], it's that Gil's Gate of Babylon barrage was forcing him to shield Ilya at the same time (something Archer simply wouldn't do). And even ''then'', Gil actually won the fight by making Berserker sit there and take it with Enkidu.

** She has an easier time taking charge when she herself is not in the picture. Rin's character has perpetually shown some kind of vulnerability about herself.

*** Her reluctance to taking off most of her clothes lends credence to this idea.

** As the above troper has noted, Rin prefers to normally lead from outside the picture. When she actually gets directly involved in something she tends to make irrational decisions. Heck, when it comes to emotions, Rin's a [[Glass Cannon]]

*** But she ''was'' in the picture in Fate. [[Dissimile|And when I say "picture", I mean "Saber's vagina".]] She was probably thinking like Shirou, that being forced into having sex with your love interest is awkward. Having a [[Mate or Die]] situation with Saber, a neutral friend, was bearable, so she could as well learn to enjoy it, but she '''really, really, really'' didn't want to have sex with Shirou in this way.

*** Assassin seems to suggest that the actual man named "Sasaki Kojirou" and whoever wielded the sword Monohoshizao were different people, just as he himself was some unknown swordsman who happened to master a technique attributed to Kojirou. But IRL, is there really any doubt about his existence? I [[Did Not Do the Research|didn't spend more than a few minutes checking on this]], but every source I managed to find seemed to treat it as established fact that Kojirou existed and was killed in a duel against Miyamoto Musashi. No doubt legend has embellished quite a bit about the man, but compared to [[All Myths Are True|all the other mythological heroes that are evidently real]], that's nothing. I liked Assassin's dramatic situation too, but ''come on''.

*** If the game is to be believed, one of the sources who ''never'' mentions him is Musashi himself. Other than that...eh, I'm fine with it. There's only [[Samurai Shodown|one Sasaki Kojirou for me]], anyway. Besides, Assassin's Tsubame Gaeshi technique is a lot cooler than what Kojirou's was supposed to be.

* Unlimited Blade Works. Specifically, the incantation for it. I can understand the Engrishy-ness of it--in fact, I'm surprised it's as comprehensible as it is. What bugs me, though, is that the Engrish version is ''completely different'' from the Japanese version. Not just in wording, but in the entire meaning of each line (though the overall effect is roughly the same). Where the English goes "Steel is my body, and fire is my blood", the Japanese goes "His body is of iron, his heart of glass" and so on and so forth. (Full version [http://typemoon.wikia.com/wiki/Chants_%26_Incantations#Incantations_by_characters here.] I guess the question is, why are the two versions so different, and which one is the "canonical" one?

** That is pretty strange. If either of them is really the "canonical" incantation, it'd probably be the one that Archer actually uses in combat (whether in the VN, anime, or fighting game), so probably the engrish version.

*** Well... while most of the differences are pretty weird, yes, the Japanese can just as well be translated "My body is of iron, my heart of glass" and so forth since the subject is implicit and not explicit. Which makes it sound a lot closer... for the first three lines or so.

** The author, Nasu, likes to play with the difference between pronunciation and meaning, generally by using kanji that say one thing with furigana that make the pronunciation something else. He does this all throughout FSN, especially with the Noble Phantasms (which are themselves an example, being called "hougu" in Japanese, which means "treasure"). For example, Lancer's spear is written as "Barbed Spear of Certain Death" but pronounced Gae Bolg. Excalibur is something like "Golden Sword of Absolute Victory." Reality Marble has the meaning of "innate bounded field." Shirou's spells are also subject to this. He says "Trace On" no matter what he's doing but thinks of a different meaning (and therefore kanji) depending on the spell. This presumably applies to Unlimited Blade Works as well. Archer says his poem in Engrish while thinking the poem in Japanese. One is not necessarily a translation of the other, because both meanings are meant to overlap. Since this is strictly a visual sort of pun, it doesn't really carry over well into voiced adaptations.

*** I see what you mean, especially with regards kouyuu kekkai (aka Reality Marbles) like Mugen no Kensei (literally Infinite Sword Creation), but just as a pointless nitpick, I don't think that applies to the names of the actual Noble Phantasms. Excalibur is the name and pronunciation of the Noble Phantasm itself; "yakusoku sareta shouri no ken" ("Sword of Promised Victory") just looks like a title rather than a pun. Gae Bolg is probably a better example, since that name just translates to "red branch"...though it does happen to have two titles attached to it ("Spear of Impaling Barbed Death" and "Spear of Striking Death Flight," depending on how Lancer uses it).

* Heaven's Feel. Shinji tries to rape Sakura and threatens to tell Shirou about their previous * cough* liasons if she doesn't submit. She's (irrationally but understandably) terrified of the idea and winds up killing him...but why did she take a threat like that seriously at all? Sure, Shinji is clearly unhinged by this point, but surely he'd have enough survival instinct left over to realize that telling your magi brother-in-law, who ''knows'' the kind of abuse and domination you've put his lover through, that you dominated her sexually as well is...a tad unsafe.

*** In Japan, you do need someone else to sign for you if you're underage (when I was there last year, underage was below 20). I don't know if it works differently for emancipated minors, though.

** Magi disapprove of technology and are in general quite disdainful of it. Tohsaka's a little more relaxed about it, but honestly, with her upbringing and focus on 'doing what a magus is supposed to do' would she really use something as high tech as a cell phone? And the only person around to sign up Shirou for a phone is Taiga, who is insane and wouldn't want him calling anyone in private [[Shipper on Deck|unless it was Sakura]]. Apart from them, who else is likely to? Definitely not Ilya.

** It ''is'' a Noble Phantasm. One which can survive Berserker's attacks. If he wasn't a Berserker, he could use {{spoiler|Nine Lives}} with it.

** Technically, that's because the Nine Lives technique itself became a Noble Phantasm. The reason no one tries to destroy his sword is because they can't. Partly because the thing is clearly reinforced somehow (it's been used to parry countless actual [[N Ps]]), and partly because regardless of D&D rules, deliberately sundering a weapon is extremely difficult...even when the weapon isn't being wielded by an insanely quick and powerful giant.

**** Heroic spirit's weaponry is made of mana, right? Obviously Archer ATE the swords that were impaling him.

* It's really more of a [[What If]] thing, but it's been bugging me so I guess it goes here. What if Rin didn't revive Shirou? What would have happened then? I mean, I imagine Sakura would basically shatter (though what would happen next is kind of an unknown) and that Archer would... well, who knows what the hell would happen to him, Ilya and Shinji would probably react in some fashion, and Taiga, I have no clue what she'd do (she's basically a yakuza princess and if Shirou died there would be some hell to pay).

* Please tell me I`m not the only one bugged by this. During Fate route, Ilya paralyzed Shirou with her Mystic Eyes, then she took him home when he was unconscious. A little girl who was alone at that moment kidnapped a teenager from the city park to her house located at the outskirts of the city. In broad daylight. And she laughs at him for falling for that so easily, while she explicitly told him before that she can`t harm him during the daytime...

** The playground they were in was explicitly deserted, and she went there for the express purpose of capturing him, since Saber was apparently in no condition to fight. It's also more than likely she brought Sella or Leysritt along to transport him...besides, she ''didn't'' harm him.

* In the anime, why did Caster change Sakura's outfit before trying to sacrifice her?

 

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