Kung Fu Panda/WMG: Difference between revisions

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== Tigress was adopted when Tai Lung was a teenager or at least still there. ==

In the short, Shifu could be seen smiling. According to a legend, Shifu used to smile. However, it could be a case of the [[Unreliable Narrator]] Po is. It wasn't specified when Tigress was adopted but if it is true, then Tigress and Tai Lung used to have a big brother-little sister relationship. If you ignore the [[Foe Yay]], you can see that Tai Lung still cares about his 'family' especially Shifu. The 'family' fell apart when Oogway denied Tai Lung the Dragon Scroll.

== Tai lung was a closeted homosexual. ==

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Many viewers have noticed that Tai Lung and Tigress share many, if not most, of their traits. The main, and possibly only, difference is that a true warrior has control over their emotions, rather then allowing the emotions to control them. Tai Lung gave into his anger and became a villain, showing a stunning lack of control for someone as well trained as himself. Tigress, on the other hand, was able to control her anger and disappointment, though she was probably just as pissed as Tai Lung. In the end, this single difference between them makes all the difference in the world, as it sent Tai Lung down a dark path, yet it also marks Tigress as being a truly worthy and honorable warrior.

** Tigress' self-control failed in exactly the same way as that of Tai Lung. When denied the goal their master was raising them for, they both decided to grasp for it anyway. Directors' commentary on the DVD even specifically points to the gravity of her disobedience. Tai Lung went on a rampage as a result, and Tigress would have died if not for Tai Lung's mercy (if he really just wanted to frighten Shifu and the Dragon Warrior, sparing only Crane was sufficient). If there is a single positive trait that Tigress has and Tai Lung doesn't, and that is not founded on clear difference in their talents, it's her unselfishness. Tigress is capable of blaming herself or thinking how others might feel, even when she feels wronged (by being passed for the Dragon Warrior) or hurt (by her adoptive father not showing any love). Tai Lung... isn't, and maybe never really was, although after he spent twenty years stewing in his own hate it is hard to say for certain.

== Oogway isn't entirely gone. ==

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== Oogway sealed his soul into the peach tree sprout. ==

He did not die, he allowed his own body to fade away after sealing his essence into the only thing longer-lived than him: the only sprout of the Sacred Peach Tree of Heavenly Wisdom. That's the only way another plant other than the grass and the original peach tree could survive on the hilltop, if it had a soul of its own. Also reference the seal shown when Shifu causes a peach to fall during his "I failed" rant.

== Tai Lung wanted to be killed by the Wuxi Fingerhold. ==

Between being denied the post of Dragon Warrior and returning to kill Oogway and Shi-Fu, Tai Lung discovered a way to become immortal by possessing hundreds of people at a time... the only way to do so was to have one's body vaporized and inhaled by others quickly enough that your spirit hasn't yet realized you're dead. Tai Lung's plan had been for Shi-Fu to destroy him so as to allow him to possess him, Oogway, and whatever monks were studying there at the time, but Shi-Fu chickened out and Tai Lung was merely imprisoned. He escaped with intent to either PO Shi-Fu enough that he'd disown him and use the Fingerhold, or at least kill him and get revenge for the years of imprisonment. It wasn't fear of Po knowing the Wuxi Fingerhold that had him scared, it was fear of him not knowing it that had him scared. Splatterization doesn't have near the same probability of becoming immortal as does vaporization.

** ... You mean like the Jar of Whispering Warriors?

== Po hasn't finished his [[The Hero's Journey|Hero's Journey]]. ==

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* A nice idea, but according to [[Word of God]] in Art of Kung Fu Panda, Dream Works "didn't want to make an issue out of it [Po's parentage], to suggest that Po is considered special or different...Po's strength and talent comes from within, neither because of nor despite the fact that he is adopted." So even if him having kung fu trained parents is possible, Dream Works would never pursue it because of their [[Be Yourself|'anyone can be a hero']] [[Aesop]].

** Or Po is the son of two great noodle makers. His dad did say broth ran deep through their veins. But he didn't say it was the same broth, so...

* Or, Mr. Ping won the baby Po in a game of mahjong.

** I like that one, make it canon.

*** I have to agree!

* Maybe Mr. Ping really is his dad, and his mother was a panda. [[~~Hot~~ ~~Skitty-On-Wailord~~ ~~Action~~|Wait,]] ew.

* Maybe Mr. Ping really is his dad, and his mother was a panda. [[Improbable Species Compatibility|Wait,]] ew.

** Whoever made this entry is [[TV Tropes Made of Win Archive]].

*** You know, when I learned Mr. Ping was his father, that was EXACTLY what I assumed.

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* In fact, he ''told'' Shifu he had forseen that: "One often meets his destiny on the road to avoid it"

* [[Word of God]] supports this theory. In the DVD commentary, it's revealed that Shifu originally started his training hoping to become the Dragon Warrior, and later, hoping to train the Dragon Warrior when he found Tai Lung. When that didn't work out, Shifu sees himself as having [[My Greatest Failure|failed his mission in life]]. When Oogway was trying to show Shifu that his destiny was really to take over for Oogway [[Ascend to a Higher Plane of Existence|when he leaves]].

* He definitely did. At the beginning of the movie he knew his days are numbered, and there is no candidate for succeeding him. Shifu learned jack from Tai Lung's debacle, and in fact refuses to learn or grow personally, and so is limited even in his ability to pass Oogway's kung fu techniques, never mind Oogway's wisdom. The next master in the assumed line of succession, Tigress, is an emotional wreck, and doesn't yet have necessary skills. They are far from being personally happy as well. So Oogway took steps to rectify this. In the end things worked out for the best of everyone involved (well, excluding rhino guards, buried under a couple thousands tons of rock). The only question is, was he truly able to see the future, or just was a transcedentally awesome judge of character.

== Po is not adopted. ==

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*** So, is there any clarification on whether Tai Lung was killed or not? This troper saw statements to either effect, claiming to be backed by [[Word of God]]. His appearance during the end credits montage, that clearly depicts the stuff characters are doing after the main story, serves as an evidence of survival, at least.

**** I don't know if they may have said anything more clear and specific elsewhere, but all the directors said in the DVD commentary was that "no one knows what happened to him, it's a mystery". This could be them being cagey in case they want to bring him back for a sequel--and if they are, they're keeping their cards close to their chest since no announcement of Ian McShane returning has been made, although I read somewhere that he was slated to appear in the second episode of the TV series. Or they didn't want to confirm that he had been [[Family-Unfriendly Death|blown to bits]], [[No Kill Like Overkill|but just so small you can't see them]]. For what it's worth, though, I doubt they'll bring him back since a) they stated that they had made him [[Unintentionally Sympathetic]], so why give the audience more fuel to care about him? and b) it seems to be a trend in animated movies to create villains who are so far from being flat and one-note that you sympathize for them, only to have the rug pulled out from under you by a denial of their redemption. Sure, [[Reality Subtext]] dictates that there will be people in [[Real Life]] whom, even if you understand their motivations and sympathize with them, are evil and stay unrepentantly so...but whatever happened to escapism? Seems some people are a little too far on the cynical side of the scale... Anyway, I do happen to concur, though, that Tai Lung's appearance during the end credits which all clearly take place post-movie, is rather suggestive...

**** Considering that Po was ready to forgive Lord Shen, who, as he believed, ganked his entire biological family, the possibility of Wuxi Fingerhold being lethal just went to extremely low. The size of Ki shockwave hardly means anything in a world where accoplished martial artists can survive being slammed into ground with a force of an exploding bomb almost unscathed. The DVD commentary more or less states that the writers wanted a way to end the fight in an epic final blow, that would have made the outcome absolutely clear, but deliberately made its effects ambigious (a gigantic explosion was considered but discarded). They stated the final fate of Tai Lung to be a mistery, but, well, we all know what [[Never Found the Body]] is for. Bringing him back in a satisfying way, though, might be a tad difficult - there is little doubt that Tai Lung will be utterly morally crushed by his defeat (as, again, authors went out of their way to ensure that his defeat is crystal clear and total). He cannot go back to villainy without desperately lying to himself, and therefore losing much of his power, and a [[Heel Face Turn]] might well be impaired by the fact that Shifu and Po apparently are fed up with him, and everyone else just fear him. I guess we have to wait for TV series and see.

== Tai Lung did get the meaning of the scroll ==

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* Makes "Kaboom of Doom" total sense.

* Partially confirmed. The website and the trailer reveal that Lord Shen ''did'' indeed invent the cannon, but the ones seen in the trailer resemble the frame-supported Zhankouchong, not the handheld Shouchong.

* I've seen the movie, and though Shen uses cannons he invented, no one ever says anything along the lines of guns being dishonorable (thank goodness). I suppose this is jossed, especially considering {{spoiler|Po has discovered an empty hand martial arts [[Catch and Return]] technique to effectively counter cannon fire.}}

** I knew it.

== Expanding on the guessing above, The next movie will be a homage to Jet Li's Kung Fu classic "Once Upon a Time in China." ==

* Foreign colonies with no honor invade China with firearms, of course in the movie world, guns are no match for kung fu. The main villain may be an evil sleazy swarmy British animal, played by confirmed British actor Gary Oldman. Expect foreign Slave traders get their asses kick by Po, and flick a bullet with his fingers.]]

** Jossed, Lord Shen is a handsome peacock, who was born in and ruling over the Chinese city of Gongmen.

== In the sequel, the titular "Kaboom of Doom" can be caused by Lord Shen. ==

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== Tai Lung rejected Shifu's apology because he thought Shifu wasn't being sincere ==

This verges into [[Alternate Character Interpretation]], but it was something that sort of hit me when I first watched the movie and haven't been able to get rid of it since. Essentially, throughout his entire life growing up, Tai Lung felt that Shifu wasn't proud of him/didn't love him. He claims that Shifu didn't even try to comfort him after he was denied the scroll, it's unlikely that Shifu ever visited him in prison, and when Tai Lung arrives and says "I've come home, Master" Shifu rejects him saying "This is no longer your home, and I am no longer your master". They then get into a huge fight, and it's only after Tai Lung has Shifu utterly beaten and has told Shifu that he always wanted his approval that he starts spouting out his apologies. Take that together and it's not that big of a stretch to think that Shifu is simply telling Tai Lung what he wants to hear in a desperate attempt to stop Tai Lung from killing him. So Tai Lung, thinking that Shifu is lying about his apologies, rejects his apology and demands the scroll.

* That...actually makes sense. We, as the audience, know very well that Shifu is being honest; but imagine waiting about forty years - twenty of those spent breaking your back, twenty spent rotting in a hellhole prison - to hear that from your own father, coming back to find that he's replaced you with other students, and having him only say it when there's a very good chance it might save him. Big difference.(Not that this pardon's Tai Lung's reaction.)

* ...why didn't ''I'' think of that?! Talk about [[Fridge Brilliance]]. Again, it doesn't justify his reaction but it totally explains it.

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== Shen killed Tigress's parents too. ==

You may be wondering why I guessed this. Well, it could be that Tigress's parents were white tigers, or there may have been white tigers in her village. The soothsayer predicted that a black and white warrior would stop Shen, and she may not have specifically said a panda. Shen, thinking ahead, may have decided to get rid of any tigers, white or regular, while he was at it.

** While this is probably a HUGE stretch given the timeline, Shen may have orphaned Tai Lung as well. Wiping out an entire species isn't exactly something you can do on the fly, so it could have taken years to fully accomplish. Tai Lung's backstory is uncannily similar to Po's, being an orphan of unexplained origins, as well as being black and white (Well... white-ish grey). Depending on the numbers of Pandas and other creatures Shen would have to go through, it may just have given Tai Lung enough time for Tai Lung to be raised, trained and go through the events of the first film.

*** Tai Lung was probably around forty at the time of the first movie(twenty years in jail, another twenty-ish from birth to being presented to Oogway for Dragon Warrior consideration). Po's age averages around mid to late-twenties. Po's village was quite close to Gongmen, just down the river aways, and Shen probably would have gone for the closer ones first. So one way or the other, there's at least ten years difference, long before Shen decided Gotta Kill Em All.

*** If we accept this WMG, in the Kung Fu Panda universe Shen is responsible for making Giant Pandas, Snow Leopards ''and'' South China Tigers endangered. The bastard!

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*** We [[Never Found the Body|never see Shen's body]], so unless [[Word of God]] says he's dead, its entirely possible that he's still alive.

*** Of course, one could have all of the villains dead but ressurected somehow (maybe they skipped the cycle of reincarnation and went directly to the Buddhist Underworld).

*** Shifu (as an example of another [[Fragile Speedster]]), when completely exhausted and beaten, was slammed into solid stone so hard, that the stone cracked, and didn't suffer anything more serious than a headache. The main thing that stands against the possibility of Shen's return is Shen's obvious desire to die - a technical possibility of survival is not a stretch.

**** Shen was said to be sickly to begin with and is visably hurt from Po landing on him. He's clearly not meant to be as durable as the other characters. Plus, the cannon falling on him may have knocked him out and drug him down with it, drowning him.

***** He was briefly winded at most. He survived his ship being demolished with no serious damage. But again, this might be immaterial, compared to Shen's suicidal mood (he could have easily jumped off the wreck in two or tree seconds he had after spotting the falling cannon).

== The bad guys for movies 3, 4 and 5. ==

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== The Next film will take place outside of China ==

Just before the reveal of Po's real Dad the camera pans over what seems to be a vast distance, as well as a huge Mountain range that may be the Himalayas. If so this would likely place the Panda Refuge in the area of India. Given Shen's ruthless determination it seems likely that he would have found any remaining survivors in the country, which would force them to hide elsewhere. If so it would allow the creators to draw on a broader set of animals and culture in next film, as well as providing some variation on the the design.

* Actually, the last shot looks a lot like it's in Sichuan, which is in Southwest China.

** Fun fact, [http://www.worldwildlife.org/species/finder/giantpanda/WWFImgFullitem8113.jpg Pandas were once widespread through most of China], but are today reduced to [[Fridge Brilliance|a few mountain populations in Sichuan]].

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== Po was the ancient ancestor of [[Phineas and Ferb|Peter the Panda]]. ==

* Yes. Just...yes.

== The recipient's Reaction upon seeing the Dragon Scroll is really a reflection upon themselves. ==

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== Tai Lung will return in the third movie, having survived the Wu Xi Finger Hold. ==

* I've been thinking about this for a while and have come to this conclusion: Tai Lung is alive, and the Wu Xi Finger Hold is actually a mutual destruction desperation technique that Po only partially understood. Po is basically a kung fu fanboy, right? Well, when has a fanboy gotten all their facts straight? Po learned the move on his own, but it's doubtful that he understood the full nature of it. Tai Lung, however, being a kung fu prodigy, would have understood completely. Most likely, when he realized Po didn't know what would happen to him as well, he kicked away from Po (knocking him into the cart that put the pan and cloak on him) after the first flash of light, fleeing in the ensuing confusion.

** As for when Shifu put Po in it in the first movie, that's an easy one: He was BLUFFING. He wanted Po gone, and knew that Po would probably only know OF the move, and not the full details. Best way to get rid of someone you don't want? Threaten him with a deadly move.

== There are two dragon warriors. ==

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== Tai Lung believed he was destined to kill Shen ==

Think about it: "A warrior of black and white". Hmmmmmmmm........

* Nobody in the Valley of Peace knew about that particular prophecy. How would Tai Lung know?

== One of the next movies will involve a [[What Do You Mean It's for Kids?|toned down]] expy!Mongol invasion of China. ==

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== Oogway actually explained why Tai Lung couldn't have the scroll, we just didn't see it on screen. ==

All we saw in the flashback was him shaking his head and walking away. Tai Lung would probably have said 'what do you mean, no?' then Oogway would have explained why he couldn't have it, but Tai Lung would be too pigheaded to listen and learn from that. Oogway's not an idiot after all.

== Monkey will get drunk at some point ==

And will create a new martial arts form under the influence.

* Hey, at least he'd actually be contributing something to the plot.

== The villain of the third film will have green or black as his color. ==

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== If Po and Tigress ever become a couple, they will adopt their children. ==

They were both adopted themselves, so it makes sense that they would want to continue the pattern. Also, the Kung Fu Panda universe isn't the same sort of fantasy land established in the [[Shrek]] series (where anything goes), so it's unlikely that [[DreamWorks]] will give us [[Mix-and-Match Critters]] like they did with Donkey and Dragon. Again, ''if'' Po and Tigress become a couple...

* Given Tigress's [[Angelina Jolie|voice actress's]] attitude towards adoption, this would be [[Art Imitates Life]].

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The reason he willingly stayed in jail was probably the same reason Master Shifu (at Kung Fu Panda 2) said about Sages spending an ungodly amount of time staying perfectly still and meditating to attain "Inner Peace".

Saddly, it didn't seem Tai Lung spent much time getting "Inner Peace".

My guess is that, being the Martial Arts Genius he was, he spent that time reverse engineering Master Oogway's attack, inventing ways to counter it and gathering his chi, and waiting for the only one who could stop him to die of old age.

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* Po's speech about the secret ingredient is YOU, probably made a lot less sense to him than: "That stupid Panda got to the Dragon Scroll and took all the Power! That's why this scroll is blank! Well his lies won't fool me! I shall beat it out of him!"

** Of course, attacking the one that HAD the Power of Dragon Scroll is an act of stupidity I can only assume came from suicidal over confidence (in his defense, he did get the scroll from Po so it wasn't a totally one sided fight) or the effect of so much blunt trauma to his skull, including having a big fat Panda sit on said skull, and him in general, several times.

== Po's dad (the goose) is a [[Zen Survivor]] of some sort. Rivalling Ugway in wisdom if not brash courage. ==