Smash/YMMV: Difference between revisions

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** Also the Bollywood dance number in "Publicity".

* [[Broken Base]]: It actually came pre-broken, and with the show's active encouragement, as the marketing played up a Team Karen and Team Ivy angle. And sometimes it seems that there's actually a deeper split between fans who hate the other girl/team and those who find both characters likable and both actresses talented.

* [[~~Creators~~ Pet]]: Karen, to many. No matter how many times characters on the show say how great she is, a lot of viewers don't understand how a gal with an average pop voice is supposed to be a legitimate threat to Ivy, the seasoned vet with the big Broadway voice. Not to mention Ivy LOOKS the part way more than Karen.

* [[Creator's Pet]]: Karen, to many. No matter how many times characters on the show say how great she is, a lot of viewers don't understand how a gal with an average pop voice is supposed to be a legitimate threat to Ivy, the seasoned vet with the big Broadway voice. Not to mention Ivy LOOKS the part way more than Karen.

** To be fair, it is mentioned that because Ivy has been in the ensemble for so long, she's having difficulty standing out when given the chance. Karen, due to being a [[Naive Newcomer]], has difficulty blending because if she wants to make it big, she ''has'' to stand out.

* [[Foe Yay]]: Karen and Ivy display quite a bit of this. Karen can often be seen staring longingly at Ivy, looked hurt when she learned that Ivy and Derek were sleeping together, and recently became so caught up in Ivy's music that she practically fainted in the middle of a workshop. Ivy's obsession with Karen only grows stronger after final casting; she even sees Karen in her mirror at one point. A ''Wicked'' duo is inevitabely in their future.

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* [[The Scrappy]]: Ellis, for Julia in-universe.

** And for many fans as well.

* [[Unfortunate Implications]]: Regarding Ivy, who ends up {{spoiler|losing her dream role to a [[Naive Newcomer]]}}, despite years of hard work and an abundance of talent. The season finale makes it seem like no matter how good she may be, and how much time and effort she's put into her Broadway career, it still isn't enough to make her a star. Sort of a [[Family Unfriendly Aesop]] that one can work hard ''and'' be skilled, and ''still'' end up getting their dreams crushed.

* [[Unfortunate Implications]]: Regarding Ivy, who ends up {{spoiler|losing her dream role to a [[Naive Newcomer]]}}, despite years of hard work and an abundance of talent. The season finale makes it seem like no matter how good she may be, and how much time and effort she's put into her Broadway career, it still isn't enough to make her a star. Sort of a [[Family-Unfriendly Aesop]] that one can work hard ''and'' be skilled, and ''still'' end up getting their dreams crushed.

* [[Values Dissonance]]: on more than one occasion, Karen is essentially told that she needs to learn how to become a team member by blending her talents into the ensemble rather than being showy...even though most of the occasions where this happens it's Ivy being an [[Alpha Bitch]] diva who messes with Karen because of a combination of insecurity and a feeling that Karen hasn't payed her dues. Ivy and the other members of the cast who pull this have barely ever been called on this (with basically only one exception).