Strong as They Need to Be: Difference between revisions

Every so often, the villain is just too powerful. They're going to [[The End of the World As We Know It|destroy the world]], or [[Take Over the World|at least control it]]. Sometimes, if the writers really want it to seem like a big deal, the villain will threaten the entire galaxy, universe, or even multiple realities. It seems all hope is lost. And there's nothing the heroes can do to stop it.

Often a result of the writers letting the [[Rule of Cool]] take over. Compare with [[I Am Not Left-Handed]] and [[New Powers As the Plot Demands]]. Can overlap with [[Crouching Moron, Hidden Badass]], and [[Power Creep, Power Seep]], and [[Berserk Button]]. If called upon to [[Hand Wave]] or [[Lampshade Hanging|put a lampshade]] on this, the character might give a [[World of Cardboard Speech]]. Contrast [[Drama-Preserving Handicap]]. For the phenomenon of "As Big As They Need To Be", see [[Artists Are Not Architects]], [[Your Size May Vary]], and [[Telescoping Robot]].

* In ''[[Dragonball]]'' (particullary ''[[Dragonball Z]]''), this is very common. One character is beaten, and a few moments later (without any chance of training), he is so much stronger that he can beat the guy who has just defeated him without even sweating. This is [[Justified]] by saying that "Saiyans get stronger after losing a fight".

* [[Pokémon (Anime)|Ash Ketchum]]. One minute he's beating a League champion in a tough battle. The next he's struggling against some also-ran. Though to be fair, a lot can depend on which Pokemon are being used at the time...

* ''[[D Gray Man]]'' revels in this trope. One time you'll see the whole cast ganging up on a single demon and taking several episodes to beat it, at great cost. The next day, despite being weary of the fight, they can kill them by the dozen.

* At least in the manga, [[Samurai Deeper Kyo]] was this trope. Period. There are even one or two techniques used by the heroes that they ''had never tried, just imagined'', and after [[New Powers As the Plot Demands|getting a power up]] or going into a [[Super Mode]], they just do it. And we're not talking about trying a "roundhouse back flying kick". We talk about "the technique that draws my blood make-up over your body to boil your blood from inside".

**** Don't forget, however, that Superman ''did,'' in [[Superman the Animated Series]], beat Darkseid to a bloody mess (by DCAU standards) when he and Batman invaded Apokalips. The difference is, at that point, Superman was ''still'' holding back so as not to kill him. By the time of the Unlimited finale, he was pretty much actually '''[[Thou Shalt Not Kill|trying to kill him]]''', since he knew that he probably couldn't. Remember, Supes, unlike Batman, ''will'' relax his [[Thou Shalt Not Kill]] rule when there absolutely is no other option.

* [[The Hulk]]'s level of physical might and durability varies tremendously. This one, however, has a built-in explanation: Hulk's physical might--and in [[Hulk (Film)|the 2003 movie]], his physical mass and size--is directly related to how angry he gets. Hence the [[Catch Phrase]] "The madder Hulk gets, the stronger Hulk gets." For example, [[Wolverine]] has fought him several times--most of the time to a standstill until he manages to get one good cut in and piss the Hulk off enough that his anger really flares up. At the same time, during the Onslaught [[Crisis Crossover|event]], in the last battle with the titular villain, Jean Grey mentally removed any blocks Banner may have had to restrain himself, and he beat the hell out of the physical form of a being that could [[Reality Warper|alter reality with a thought]]. In short: hope your first punch knocks him out.

* [[Spider Man]] has this problem very often. His strength, while theoretically possible to mathematically calculate, is subject to plenty of fluctuation. Even his webbing is subject to this, sometimes being broken by a [[Badass Normal]] and sometimes strong enough to hold up a car or two.

*** Subverted when [[Spider Girl|Spider-Girl]] happened to be in similar situation, with evil god Set trapping every superhero on Earth under unbreakable forcefield. May was doing everything she could to beat him and [[The Juggernaut|even dropping a building on him didn't slow him down]]. However, when May called all her [[Heroic Resolve]] for one final attack and it was looking like this trope was going to be used....[[Groin Attack|she kicked him in the nuts]]. After that, Set admitted that he was holding back on her. Unluckily for him, that kick was painful enough to make him stop upholding the force field and released the superheroes who unleashed a giant ass-kicking upon him.

* Peter David pretty much stated this trope when responding to comments of his writing of [[She Hulk|She-Hulk]]. Fanboys were quibbling about She-Hulk's power level under PAD's run and he said she'd be as strong as the story required - as the story was more important than the stats.

* Sentry has this problem, one time being able to fight with Hulk as equal, having his ass handed to him by [[She Hulk]] or [[Incredible Hercules|Hercules]] another and then going into a level where he can {{spoiler|[[Dark Reign (Comic Book)|kill Ares, wipe the floor with Thor and destroy Asgard single-handedly]]}} or kill {{spoiler|Molecule Man}}. May be justified as his powers may depend on his emotional level or {{spoiler|how much he's infulenced by the Void}}

* [[Wolverine]] pulls this off in ''[[X-Men (Film)|X-Men]]: The Last Stand'' when he faces down Phoenix in the climactic scene of the movie. His healing powers are inexplicably multiplied to the point where he can walk up to Phoenix (who by this point had already atomized several main characters and the entirety of Alcatraz island), taking multiple psychic blasts which flay the muscles from his bones only to fully regenerate in less than a second. This was so egregious that it got a [[Word of God]] [[Retcon]], stating that Phoenix's out-of-control abilities also amplified the powers of nearby mutants.

*** Orcs are a special case. A feral Ork army is almost laughable in terms of strength, while a carefully constructed WAAAGH! is almost unstoppable. Often, you'll see something in between the two. The strength of the Orks depends on the strength of the local WAAAGH! It's a species that runs on [[Clap Your Hands If You Believe]], thus [[Strong As They Need to Be]] is easily justified. The writer just has to limit how hard they can "clap."

* Done well, and justified, in a fight scene from ''[[Lord Darcy (Literature)|Too Many Magicians]]'': Lord Ashley is dueling a villain whose sword is enchanted, and keeps flickering in and out of visibility. As he's pressed hard by his foe's invisible attacks, Ashley's fear activates his own power of prescience, allowing him to intuit exactly where the blade will strike next. This turns the tables on the villain, who begins a fighting retreat ... at which point, Lord Ashley's growing confidence causes his prescient power to shut down again, as it's established that it [[Power Incontinence|only works when he's under stress]]. Luckily for him, his opponent doesn't realize that's what happened, and when Ashley hesitates, his foe seizes the opportunity to escape rather than attack.

* ''[[God of War (Video Game)|God of War]]'': Kratos has this all the time. It's particularly notable in the second game when the Colossus of Rhodes stamps on him, and he ''tosses it away''. But there's a wall in the way? Must go all the way around this convoluted route rather than just, I don't know, knock a hole in it. Or in the first game, when your method of getting through a gate with thin bars that something else already ripped a hole in is to push over a 60 foot high statue.

* In ''[[Ls Empire (Webcomic)|L's Empire]]'', the king or queen of the Kayoss will always be stronger than the combined power of those they are fighting.

* In ''[[Teen Titans (Animation)|Teen Titans]]'', due to the emphasis on the [[Rule of Cool]], the team's powers and abilities were considerably up and down. One infamous example was the case where [[Badass Normal|superpowerless]] Boy Wonder was able to singlehandedly beat down Cinderblock, with his bare hands. Every other time however, Robin and his teammates struggled to defeat him. The Titans often reached literal godlike levels during the season finales.

* In ''[[He Man and The Masters of The Universe]]'', certain of the more powerful villains were shown to be able to give He-Man a good trouncing on their very first try. However, if the same villains found themselves tangling with his weaker archfoe Skeletor, they were shown to be unable to inflict so much as a wrinkle on his clothes. This went on up until the introduction of King Hsss, who proved to be [[Eviler Than Thou|eviler than any of them]].

** In the 2002 version, He-Man's [[Strong As They Need to Be|Strong As He Needs To Be]] nature was perhaps best exemplified by the time he effortlessly lifted a stone tower that had to weigh in excess of a hundred tons and threw it into the sun. Punching any of the bad guys with a similar level of force should've turned them into a pasty smear on the nearest wall, yet they were always treated as legitimate threats.

* Mesmero from [[X Men Evolution]]. In his first appearance, he's a strong enough telepath to fight Xavier to a draw, but in his next episode Xavier defeats him easily. For most of his appearances he's a [[Squishy Wizard]], but in the ''Dark Horizon'' [[Season Finale]] he can suddenly take on Wolverine ''and'' Sabertooth at the same time. Possibly justified because Mesmero's powers were granted by Apocalypse, and the old mutant may well have adjusted how much power he let his minion use based on how much he thought he'd need.

* As noted above, Gladiator powers are based on his confidence and his appearances during Phoenix Saga in ''[[X-Men (Animation)|X-Men]]'' really shows it. At his first appearance he simply ''ignores'' Juggernaut punching him and then threw him to the ocean with one hand. Later, feeling conflicted about fighting Rogue against his [[Wouldn't Hit a Girl|personal code]] allows her to knock him out with one punch.