Neglectful Precursors: Difference between revisions

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== Stargate Verse ==

* Your Honour, for unbelievable neglect, incredible incompetence, blinding hypocrisy, and a refusal to take any responsiblity at all for crimes, misdemeanours, or even basic sapient decency, the prosecution requests that The Ancients of the [[Stargate Verse]] be given the highest punishment the court will allow. A summary of their deeds and lack thereof is as follows:

## Refuse to help normal people [[Ascend to a Higher Plane of Existence|ascend]] to [[Energy Beings]] save on their own merits, and punish those who do. Fair enough, but they also won't allow ''anyone'' who ascends to help mortals, bringing down the banhammer at the slightest sign of rule-breaking.

# Refuse to help normal people [[Ascend to a Higher Plane of Existence|ascend]] to [[Energy Beings]] save on their own merits, and punish those who do. Fair enough, but they also won't allow ''anyone'' who ascends to help mortals, bringing down the banhammer at the slightest sign of rule-breaking.

## Refuse to help any of the "lower beings" ''at all'', including against monstrous, [[Exclusively Evil]] beings that will kill or enslave everything in their path. Which is ~~EXTREMELY~~ hypocritical considering they ~~CREATED~~ ~~ALMOST~~ ~~ALL~~ OF ~~THEM~~ IN ~~THE~~ ~~FIRST~~ ~~PLACE~~! (~~see~~ below) Anyone of their kind that ''does'' attempt to help are treated ''worse'' than those that attempt to help them ascend. Witness: Daniel Jackson.

# Refuse to help any of the "lower beings" ''at all'', including against monstrous, [[Exclusively Evil]] beings that will kill or enslave everything in their path. Which is ''extremely'' hypocritical considering they ''created almost all of them in the first place!'' (See below.) Anyone of their kind that ''does'' attempt to help are treated ''worse'' than those that attempt to help them ascend. Witness: Daniel Jackson.

## Rarely took security measures (and almost never left instructions) regarding the ''legions'' of [[Pointless Doomsday Device]]s they left like so much trash throughout various galaxies, leaving good people to pray and hope that using them wouldn't horribly backfire while evil people were practically gleeful at all the fun toys left lying around. The Goa'uld managed to go from a fairly mindless parasitic species to for thousands of years the single greatest threat in the Milky Way galaxy using Ancient leftovers, including a device which made them functionally immortal even with highly flawed copies.

# Rarely took security measures (and almost never left instructions) regarding the ''legions'' of [[Pointless Doomsday Device]]s they left like so much trash throughout various galaxies, leaving good people to pray and hope that using them wouldn't horribly backfire while evil people were practically gleeful at all the fun toys left lying around. The Goa'uld managed to go from a fairly mindless parasitic species to for thousands of years the single greatest threat in the Milky Way galaxy using Ancient leftovers, including a device which made them functionally immortal even with highly flawed copies.

## Directly responsible for the creation of '''two''' horribly powerful, ravenous, immensely destructive beings (the [[Horde of Alien Locusts|Replicators]] and the [[The Virus|Wraith]]). Predictably, they did precisely dick to stop either of them.

# Directly responsible for the creation of '''two''' horribly powerful, ravenous, immensely destructive beings (the [[Horde of Alien Locusts|Replicators]] and the [[The Virus|Wraith]]). Predictably, they did precisely dick to stop either of them.

## One of aforementioned [[Exclusively Evil]] beings managed to learn how to ascend and attempted to use the Ancient knowledge for his own benefit. The Ancients responded by only partially de-ascending him, leaving him with all the Ancient knowledge and some of the powers (including being impossible to properly kill), and not only didn't bother to fix their mess but, again, punished anyone else of their kind who tried to fix it.

# One of aforementioned [[Exclusively Evil]] beings managed to learn how to ascend and attempted to use the Ancient knowledge for his own benefit. The Ancients responded by only partially de-ascending him, leaving him with all the Ancient knowledge and some of the powers (including being impossible to properly kill), and not only didn't bother to fix their mess but, again, punished anyone else of their kind who tried to fix it.

## Worse, they deliberately chose to take this course of action in regard to Anubis in order to guilt trip the person who ascended him, despite the fact that she had the best of intentions. Even if her decision was wrong, this is still the equivalent of punishing her for giving a gun to someone she did not know was a murderer, by allowing the murderer to keep the weapon and letting him loose in a building full of helpless children.

# Worse, they deliberately chose to take this course of action in regard to Anubis in order to guilt trip the person who ascended him, despite the fact that she had the best of intentions. Even if her decision was wrong, this is still the equivalent of punishing her for giving a gun to someone she did not know was a murderer, by allowing the murderer to keep the weapon and letting him loose in a building full of helpless children.

## The justification given for their constant absence is [[Alien Non-Interference Clause|not wanting to involve themselves with mortal affairs]], believing they do not possess the right to wield such power in such a way. Yet when the Ori, beings comparable to the Ancients to whom they should have no such restrictions, set their sights on the Milky Way galaxy they are allowed to just waltz in on a technicality. In addition, they are perfectly willing to break this non-interference clause when ''their own'' well-being is at stake, sending Morgan Le Fay to stop Merlin (who at the time was descended and should have been out-of-bounds) when he made a device capable of killing ascended beings.

# The justification given for their constant absence is [[Alien Non-Interference Clause|not wanting to involve themselves with mortal affairs]], believing they do not possess the right to wield such power in such a way. Yet when the Ori, beings comparable to the Ancients to whom they should have no such restrictions, set their sights on the Milky Way galaxy they are allowed to just waltz in on a technicality. In addition, they are perfectly willing to break this non-interference clause when ''their own'' well-being is at stake, sending Morgan Le Fay to stop Merlin (who at the time was descended and should have been out-of-bounds) when he made a device capable of killing ascended beings.

## The Morgan Le Fay case bears further elaboration, as she very carefully leaked information to the humans, while the rest of the Ancients watched her. The moment she tried to do anything but be vague, she was dragged away, never to be seen again.

# The Morgan Le Fay case bears further elaboration, as she very carefully leaked information to the humans, while the rest of the Ancients watched her. The moment she tried to do anything but be vague, she was dragged away, never to be seen again.

## The primary aspect of the Ancients non-interference pact is long as there are no ascended powers being used. That seems reasonable. Yet when {{spoiler|Adria fully ascended, and later came down to our lowly plane of existence and acted to her full powers, did the Ancients finally stand up and say, "No"?}} Well, no. While {{spoiler|Adria}} returned to the Ori galaxy and never returned to the Milky Way afterwards, thus the Ancients were still playing by their (pompous, overblown, immoral) rules, the very fact that their rules allow for such a loophole merely strengthens the case against them.

# The primary aspect of the Ancients non-interference pact is long as there are no ascended powers being used. That seems reasonable. Yet when {{spoiler|Adria fully ascended, and later came down to our lowly plane of existence and acted to her full powers, did the Ancients finally stand up and say, "No"?}} Well, no. While {{spoiler|Adria}} returned to the Ori galaxy and never returned to the Milky Way afterwards, thus the Ancients were still playing by their (pompous, overblown, immoral) rules, the very fact that their rules allow for such a loophole merely strengthens the case against them.

## The death of the Asgard, the Ancients' allies. They let a race of their own allies die out rather than help them ascend for no apparent reason. Anubis himself said that if someone was worthy of ascension then the "Others" could collectively do so. Who's more worthy than their long allies?

# The death of the Asgard, the Ancients' allies. They let a race of their own allies die out rather than help them ascend for no apparent reason. Anubis himself said that if someone was worthy of ascension then the "Others" could collectively do so. Who's more worthy than their long allies?

## So, the prosecution suggests we extend the verdict to Guilty, guilty, hypocritical [[Lawful Stupid]] Energy Being scumbags. Thankfully, the Ancients turned out to be ''so'' neglectful they actually left behind the keys to creating the sangra'al, a device capable of destroying ''themselves''. All in favor of capital punishment?

# So, the prosecution suggests we extend the verdict to Guilty, guilty, hypocritical [[Lawful Stupid]] Energy Being scumbags. Thankfully, the Ancients turned out to be ''so'' neglectful they actually left behind the keys to creating the sangra'al, a device capable of destroying ''themselves''. All in favor of capital punishment?

### Jury Foreman Turtler says Aye.

## Jury Foreman Turtler says Aye.

* The defense would like to note that they did, in fact, attempt to stop the Wraith, starting a war that raged across a galaxy. They lost. Their complicity in the accidental creation of said space-vampires notwithstanding, they ''did'' do their level best to stop them until forced to retreat to the Milky Way. Similarly, they did almost destroy the Replicators, but unfortunately missed enough of them that the Replicators were able to subsequently rebuild. Although this was before they [[Ascend to a Higher Plane of Existence|ascended]], and they were still marginally benevolent at this point. It's only after they ascended that they became truly neglectful.

** The defense would also like to note that most of the "lower beings" of the Milky Way galaxy owe their very existence to the Ancients: the Ori plague which forced them to ascend also wiped out most life in our galaxy. The Ancients built the device on Dakara to repopulate the galaxy with life. The defense therefore suggests that their policy of non-interference probably has more to do them being afraid of playing god than simply apathy. (Please see the case of The Ark of Truth vs. The Ancients' Conscience).

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* The State Of New Mexico wishes to bring charges against the Greys of ''[[The X-Files]]''. However, the evidence seems to have been destroyed by [[The Men in Black]].

* The people of Earth would like to bring charges against the Colonials and Cylons of the reimagined series of ''[[Battlestar Galactica]]'' for {{spoiler|abandoning technology}} and sentencing their descendants to:

## {{spoiler|140,000 years}} of struggle to reinvent things such as basic sanitation, agriculture, medicine, education, and the wheel!

# {{spoiler|140,000 years}} of struggle to reinvent things such as basic sanitation, agriculture, medicine, education, and the wheel!

## Sentencing their immediate descendants to the horrors of disease, famine, dying in childbirth, and lack of long term protection from the environment {{spoiler|(Earth}} was in an ice age, for frak's sake!), possibly hostile natives, and unknown indigenous flora and fauna.

# Sentencing their immediate descendants to the horrors of disease, famine, dying in childbirth, and lack of long term protection from the environment {{spoiler|(Earth}} was in an ice age, for frak's sake!), possibly hostile natives, and unknown indigenous flora and fauna.

## The {{spoiler|[[Lost Technology|loss of FTL drive and other advanced technogies]], the loss of which to the present day (and possibly beyond) leaves us with no way to evacuate the planet in case of an [[Death From Above|asteroid strike]].}} (And no, you can't blame {{spoiler|Lee Adama}} for everything; the colonials and cylons all thought this was a good idea.)

# The {{spoiler|[[Lost Technology|loss of FTL drive and other advanced technogies]], the loss of which to the present day (and possibly beyond) leaves us with no way to evacuate the planet in case of an [[Death From Above|asteroid strike]].}} (And no, you can't blame {{spoiler|Lee Adama}} for everything; the colonials and cylons all thought this was a good idea.)

## Left ''no'' messages or warnings to the descendants that that "all of this has happened before and will happen again" if they don't "take care to be nice to our robots" - mainly because by giving up technology their descendants had to '''wait''' ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND YEARS for someone to ''reinvent writing''.

# Left ''no'' messages or warnings to the descendants that that "all of this has happened before and will happen again" if they don't "take care to be nice to our robots" - mainly because by giving up technology their descendants had to '''wait''' ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND YEARS for someone to ''reinvent writing''.

## And what is the backup plan? [[Too Dumb to Live|"Oh, we’ll just interbreed with the natives!"]]. Even ignoring you can't tell whether or not you can interbreed by looking at someone, even if [[Memetic Molester|Gaius frakking Baltar]] made the test, then you have no way of knowing whether or not you just exposed yourself to a disease that you have no immunity against, and WITHOUT TECHNOLOGY you have no way to find a cure or '''at least''' a vaccine. And that isn't even considering they have no idea whether the natives are even friendly to outsiders. Your Honor, I hereby move that they be found '''guilty''' not only of neglectful actions to their '''distant''' descendants but also guilty of neglectful actions to their '''immediate''' descendants as well.

# And what is the backup plan? [[Too Dumb to Live|"Oh, we’ll just interbreed with the natives!"]]. Even ignoring you can't tell whether or not you can interbreed by looking at someone, even if [[Memetic Molester|Gaius frakking Baltar]] made the test, then you have no way of knowing whether or not you just exposed yourself to a disease that you have no immunity against, and WITHOUT TECHNOLOGY you have no way to find a cure or '''at least''' a vaccine. And that isn't even considering they have no idea whether the natives are even friendly to outsiders. Your Honor, I hereby move that they be found '''guilty''' not only of neglectful actions to their '''distant''' descendants but also guilty of neglectful actions to their '''immediate''' descendants as well.

** If my clients are to be found guilty, then they refuse to go down alone on this. If they get thrown in the stockade, then at ''least'' God and the Head entities should go down with them if not replace them entirely. They've got far more cosmological level chops then my clients ever did, were interfering tremendously with their lives, and had ample opportunity to influence highly influential members of the community to say this is a bad idea (one of the greatest scientists of the era, and a heroine of the Cylon people). Instead, they seemed to have encouraged the whole abandonment of technology idea, manipulated their lives, and seemingly did not offer any advice to future generations despite the fact that unlike my clients, they were immortal and didn't have heaps of species-wide post traumatic stress disorder from years of multiple near-genocides, multiple ''actual'' genocides, being cramped up inside ships for years on end with the knowledge you may die at any moment, having to abandon the closest thing to a new home they got, getting betrayed by their siblings, having to deal with their first recognized intra-species conflict, and actually cleaning up Neglectful Precursor-esque messes like their malevolent child/grandchild/sibling robot races.