Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann/WMG: Difference between revisions

The Big Crunch, the Spiral Nemesis; death; is ultimately a necessary function to the evolution of the Universe. Scientists even theorize that when the Big Crunch does happen, the singularity that it created will become a "Big Bounce": it will start another Big Bang, thus giving birth to new varieties of physics or life. Keep in mind, despite all their talk about protecting the universe, the Anti-Spirals have suffered such massive [[Motive Decay]] to the point of becoming nihilists who have zero concept of quality of life. As long as something continues to exist; in any form; they see it as their job accomplished. An endless, eternal [[And I Must Scream]].

* Lets see, earliest example was when Viral saved Adine by catching Dai-GurrensGurren's foot and threw it on its ass. He came up underneath it (drills maybe?) and caught a giant foot that probably weighed somewhere over three tons. Then he survived the explosion Adine's sub. In the penultimate episode, Viral gets caught in the dimensional labyrinth with everyone else, because it was a trap that targeted creatures that could produce spiral energy, and later; during the final fight, the show flashes to Viral saying something, and then Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann pulls out two katanas; weapons that Viral has been using throughout the series. Also, in the second movie, he gets a tengen toppa (spiral energy flames and all) with a design that reminds this troper of shiva and uses a sword in each hand.

* It makes sense that the gunmen were built by someone that already had a reputation for going [[Serial Escalation]].

* Everybody else on team Dai-Gurren agreed that the food tasted awful, but Rossiu reacted especially badly. Obviously a person's reaction to Nia's cooking is different based on the amount of Spiral Power they can manifest at the time. Therefore, Simon, having already managed to manifest crazy amounts of Spiral Power, enjoys her cooking immensely, while the rest of Team Dai-Gurren, who have manifested only enough to pilot Gunmen, merely think it tastes terrible. Rossiu, on the other hand, having grown up in the dreary Adai Village, cannot even get into the proper mindset to manifest Spiral Power, and reacts violently to Nia's cooking. Over time the effects grew more pronounced as Rossiu continued refusing to manifest Spiral Energy to counter the effect, eventually corrupting his personality and leading to the post-timeskip Rossiu. Fortunately, the effects began to reverse themselves once Simon purged Rossiu's body of the infection via a Spiral-infused punch to the face.

Also, I have always thought of the alternative universe he travels to being one of many Neon Genesis Evangelion Universes, which he proceeds to fix as he searches for Nia. However, your mileage may vary with that idea.

* Here's the thing: how did they find ''her'' before, when she was being analyzed by the Anti-Spirals? Perceptual dimensional teleportation ''using the wedding ring as the target''. The one thing Nia leaves Simon before fading away is the wedding ring. It's almost as though she's flat-out telling him that they can find each other, wherever they are, no matter what happens. Depending on the way you look at the wedding, this can either make for a happy ending for the couple where he can find her wherever she is (or, dare I say, vice-versa), or it can give more impact to when Simon gave up his core drill (and therefore his handy/only access to perceptual teleportation via Lagann -- cementingLagann—cementing his "The dead would just get in our way," claim). Is his one spiral eye in the distant ending a delayed manifestation of his massive overdose on Spiral Energy in the final battle? Is it just a sign that he's embraced the use of spiral power in moderation, perhaps to visit his beloved? Does it mean he's rejected immortality? Or that he's shared half of his immortal life with Nia? Or is it because he no longer needs a focusing tool (the core drill) to tap into the more advanced uses of Spiral Energy i.e. dimensional teleportation/time travel/the impossible? Listen up, tropers. ''You'' be the judge, and don't let the claims of others get you down! In the end, yours is the only interpretation that matters. Believe in the ending that you believe in!

* [http://www.animenewsnetwork.comcc//interview/2008-07-28/gainax-on-gurren-lagann This interview] says that the opening was originally supposed to foreshadow the ending. Along the way, it was [[Retcon]]'d into an [[Alternate Universe]] where Simon does become the Spiral Nemesis.

* The obvious trigger of his action is {{spoiler|[[Love Makes You Crazy|Nia's death]]}}. How can he give up his power and authority now -- nownow—now that only he can set things right! Even if it means amassing enough mass and energy to risk the gravitational collapse of the universe. Even if it means leading the Dai-Gurren-Dan into war with every living being. [[Well-Intentioned Extremist|NOTHING is impossible to the truly audacious!]]

** Then again, [[Humans Are the Real Monsters|Humans Are Bastards]]...

**** That was just the narrator. He just happens to have the same voice actor as Lord Genome.

We know that Spiral Energy can affect both space and 'time'. Now take a look at Future Simon...'LOOK' at him! Does he even look different than Kamina's father? There are only minor differences in their clothing: in terms of build and general appearance, they're all but identical. Indeed, one could say that Kamina's dad is simply a slightly older-looking version of Future Simon. Now, let's posit an [[Stable Time Loop|Ontological Paradox]] here: Simon gets his hands on this Spiral Energy stuff; after that distant finale nonsense, he regains his awesome and goes on to fight "all the stars in the heavens". He is defeated and knocked back in time, along with the Gunmen in the Gurren Brigade, and eventually ends up being the very thing that triggers the Anti-Spiral attack on Earth. He later fathers Kamina before returning to the surface to die, possibly by suicide. This creates an interesting situation because the Gunmen, and Lagann itself, now have no actual origin...hence an ontological paradox, a time loop wherein the origin of the loop is either inobvious or impossible to determine. This, if you think about it, goes well with the infinite spiral theme of the show.

Kamina would have defeated [[Lord Genome]] and continued his reach for the heavens and acted on what he told Simon in episode 6. To reach the moon. Where he would find the Terra Cathedral and transformed it, inevitably leading to him riding in his battleship across the universe battling everyone he could find and exploring; until the rest of the Spiral races believed that he would destroy them. Of course Kamina would be crazy(and hotblooded enough) enough to declare war on everyone and everything, thus leading to " All the lights in the heavens are our enemy..."

Think about it. When we see him in ''Shin Getter Robo'' he's piloting an ENORMOUS ship with a face on the front (that can also transform into a giant robot), causes lots and lots of explosions and is literally the enemy of everything in the universe. In Āḥ, it's revealed that he's gone a bit crazy with the [[Green Rocks|Getter Rays]] and is now on a crusade to evolve the shit out of the universe. Not to mention the prologue guy's line "we'll smash them along with space-time itself" sounds a lot like his own line: "leave it to me. I'll crush them, along with the moon!"

Any similarities to the main cast is a result of identical descendants.

* This is supported by Parallel Works 8, where we see where they come from explicitly -- theyexplicitly—they're dropped from the sky during an Anti-Spiral attack, allowing Lord Genome to find one.

* Characters:

** Red haired hyper girl and rival/love interest: Asuka and Yoko, mostly earlier on. Yoko wanted to take Simon's spot in Lagann. Each was the most experienced fighter of the three children of each show in the beginning.

** Zen Survivor dark figure/father of a protagonist: Gendo and Lord Genome, both of whose goals are tied to their "hell": Gendo to continue abusing the power to revive the dead, Lord Genome to keep others from following his path.

* Similar plot points: The creation of the prototype (Gurren Lagann), and the copies being inferior. [[Heroic BSOD]] of the main character after the death/near death of a close friend. Splitting into alternate universes and coming back. The only difference is that Shinji ends up numb, broken and on the verge of suicide, while Simon snaps out of it, [[Took a Level Inin Badass|Takes A Level In Badass]], and becomes even more awesome than Kamina.

* Your citations of [[Calling Your Attacks]] fail to take into account that despite ''Lagann Impact'' being the full name of the other big attack used in that battle, it too failed. [[Neon Genesis Evangelion|Depressing]] though it may be that the [[Rule of Cool]] failed in that aspect, it also worked out - Lord Genome blocked it by grabbing it and subsequently detonating the Rasengan's arm. Hmmm…Hmmm …

* Or, more simply, there is only one Law of Physics: If it looks cool, [[Ascended Fanon|Sure Why Not]].

Consider: Boota evolved (even if only in his mind) from his mole-pig form into a [[Cute Shotaro Boy]] in [[Cool Sunglasses]]. Since none of the alternate universes The Will uses against the Dai-Gurren-dan appear actively impossible with the series' physics, this implies that Boota could do this, or at least something similar, in the real world. (Presumably, if push comes to shove, he could do so again with Simon's help.) In any case, the chain of events is as follows: After Simon's (long-delayed) death, the pretty-much-immortal mole-pig goes on to sire a numberless legion of Spiral-powered hybrid creatures. The galaxy unites briefly, but separates once more when they recognize that their expansion is leading towards the Spiral Nemesis. A trackless time passes. Boota's hyper-powered descendants, born with the capacity to retain enormous amounts of Spiral power, evolve at warp speed, speciating into countless different varieties of creature, many of them near-sentient. Humanity eventually abandons the form of Ganmen and much of their dependence on Spiral power. Meanwhile, the Beastmen, unable to regenerate any longer, go extinct. Millenia pass, and the world- already very different from present-day Earth- regrows and reshapes itself further. Even the Great Gurren-dan is relegated to little more than legend, and eventually forgotten altogether.

* If Pikachu is a direct-line male heir to Boota, and Squirtle is Kamina, what does that say about Ash?! [[Kid Hero]], [[Idiot Hero]], able to tell [[Screw theNew Rules Ias Havethe Plot Demands|the rules of reality]] to fuck off whenever he and Pikachu want to do something, he must be Simon reincarnated. Squirtle/Kamina came to Ash at the beginning of his adventure, when he needed help, and left (this time without the [[Heroic Sacrifice]]) when Ash no longer needed him around. The glasses worn by the other Squirtles around him must have been references to Simon's goggles, in an attempt to get closer to their [[Crazy Awesome]] leader.

== Viral was ''always'' immortal; if Lord Genome did anything, it was to give him a faint connection to Spiral energy. ==

One of the recurring aspects of this show is the emphasis on humanity. The more human a Beastman is, the more powerful; their mooks are barely recognizable as human, the Big Four are human with animal aspects, and Viral (the most important) is almost totally human, except for his arms. The exception is Guame, one of the Big Four, the most powerful our of them (he survived a giga drill breaker!) despite looking like a great big armadillo thing. What's more, he acts as an equal to Lord Genome; at least, he treats him like a soldier would treat his Sergeant, not giving the terrified groveling done by the others of the Big Four.

== The events of the prologue are part of the God-Emperor of Mankind's ridiculously long-term plan - and hence part of [[Warhammer 4000040,000]]. ==

* The machines that attacked Kamina city were remains of Nono's Buster Legion. In the second to last image in [[Diebuster]]'s ending, Nono is shown on a surface of some planet, staring at a far away galaxy. This might mean that she survived the final battle in Diebuster, but warped so far away that she returned to Earth thousands of years later, when Lord Genome found his Lagann. She helped him with his first battles and, like Kamina helped Simon, she helped him to become as awesome as he was. When he betrayed the Spirals, he got rid of her, probably by teleporting her as far away as he could, and reprogrammed her army. This also might explain why Nia looked so much like Nono. He either couldn't forgive himself for betraying her and created his daughters as a way to comfort himself, or he made and then threw them out, because he hoped that one of them will help to create a new Spiral King.

Post-timeskip, we see that humanity keeps expanding without limit, much like a virus; the persecution of the beastmen that follows shows their intolerance. That may have been the tip of the iceberg as far as humanity's conquests went, and they possibly left hundreds or thousands of worlds barren or burning and their inhabitants dead or enslaved simply because they believed they could go anywhere and do anything - much like the Imperium of the [[Warhammer 4000040,000]] universe. The Anti-Spirals may be [[Sufficiently Advanced Alien|Sufficiently Advanced Aliens]]s that have watched humans from the beginning of their prehistory and hoped they would learn tolerance, self-control, and moderation; when they could no longer bear to see world after world be conquered, they decided to intervene. The downside was that confinement and despair only made humans more aggressive, and now they may spread farther and more ruthlessly simply to avoid being confined again.

Parrel Works #8 shows the making of Lord Genome and the events of the first war against the Anti-Spirals. Those who are paying attention will notice a lot of simmilar faces, like [[Mobile Suit Gundam|Gundam RX-78,]] [[Mazinger Z|Mazinger,]] Jeeg, and two of the [[Neon Genesis Evangelion|Eva units,]] as well as verious flagships, including the [[Star Trek|USS Enterprise.]]<br />It stands to reason that Gurren Lagann is an offshoot of [[Super Robot Wars]] that follows a story in which the world's Heroes are wiped out in the ensuing war; the only mech left to fight the power at the start is, as it were, Lagann.

Judging by the general tone and theme of the series, there must be a missing scene in which Kamina comes back from the dead (after [[Chess with Death|the most epic game of chess]] '''EVER'''), punches Simon, and tells him to go [[Beyond the Impossible]] and save Nia, leading to an epic quest for several mystical [[MacGuffin|MacGuffins]]s for reasons of that's just what needs to be done. Presumably, this would end in an epic battle involving mechas the size of universes. What we see post- [[Time Skip]] occurs after all of this; Simon is clearly just a [[Retired Badass]] and not a hobo.

** The emphasis was more on the word DEFEAT in the subtitled version. Still, that has its own double meaning. Viral could have been intended to tell the story of Lord Genome's victory, as he claimed, while at the same time being ready as a backup plan in the event that Simon managed to win.

** This particular guess is completely, completely just plain wrong. While it is entirely possible that {{spoiler|He could find a woman who looks like her}}, a higher-quality image shows that [https://web.archive.org/web/20210328153118/http://img.imgcake.com/Suri/not!wife404.pnghtml not only are those horns and not ears, but appears to be male and has a beard.]{{Dead link}}

== The three kids piloting the Ganmen that make up Gurren Lagann in Parallel Works 6 are: ==

== The Spiral Nemesis that the Anti-Spirals feared was the inevitable result of all the [[Epileptic Tree|Epileptic Trees]]s being planted from the show ''[[Lost]]'' achieving critical mass and causing the collapse of the universe ==

Says so on the [[Poison Oak Epileptic Trees]] page!

== [[Warhammer 4000040,000|Orks]] know how to harness Spiral Energy ==

** No it doesn't. Kurtis did one, and he sure the hell spends time as a prinny.

Elaborating on the above theory, the TTGL universe takes place after the Disgaea bad ending where Laharl leaves the throne to Etna to [[Walk the Earth]]. Complications lead her and some survivors to flee to earth -- whichearth—which she covers up with the whole "weapons cache" story to avoid admitting to Kamina/Laharl that she totally screwed the pooch on running the Netherworld in his place. As for why she and Kami/Harl didn't recognize each other upon meeting again, either she didn't immediately recognize him due to age (can ''you'' imagine Laharl at a height above five feet? Neither could she), or she did and just kept it to herself for some reason.//

* Alternatively, Nia is a reincarnation of ''Flonne'', presumably dying alongside Laharl in the above-mentioned scenario or during one of the [[Multiple Endings|"bad"]] endings of Disgaea.

** Which this troper took as an indication that she was still in love with Kamina.

* Alternatively, Uzumaki is a cautionary tale for anti-spirals.

** But without wheels, how do you get drills?

* Continuing from the above, the Anti-Spirals were responsible for the death of the Dreamcast. But during Sega's decline in [[The Nineties|the mid-to-late 1990s]], and especially after they were out of the market, gaming took on a decidedly [[Darker and Edgier]] slant. First with [[Grand Theft Auto]]-style sandbox games set in [[Crime-Time TV|crime-ridden cities]], then with [[Real Is Brown|realistic]] [[First-Person Shooter|First Person Shooters]] where the player is not an individual hero but a single soldier who may or may not have any real effect on the outcome of the war, games are going [[Sliding Scale of Idealism Versus Cynicism|down to the cynical end of the scale]], very much fitting with the Anti-Spiral motive of creating cynicism and despair. Nintendo and Sega, makers of decidedly more idealistic games that gave gaming actual "faces" like [[Super Mario Bros.|Mario]] and [[Sonic the Hedgehog|Sonic]] (remember the ''faceless'' Anti-Spiral robots? And the "faceless" corporations they're using to take over gaming?), pissed off the Anti-Spirals to no end, so they directed their hate at those companies. Sega went down with their [[Dreamcast]], leaving the console market. Their niche was filled by Microsoft, a company even further divorced from "idealism" than Sony. It seemed like Nintendo, too would fall: the Gamecube was the bottom of its generation, and Anti-Spiral puppet corporation Sony was poised to enter the handheld market. It would supposedly destroy Nintendo there. All seemed dark, like the Spirals would fade from gaming altogether, until... '''[[Wii|ROW ROW]] [[Nintendo DS|FIGHT THE POWAH!]]''' You want even more proof? [https://web.archive.org/web/20121002140311/http://malstrom.50webs.com/birdman.html Go ahead, Ctrl+ F and search "Spiral".] Nintendo's "User Satisfaction as King" business strategy is called a Spiral! The "[["Stop Having Fun!" Guys|hardcore]]" FPS gamers, who by now are ''de facto'' Anti-Spirals, are pissed at Nintendo's strategy of expanding the market to all for fear that it will cause the gaming Spiral Nemesis, destroying video gaming's special niche in the culture. Oh, and [[Shigeru Miyamoto]] is Simon.

In 1979 Yoshiyuki Tomino published a trilogy of novels based adapting the [[Mobile Suit Gundam]] series. Written ''before'' the franchise achieved its meteoric success, the novels were highly divergent from either the broadcast or theatrical version, and feature a unique "closed ending" in that the main character is accidentally killed partway into the 3rd novel-- droppingnovel—dropping his unfinished mission squarely in the laps of his friends and enemies.

If Episode 26 is any indication of this, it's that Kamina rescues the key pilots of the galaxy-sized mech. While it doesn't show him explicitly freeing anyone other than Simon and Yoko, one could guess that he had a hand in getting the other people. That said, the Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann is only formed when Gurren Lagann merges with the Spiral Power of each of the individual pilots, who wouldn't have broken out had it not been for the spirit of Kamina. The members of the remaining Team Gurren say that they're fighting for a higher cause, and Yoko herself states that 'There was once a man who was ten times greater than us. For his sake alone, we'll keep fighting.'

It is centuries after the Age of Sorrows, and the Exalted problem is fixed. Everyone can be Solar Exalted, if they do/think/are AWESOME enough. The beastmen are the last remains of the Lunar Exalted, the Anti-Spiral is the last Primordial, and the gunmen are derived from warstrider technology.

This one should, really, be obvious... but I figure it has to be written down.<br />The first fourth of the series ''(episodes 1-8)'' is almost literally a direct [[Expy]] of the 1960s super robot shows. Things like Mazinger Z and Getter Robo were incredibly formulaic and often disreguarded what few rules they invented if the show needed it. We can see this leaking through into the show via lovely examples like Kamina trying to combine their mecha in episode 3 ''(it works because... it just does)'', other mecha combinations not working in episode 4 ''(because... they just don't)'' and having many nonsensical plots in general ''(hello episode 6!)''. As if this wasn't enough, characterization tended to run rampant ''(Kamina's [[Flanderization]] into a [[Jerkass]] throughout episodes 4-6)'' and many episodes would run completely off-model ''(the QUALITY of episode 4, easily)''. As this story arc reached the end, we finally saw our '1960s-era main' of Kamina being phased out of the spotlight as Simon finally took the controls in episode 7 for the first time - and this arc ended with the death of Kamina in episode 8... the proverbial loss of innocence of the time.

The second fourth of the series ''(episodes 8-15)'' doesn't change much from the previous arc, but very much is more in line with the 1970s of giant robots. Plots are less episodic and feel more 'tied together' with a vague story arc, much like the later shows of the 1970s like Voltes, Combattler and Daimos. We also begin to get the hints of technobabble as things like 'Spiral Power' are mentioned in a hand-wave to how the mecha are powered - and our villains even begin to develop as characters. The latter is something that was almost completely ignored until shows like Voltes and Gundam premiered in the last three years of the 1970s. The ending of this story arc, of course, ends with the final battle with our villain... who, as it turns out, isn't completely evil either. The fact that Lord Genome comes off as a [[Well-Intentioned Extremist]] in his final fight is just proof that the show itself has evolved toward the deeper 1970s shows from the shallower 1960s anime.

Our third segment of the series ''(episodes 17-23ish)'' shows vast changes, however, as we hit the 1980s. As [[Gundam]] vastly changed the concept of giant robots with having ''armies'' of not-so-special robots, we see the Graparal show up for duty - an MP version of the Gurren-Lagann in general. And rather than having over-the-top weaponry, these MP units simply have pistols and guns that are simple to replicate and re-arm. Also tying in with the simple fact that mecha shows slowly moved to develop the characters more in the 1980s ''(thanks to the premier of the OVAs, allowing for shows to focus less on being [[Merchandise-Driven]])'', the entire cast begin to grow as characters... getting actual development sometimes for the first time in the series. Compared to the first half of the series, this section of the show is almost a drastic shock - which is what the 1980s themselves were to the robot anime genre in general.

** Furthermore, if Nia had been the first daughter he ever had, and he'd been ruling for 1,000 years, she'd be incredibly old (probably at least 900). That wouldn't make sense with her aging along with Simon.

Think about it. There are perhaps only a handful of people relative to the general population who are "adepts" at either. They are both seen to enable these adepts to do things which would make physics kill itself. Force sensitives, such as Jedi and Sith are just on the threshold of the immense Spiral Power Simon posesses. Therefore, Simon will go on to found the Jedi Order.

* Well, Spiral Power runs on hotbloodedness and gives the user [[Charles Atlas Superpower|Charles Atlas Superpowers]]s, while The Force runs on meditation and gives the user psionic talents instead. Isn't that a contrast?

Here we go: the Evas and Angels both run on Spiral power. The S2 engine? Super-Spiral engine. Also explains Shinji's wildly fluctuating sync ratio, he's in the depths of despair the entire series. The Evas themselves are prototype ganmen. Humanity learned of Spiral power after Second Impact, and built the Evas to utilize it. Unfortunately the Eva universe is plagued with a lack of incredible badasses, and as such there was no one capable enough to pilot the Evas. So, they ran them off electrical power like the Ganmen do while beastmen pilot them.

The Angels are perhaps Anti-Spiral creations, with Adam being some kind of Anti-Spiral construct, possibly a messenger (maybe that's more suited to Kaworu though). AT-Fields are just concentrated Spiral power. Lord Genome later perfects the Eva technology, removing the squishy bits in favor of mechanical components.

* Its basic mechanics of spiral energy. If you think its impossible, your negativism will prevent you from generating sufficient spiral energy to force reality to bend to your will. Believe you can hard enough,<ref>while making constipated faces</ref>, and you'll generate the spiral power to do it. If its an aesop, its a [[Fantastic Aesop]], as Spiral Energy isn't real.

**** Yet.

== The Spiral Nemesis is the creation of a new [[Warhammer 4000040,000|Eye of Terror]] ==

Kamina feels weak, compared to Simon, and wishes he could have accompanied his father on the surface so that he'd be tougher today... One of his most quoted sayings, "Don't believe in yourself, believe in me who believes in you."... that's not for Simon's sake that he's saying that. Kamina needs someone to believe in him, and who better than the person he admires most?

** And by "word of god" you must be reffering to the secretive book that the author of the "Satire" claims to own, am I right? If he's the only person who has ever seen it, and he refuses to show it to 'anybody' then ther's 'no' reason to believe it. The reasons he gives for getting that book are equally as ridiculous. Self proclaimed third party speaker right there. Yes, I am calling him out on his bullshit.

People have proven to be very bad when it comes to managing anything powerful. If humanity learned how to fully harness Spiral Energy without any immediate goal, they'd very soon become corrupted by it. Considering how an aggressive, defiant attitude is the best mood for channeling spiral power alongside natural wariness about alien life after ASK, war would almost inevitably break out once humanity took to the stars.

To stand up to human aggression, other spiral races would start abusing spiral power to the same level, leading to a very dangerous arms race constantly churning out spiral power and trillions of tons of matter. None of the sides would bother checking themselves, thinking that Spiral Power would allow them to fix any damage. This mindless warfare, would lead directly to the races destroying each other, but eventually, the universe itself. This is the scenario shown in the opening.

*** Nah, I'm thinking something else. I'm afraid it'll cause Spiral Nemesis just by describing it, but here goes. What about a massive flaming hole being torn through the universe straight through to the afterlife, through which Kamina, wearing a flaming crown and a flaming version of his cape and shades, sprouting [[Go Nagai Sideburns]], and [[Dual-Wielding]] [[Flaming Sword|Flaming]] [[Chainsaw Good|Chain]][[Warhammer 4000040,000|swords]], rides out on top of the head of his own Super Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann, piloted by Kittan, Lord Genome, his generals, and everyone else on the non-Anti-Spiral side, which proceeds to gattai with the one used by Simon and the rest of the team, which is joined by [[Chuck Norris]], [[Mr. T]], [[Axe Cop]], [[The Adventures of Dr. McNinja|Dr. McNinja]], [[Batman]], [[Avatar (film)|Colonel Quaritch]], [[300|Leondias and the Spartans]], [[God of War (series)|Kratos]], Bruce Ironstaunch, [[Daniel Remar|reallyjoel's Dad]], [[Star Wars|Boba Fett, Darth Vader,]] [[Mobile Fighter G Gundam|Domon, Master Asia, his horse]], [[Brian Blessed]], [[Theodore Roosevelt]], [[Firefly|River Tam]], [[Problem Sleuth]], [[Homestuck|Bro, Equius, Mr. Egbert, Grandpa Harley]], [[Dragon Ball|Goku]], [[Team Fortress 2|Saxton Hale]], [[Dwarf Fortress|Morul, Captain Ironblood,]] [[Shin Mazinger Shougeki! Z-hen|Kouji]], [[Barkley, Shut Up and Jam: Gaiden|Charles Barkley,]] [[Sweet Bro and Hella Jeff|Hass the Rock]], [[F-Zero|Captain Falcon]], [[The Man Your Man Could Smell Like]], [[GaoGaiGar|Guy]], [[Segata Sanshiro]], [[Power Rangers|Tommy Oliver]], [[Commando (film)|John Matrix]], everyone else listed on the [[Memetic Badass]] page, and anyone not already listed who has appeared in [[Manly Guys Doing Manly Things]] to form a new mecha, which is the size of the ''entire'' universe, made of Spiral Energy, is shaped like Kamina in his aforementioned equipment, plus Lord Genome's beard and Simon's visor, both made of fire, with a Powerthirst-spewing fountain in its chest, flaming wings made out of lightsabers, and is riding an appropriately scaled-up [[Axe Cop|Wexter]] in his rocket-winged dragon form while wielding [[Thirty Hs|Fuckslayer and a flaming groinsaw]], then proceeding to perform a Super Tengen Toppa Giga Drill Breaker with each limb, plus the head, and t

In the end it was probably a good thing that Simon didn't try to resurrect Nia with spiral power, because I doubt even he would be prepared for the unmitigated horror (and undeniable awesomeness) of Black Lantern

Kamina!

This isn't a bad thing. The Spiral nemesis is just one of the several interpretations of the spiral symbology: a force that touches all points and brings them together at a single endpoint. It's why combining mecha work so well in TTGL. Essentially, the entire TTGL universe COMBINES WITH ITSELF, and the Spiral Energy of all things unites in a single source. This becomes a powerful Spiral Engine that creates an entirely new universe for it to take place in. The Spiral Engine decides that, with its newfound power over destiny and GAR, it will draw together an army of new Spiral Knights to wield its power. As a holdover from the memories of its greatest hero, the TTGL universe creates as its outlet for its power a ring similar to Nia's. Obviously, this means that technically the Anti-Spirals were the first Black Lanterns.

He was a loner living on a future Earth after a large enough population came back from the LCL ocean. They discovered Spiral power, and begin the age of the Spiral warriors.....well, you know the rest. This idea also means that Lord Genome's badass heroric sacrifice, as Shinji's badass heroric sacrifice, means that in th end, Shinji finally did snap out of his moodyness after all!

** No, it means that he's ''better''.

* Perhaps it was just cold that night?<ref> You know, cold air = hard nipples, hard nipples could hold up the bikini top. Yeah, I know, don't explain the joke.</ref>

During the First Spiral War, the Spiral races attempted to undo Lordgenome's treachery by sending stuff back in time to bolster their forces. They sent a souped-up Ganmen back - Megas - but something went wrong and it ended up in early 1900's Jersey. They sent Kiva after it, but because Coop altered Megas so much she couldn't use it properly and she never reported back. In desperation, they sent a huge wave of Spiral Power-related data back into people's heads, creating the Whispered - and extending the [[Cold War]] into the 21st century.

* And Aperture Science was developing Spiral power (look at their logo, it's kind of a spiral itself). Chell is a budding Spiral Warrior, and the Portal Device is a perceptual teleportation unit. [[G La DOSGLaDOS]] has either been controlled by or defected to the Anti-Spirals, and is desperately trying to prevent the spread of Spiral Power by the Anti-Spiral's usual methods, disheartening and discouraging Chell, which forces her to go further and further [[Serial Escalation]] in her attempt to escape.

** This theory would explain why [[The Cake Is a Lie]]; to goo thrhough such hardships only to be disapointed would indeed be crushing.

* That explains the [[Four Chan4chan|ROW ROW FIGHT THE POWAH combined with Large Hadron Collider memes]].....

Starts off as a [[Moe Moe]] -esque [[Damsel in Distress|Distressed]] [[Everything's Better with Princesses|Princess]] who after spending time with the protagonist [[Took a Level Inin Badass|Takes A Level In Badass]] and becomes as [[Hot-Blooded]] as the protagonist. They even look alike.

* Alternatively, TTGL is actually what Nietzsche said. Spiral Energy is another name for Will to Power. Existential themes run during the series (WHO THE '''HELL DO YOU THINK I AM'''?!) and of course, the [[Ubermensch]] is no other than Kamina, who is a [[Messianic Archetype|Messianic]] [[Large Ham]] who lives by his own moral code and believes in individual willpower (again, the previous quote) over faith (such as bursting into anger after seeing people worshipping a Ganmen). On the other hand, the Anti-Spirals are [[Nietzsche Wannabe|Nietzsche Wannabes]]s. They promoted mass nihilism by forcing themselves into a [[Hive Mind]], killing Spiral Races, and putting the survivors into angst and meaningless existence.

While he's portrayed as a Blood Knight/Well-Intentioned Extremist, the whole 'ditching his supposed daughters when he gets bored of them for no reason other than to be extremely evil' seems very out of character for someone who, while occasionally questionable, is more or less a good guy. Assuming that each one of his 'daughters' were something akin to Anti-Spiral assigned messengers just like Nia, it makes perfect sense for him to experiment with them and try to 'turn them against their Anti-Spiral nature'. He got rid of Nia because she began to question her own existence which, based on his own experience with the previous daughters, may have meant that it was already to late for her. Then, well...Simon happened. The Anti-Spirals wouldn't have lost against Humans, without Nia's conflicting allegiance, so perhaps this is what Lordgenome has been aiming for all along with all his previous young ones?

Spiral Energy is the power of evolution, and evolution is achieved through procreation, and the Anti-Spirals feared this will lead to the destruction of the universe through mass reproduction. We have the same situation: we evolve through reproduction, but our over-reproduction will lead to resources being exhausted and Earth being turned into a [[Crapsack World]] where people are beginning to fight each other for oil/living space/what-have-you. It isn't evolution that the Anti-Spirals feared, but ''procreation'', which is required to evolve naturally, and since procreation will lead to the Universe being turned into a Crapsack Universe where resources are scarce and people always have to fight each other for more space, the Anti-Spirals used transhumanism (artificial evolution) to sterilize themselves and force themselves into an [[Assimilation Plot]]. Of course, the standard Spiralist response to Malthusianism is "instead of [[Wangst|wangstingwangst]]ing all the time about overpopulation, why not try to discover more living space, like alternate universes out there, like we did during the age of expansion?"

* [http://gurennlagann.wikia.com/wiki/File:Kaminaandsimon26.jpg Look at them]{{Dead link}}. Nearly the same hair, facial expression, [[Walking Shirtless Scene]]... Whether Kamina knows this or not makes no difference.

That's why they were able to track her: She was carrying a solid chunk of Spiral energy.

That "Spiral Nemesis" the Anti-Spirals were worried about? ''It happened once before''; a [[Megas XLR|fat lunatic dropout piloting a mech with a Chevy for a head did it to defeat slug aliens]] and then '''demolished it''', creating in its place a new, awesome universe in which the [[Rule of Cool]] [[Hand Wave|Hand Waved]]d [[Mohs Scale of Science Fiction Hardness|the laws of physics]]. They then went on their crusade for "Absolute Despair" not out of concern for the universe, but out of jealous rage - they'd never be that awesome, so the only way they could justify their dismal existence was if they [[Hannibal Lecture|Hannibal Lectured]]d the rest of the universe into being lame.

== The prologue to Episode 1 takes place after the epilogue to Episode 27, during a conflict between Earth and other Spiral races. ==

As seen in the original short story both Ted and AM are [[And I Must Scream|trapped in unmovable bodies forever]], but Ted had an altered time perception, while AM is a [[Deus Est Machina]]. Eventually, AM used his [[Deus Est Machina]] powers to manipulate probability and assimilate Ted, while Ted's consciousness merged with AM's hatred, becoming the Anti-Spiral, which still because of its hatred of all Spirals, still tries to have fun imposing absolute despair upon the universe, justifying its [[And I Must Scream]] existence with Instrumentality and "protecting the universe". This also means Simon killing the Anti-spiral was also a form of euthanasia.

The series makes is quite clear that the [[Hot-Blooded]] are most suitable to wielding Spiral Energy. It is a very thin line between [[Hot-Blooded]] and [[Heroic Sociopath]] and an even thinner one between [[Heroic Sociopath]] and [[Jumping Off The Slippery]] slope and an even more thinner one between [[Jumping Off the Slippery Slope]] and [[With Great Power Comes Great Insanity]]/[[A God Am I]]/[[Moral Event Horizon]]/[[Omnicidal Maniac]]. If they left the hot blooded humans alone to do as they pleased with their nearly god like power they would have become the Spiral Nemesis.

* This troper would like to posit that the STTGL did not disappear. It became the universe in which all other mecha anime take place.

Think about it. If the Anti-Spirals are really out to protect the universe from the Spiral Nemesis, why are they so bent on the ultimate extermination of all Spirals? Why are they so bent on torturing others to despair and death? Why have they become [[Those Who Fight Monsters]]? If they kill off all the Spirals, they'll be the only ones left. Also, Notice how they have absolutely no proof about Spiral Nemesis or that Spiral Power is dangerous, and if they're really cosmic entities then they should realize that in scientific measurements the universe is infinite and expanding (Dark Energy), the universe will always have room for more Spiral Power and if that's not enough, they can spread it onto the black seas of infinity outside the universe. They're using the Spiral Nemesis as an excuse; they simply want to [[Kill'Em All]] because they're [[Fantastic Racism|Fantastic Racists]]. They're [[With Great Power Comes Great Insanity|deranged]] [[Hypocrite|hypocriteshypocrite]]s who latched on to an unproven theory, not to protect the universe, but solely because they have no desire beyond [[Omnicidal Maniac|killing every last "inferior" Spiral species]]. They're [[The Sociopath|sociopathic]] [[Complete Monster|monsters]] who are merely trying to rationalize their cruelty and selfishness, merely because [[Put Them All Out of My Misery|they view every other lifeform as a disgusting disease]].

== Show takes place in a distant future of ''[[Shinkon Gattai Godannar]]'' ==

== Suigetsu from ''[[Naruto]]'' is Viral. ==

Okay, so, nobody in Gurren Lagann (excluding [[Badass|LordGenome]]) has managed to manifest Spiral Power without the aid of a machine or some other item (i.e. the Core Drill). Sometime in the future, humanity creates techniques to manifest Spiral Power sans an external aid. This is the root of Jutsu. Eventually there's another war or something, and humanity once again finds itself nearly wiped out. They are forced to rebuild again, however, this time they retain the core of what would become Jutsu. Viral survives, and in the Naruto universe he calls himself Suigetsu (I mean [https://web.archive.org/web/20150530192729/http://media.animevice.com/uploads/0/572/23001-suigetsu_super_strenght_super.jpg look at him]!). This conveniently explains the spiral motif in Naruto's character (i.e. the Rasengan, his seal) and why Naruto keeps being able to do crazy stuff despite whatever beating he might take (it only fuels his hotbloodedness, which fuels spiral power i.e. chakra). This Troper also likes to dream about how the ultimate form of the Rasengan will be the Lazengann.

The Anti-Spirals probably found some link between Spiral Power and The Many-Angled Ones, and realised it's perhaps best not to use it as a power source, as it would bring about the end of the universe, and when other races refused to believe them, they had to stop others by force. They also realised whilst out-and-out genocide was horrific, culling the population of the universe and keeping ir artificially low was the only way to prevent what The Laundry designated CASE NIGHTMARE GREEN.

One has to wonder what happened to BLUE HADES and DEEP SEVEN, though.

== The Dai-Gurren has existed in a previous form long ago: [[Fight Club (novel)|Fight Club]] ==

* Update: I was thing about this and I realized that Gurren Lagann doesn't violate the Law of [[Equivalent Exchange]] because it actually transforms dark energy (which makes the universe expand) into spiral energy (which makes the universe contract through converting energy into mass), so what causes the awsomeness in TTGL is perfectly compatible with physics (and transforming too much dark energy into spiral energy must mess up everything in the universe).

* Gurren Lagann starts off with the crew facing off against the Beastmen just to survive, while [[Mighty Morphin Power Rangers]] begins with Rita Repulsa attempting to conquer earth, with the Power Rangers entirely on the defensive.

* As the series goes on, they begin to take the fight to them, only for Machine King Mondo to show up. At this point, the battles are equaly defense and offence. the paralels in Gurren Lagann is the Dai Gunzan making its way to Teplin, being on the offensive while still having to defend themselves from the remaining of the Four Generals.

Again, the details are in [[Homestuck/Other/WMG/Other|the page]]. Basically, Sburb is an early form of Spiral Energy technology created by Lord Genome, the Beastmen were made with Ectobiology, the Dersites are Anti-Spirals, and the meteors are a method of preventing Spiral Nemesis.

Not the Anti-Spiral race our heroes fought. No. Unknown to our heroes,the Anti-Spirals had allied with the only race they could trust - [[Mechanical Lifeforms|a race of machines.]] When the Anti-Spirals were beaten, said robots decided, after watching the [[Ax Crazy]] [[Large Ham]] of the Anti-Spiral leader, that ''all living things'' could lead to Spiral Nemesis, and as non-living things, [[Kill All Humans|they must wipe out life]] [[Well-Intentioned Extremist|so it cannot occur.]]

* [[Warhammer 4000040,000|Necrons]]?

* However, not all of these [[Mechanical Lifeforms]] seek the destruction of life. Some - some will come to protect the Spirals, and refused to ally with the Anti-Spirals. Most will come to destroy them. They were the dream - [[Mechanical Lifeforms]] able to [[Transforming Mecha|transform]] their bodies into [[Cool Car|ve]][[Cool Plane|hi]][[Tank Goodness|cl]][[Cool Starship|es]]; a last line of defense against the [[Omnicidal Maniac|all who oppose Spiral life]]! They are at war, heroic Autobot pitted against evil Decepticon, both on their homeworld of Cybertron and throughout the universe! They are the universe's last hope, they are - '''[[Transformers]]'''!

* Consider what happened to the other Team Dai-Gurren pilots, and what we see of them. Zorthy's cockpit slowly caves in on him as it's crushed. Iraak and Kidd charge their outgunned Space Ganmen at the Anti-Spiral fleet before they fade to white. Makken cuts to an external view of his Moshogun before it impacts the Anti-Spiral missile. All of these are animated in the series' normal style. Only Jorgun and Balinbow have a stylistically unique death scene in that episode. It's rendered in black and white, with their features drawn in a harsh, sketchy style that eventually gives way to a growing white. Notably, this is visually similar to those who died due to a Spiral Energy based attack for one reason or another. It's probably a safe assumption that the twins manifested some kind of Spiral Energy as their Ganmen exploded--unlikeexploded—unlike the rest of their fallen comrades, their Twin Bokun was the only one that exploded so dramatically that it visibly wiped out a considerable number of Anti-Spiral 'fighters.' It's possible that they somehow channeled the impending destruction of their own Ganmen into an explosive release of Spiral Energy, destroying themselves and everything around them to save Darry and Gimmy from further Anti-Spiral pursuit.

* We're currently experiencing one lifetime out of many. This not only explains dreams--subconsciousdreams—subconscious slips into other possible dimensions--butdimensions—but also the belief in reincarnation. It's not reincarnating in the traditional definition, it's just experiencing another labyrinth illusion. Humans ''are'' a Spiral race, and our ability to perceive such things is already known. We can't escape as readily as Team Dai-Gurren did, because we've inadvertently ended up regarding the very things that would save us as foolish and unlikely, and relegated them to the land of fiction.

In conclusion: The true ending to the series is [[Downer Ending|Nia getting deleted; the Dai-Gurren Dan dying from starvation, dehydration, or something to that effect; and the population of the Earth getting whipped out.]] [[The Villain Wins|The Anti-Spirals won.]] The universe is still under there control. <ref>I'm not saying that what happened in Simon's ML isn't possible, mind you. After all, the ML is just possibilities. Everything that happens in there could have happened.</ref>

* It's because being around people like Kamina and Simon, and [[Lord Genome]] who have ''huge'' spiral energy reserves permanently changed his DNA. This is also why he ended up becoming so super-spiral-energy-filled near the end of the series - with his altered DNA, he absorbed and held (and possibly created his own) a lot of the spiral energy around him.

Allow me to quote this from the main page, under [[Evil Eye]]: "Characters with large Spiral power signify this with spirals in their eyes. Strangely, Simon, the one who produces the vast majority of said power, doesn't get this until the Distant Finale, and then only on one side." This made me think that maybe the reason it only shows on one side is because he hasn't maxed out his Spiral Energy. And then I realized that the Anti-Spiral had good reason to fear the Spiral Nemesis if that's the case.

Think about it. Their hairstyles are somewhat similar and only differ in color, which is either negligible or a result of the color scheme of Parallel Works 8; they were also very gifted geniuses. Lordgenome also appears to have been a loner when he was a child, much like Near. In addition, at the beginning of Parallel Works 8, Lordgenome is surrounded by several small animals, some of which are unreasonable to think of as being so small (there's an elephant, a giraffe, a dolphin and a gorilla to say the least). With the exception of Guame, these could have simply been dolls that he was playing with much in the same way that Near liked to play with action figures and dice.

Spiral Nemesis? Doesn't exist, Spiral Power isn't remotely dangerous. Why did the Anti-Spiral lie? Simple: They were [[Complete Monster|Complete Monsters]]s who were obsessed with the universe and wanted it all to themselves, and they didn't want any pesky evolving Spiral races to get in the way of their forbidden love (Notice how they have absolutely no proof about Spiral Nemesis or that Spiral Power is dangerous, see also: Dark energy). Nia? Human, not an Anti-Spiral lifeform at all. The Anti-Spiral simply chose to brainwash her because she was the person closest to Simon, and since Simon was the biggest threat to the Anti-Spiral, it wanted to cause him '''''ABSOLUTE DESPAIR'''''. Nia fading away? That wasn't her dying. The Anti-Spiral was [[Not Quite Dead]] and brought her back to him so he could hold her hostage. Why? Because he knows Simon will try and save her, and when he does the Anti-Spiral can get [[Revenge]]. But since Simon was making love to the [[Idiot Ball]] that day, he decided "NOPE NIA'S DEAD LALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU". And so he never goes and saves her, or does he?

Think about it. Kamina is as close as a hero can come to [[Friedrich Nietzsche]]'s [[Ubermensch]], and actually changes the morality of the world and refusal to obey higher powers (Lordgenome and the [[Straw Nihilist|Anti-Spiral]]). In the finale, the Spirals accept the anti-spirals' despairing nihilistic criticisms (up to the point they referenced the [[Eternal Recurrence]]), [[Reconstruction|reconstructing]] them and becoming more of an encouragement. The emphasis on personal growth? Existentialism to the bone. "Go down a path that you choose and do it all by yourself. That's the way team Dai-Gurren rolls!" sums it up best.

== Grand Unified Guess: Conversely, the ranks of famous Spiral Warriors throughout history include: ==

For starters, the Milky Way galaxy doesn't look like that.

What we witness as "creating matter and energy out of nothing" is just tapping the powers of [[Another Dimension]] (or dimensions) whose immense energies then spiral out into our universe and then transformed into matter by manipulating Einstein's Mass-energy equation (E=MC^2), said matter is assimilated into Lagann's drills. "Spirals" are just psychic humans with a lot of testosterone and [[Id, Superego and Ego|Id]], and when they "produce" spiral power, they are just subconsciously "calling" this dimension, and the energy can then spiral out through the transmission point (in other words, [[Summon Magic]]). Of course, if the transmission comes from a lone Spiral it would be too weak and too subtle, so spiral technology amplifies this transmission (think of the drills as antennae). Spiral Nemesis will come when because there are so much Spirals the real universe and the high-energy dimension will merge, transforming the universe into an [[Eldritch Location]], ala [[Warhammer 4000040,000|Eye of Terror]].

Ok, so hear me out on this one. It’s already been fairly established the beginning of the first episode was basically an alternate future where Simons spiral power went out of control and caused the Spiral Nemesis. Well let’s take that a step further with the fact the Anti Spiral planet was basically sitting in its own little pocket dimension and looks suspiciously like Earth. Rossiu, being the [[Well-Intentioned Extremist]] that he is, would certainly have gone the Anti-Spirals route to protect the Earth and also be willing to breach other Space/Time domains to prevent it from happening again. Additionally, consider the fact the Anti-Spirals treated the Spiral Nemesis as a known rather than just a logical theory. It would also make Nias “You don’t understand…” to which the Anti Spiral responds “Understanding is not required…” an Ironic echo to Rossius’ comment that Simon “Did not understand”. Also there almost seemed to be a personal touch to the way the Anti-Spiral targeted Simon, more than just the tactics of despair he seemed to need to prove to Simon Spiral energy would be the doom of everything. Which given his lack of Spiral Energy and distrust in it, ordering the Gunmen to be scrapped in favor of much more science driven Grapearls.