Older Is Better: Difference between revisions

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* [[Stronger with Age]]
 
Partially [[Truth in Television]]: the idea that ancient knowledge is superior to modern knowledge exists in the real world, but it doesn't always work out that way. [https://web.archive.org/web/20130727103912/http://www.badmartialarts.com/myths/ancient_knowledge.php Bad Martial Arts] has a page debunking this idea. It is also inferredimplied in many pseudosciences like astrology and some alternative medicines: that these ancient knowledges and traditions have been around for so long. unchanged, must mean that they are better than modern science! It's the same logic as with the [[Old Master]]: if a tool has lasted for centuries and is still usable, then it must be damn good. Compare with [[Appeal to Tradition]], to which this is related.
 
This trope is part and parcel of the standard [[Golden Age]] motif in both fantasy and folklore, in which everything was grander and more perfect back in ancient times: gods roamed the Earth, heroes battled huge monsters with legendary weapons and armors that can survive centuries to be used again. If our modern heroes are doing the same thing, then it feels logical that the in the older times, there were bigger heroes fighting bigger monsters with even more legendary weapons.
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{{examples}}
== [[Anime]] and [[Manga]] ==
* Averted for fun in the ''[[Slayers]]'' TV series, where an ancient golem awakens to crush the heroes and promptly breaks down from centuries of disuse.
* In ''[[Yu-Gi-Oh!]]'', the older the magic, the better. This is especially seen in the Waking the Dragons arc. Got 5000 year old magic? Too bad, my magic is ''10,000'' years old.
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* ''[[Nadia: The Secret of Blue Water]]'': Atlantean technology outperforms anything else available in the setting (or, for that matter, anything available in Real Life in 2020).
 
== [[Literature]] ==
* ''[[Beowulf]]'' has many of the weapons, helmets, armours, standards and cups mentioned as prized heirlooms and passed around and down generations for a long time. It is suggested they were forged by [[Precursor Race|Giants]].
* ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'': Ancient Elven and Numenorian weapons are better than modern day Gondorian and Elven ones. The Silmarils were made by one of the most ancient elves, Feanor, and nothing created since rivals their beauty. Likewise, the modern-day dwarves of the Lonely Mountain haven't managed to match the weapons and armour that were made by their ancestors, whose techniques were lost when Smaug killed them.
** Inverted in the [http://flyingmoose.org/tolksarc/book/ rec.arts.books.tolkien E-Text]:
{{quote|The Sword of Elendil was reforged by Elvish smiths. Not only did they put the two pieces together, which requires great skill if the joint is to be as strong as if the blade were newly-forged, but with the improvements in metallurgy which had been make during the millennia, they shaved a pound and a half off its weight, yet leaving the blade far stronger and less brittle than it had been before.}}
* ''[[Harry Potter]]'': The Elder Wand<ref>Elder being the wood it is made from, not a reference to its age.</ref> is the best wand, and despite wandcraft having ostensibly advanced since its creation, several centuries ago, no wand made since can match it. Same for {{spoiler|Harry's invisibility cloak}} which is both older and superior to all of its kind, even those made more recently. So superior are they that this gave birth to legends of these items being made by Death itself, and not by wizards like they were truly made.
** Interesting, because ''[[Harry Potter]]'' seems to generally avert the trope: Magic evolves like science does. New discoveries are made. This is evident with Broomsticks: newer broomsticks are better for example: The Nimbus 2001 is better than the Nimbus 2000, who are both outdone by the more modern Firebolt.
*** The Wolfsbane potion is also a new invention, which is damn useful compared to other, older (and apparently non-existent) treatments for werewolves.
* In ''[[The Night Angel Trilogy]]'' there's a whole list of these, including an ancient technique for forging swords and jewelry and everything ever made by Ezra the Mad.
** [[Justified Trope|Justified]] in that the tomes that recorded Ezra's techniques were destroyed in the lead up to a dark age.
* ''[[The Dresden Files]]'': Explicitly applies this to necromancy. The older the corpse being re-animated, the more powerful the result. Harry uses this rule to get around the fact that non-human zombies are less powerful than ones made from humans by re-animating a corpse several orders of magnitude older than any possible human corpse. {{spoiler|[[Crowning Moment of Awesome|Zombie]] [[HSQ|T-rex]]}}.
* [[David Brin]] did a wacky variant in ''[[The Practice Effect]]'': on a certain colony planet, a weird effect had somehow been arranged so that the more an item was used — assuming it wasn't consumed or broken in a single use — the '''better''' it became at its function. "Practice Makes Perfect." An electromagnetic pistol that started out barely capable of "plinking" had, by the end of the book, been "practiced" to the point that a single shot blasted a '''large''' hole through a fortress wall.<ref>And the wall had been behind the prisoner -- and the stake he was tied to -- the shot '''disintegrated'''.</ref> Captives improvised a saw from a zipper, to cut their way out of prison; by the time they escaped, the zipper's plastic teeth had become ideally-shaped saw teeth — of '''diamond'''.
 
== [[Live -Action TV]] ==
 
== Live Action TV ==
* In ''[[Doctor Who]]'', hiding in a really old building can keep the [[Clock Roaches|Reapers]] away from you. For a while.
* In ''[[Deadliest Warrior]]'', the pre-Biblical Spartans were shown to outmatch enemies who wielded technology more than a thousands years more advanced than their own {{spoiler|because of their incredibly deadly bronze-age shields}}.
 
== [[Tabletop Games]] ==
 
== Tabletop Games ==
* A standard trope in ''[[Dungeons & Dragons]]''. If something is described as "Ancient", there is a 90% chance its better than its modern equivalent.
** Semi-averted in ''[[Forgotten Realms]]'': After the [[Gotterdammerung|Fall of Netheril]] the world's magic circuitry is broken. Alas, it's impossible to cast spells as powerful as Mavin's Worldweave or Proctiv's Seal Crystal Sphere (11 level). On the other hand? There's constant development—Netheril in his prime had nothing as efficient as Virus Charm or Sammaster's Spellcaster. Even magic items of relatively recent era of Myth Drannor are sometimes fabled and sometimes plain inferior (like protections [[Overclocking Attack|exploding on overload]]).
*** Of course, Myth Drannor itself is "fabled" because humans ran in, got some of the old elven magical knowledge and began to ''rapidly develop'' on it, dragging elves along. [[JustAll AsAccording Plannedto Plan]], since the Coronal made this unpopular decision after observing a few Mage Fairs and coming to the conclusion that though he and a handful of others are [[Too Much for Man to Handle|more powerful]], he wants the best human wizards to work with his folk, if and while possible.
* A major element in the ''[[BattleTech]]'' and ''[[Mechwarrior]]'' universe. Most of the galaxy's technological and industrial base ended up getting smashed in a lengthy series of civil war, losing them the ability to produce their highly advanced technology. Thus, newer mechs tend to be less capable in combat when paired up against similar mechs that were built hundreds of years earlier. Of course, if you HAVE such an old (but powerful) mech, you try to make sure it gets the best of maintenance so it will continue to be the best.
** This was only true up to around 3040. Modern designs like the ''Hauptmann'' and ''Uriel'' are at least as good as their Star League counterparts, and the Clans, who were unaffected by the Succession Wars, field mechs that are ''vastly'' superior to equipment from ''any'' era in the Inner Sphere.
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** Chaos avert this in that they are constantly coming up with new stuff or, rather, are prepared to let their [[Eldritch Abomination|gods]] change their old stuff in unpredictable ways (that usually involve lots of [[Spikes of Villainy|spikes]] as well) for them.
** The Tau, on the other hand, avert this entirely; as the naive upstart race they are constantly updating and upgrading their technology, seeking alliances with other species and generally acting entirely counter to the tone of the setting...unless you are foolish enough to get in their way.
 
 
== [[Video Games]] ==
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* ''[[The Elder Scrolls]]'' roll on this. Ancient Dwemer and Elven armors are better than modern day armors, despite being made (ostensibly) from the same kind of materials. Only armors made of specifically rarer material, such as Glass, Ebony or Daedric Ebony, are better.
** Averted in Skyrim in a way that applies to the rest of the series: dwarven armor is made from dwarven metal, which can only be found in dwarven ruins (in the form of dwarven-made metal objects). Once you have the metal, you can make dwarven armor to your heart's content, and even improve upon it beyond what you'll find sitting around the ruins.
* ''[[Dragon Age]]: Origins]] - Awakening'' has the Sentinel Armor Set, easily the best Massive Armor in the expansion. According to the lore, however, it belonged to the Grey Warden who killed the very first Archdemon ''over one thousand years ago''.
* In ''[[Diablo II]]'' (and clones) all of the items with more obscure ancient names are for some reason better.
* ''[[RuneScape]]'' has a lot of equipment originating from thousands of years past the current year of the game and these are some of the best equipment available...usually.
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* Top-tier equipment (not just unique artifacts and relics) in ''[[Might and Magic]]'' tends towards the old, generally for one of three reasons: it was made with the help of the [[Lost Technology|Heavenly Forge]], it is so costly and complicated to make that most examples in existence are [[Ancestral Weapon|Ancestral]], or it is made from materials [[Unobtainium|no longer available, or at least very, very rare]].
 
== [[Web ComicComics]] ==
 
* Played with in [https://web.archive.org/web/20100816020324/http://pc.gamespy.com/articles/583/583805p1.html this ''Flintlocke'' cartoon]:
== [[Web Comic]] ==
* Played with in [http://pc.gamespy.com/articles/583/583805p1.html this Flintlocke cartoon]:
{{quote|'''Kathrena:''' "Flintlocke, I don't know if this quest you found for the ''ultimate goblin engineered weapon'' is legitimate. It's written in crayon."
'''Flintlocke:''' "''ANCIENT'' crayon!" }}
* [[Yehuda Moon and The Kickstand Cyclery|Yehuda Moon]] is a very traditional cyclists, to the point where he almost worships the luddite-centric Lauderblumenthal Leaflet.
 
 
== [[Western Animation]] ==
* In one episode of ''[[Thundercats]]ThunderCats (1985 series)|the original ''ThunderCats'']], Mumm-Ra is poking around in disguise by a (you guessed it) ancient pyramid. He's trying to open the lock on the door, and muses, "Ah, a very ancient lock design, unknown on Third Earth for a thousand years. Unknown, that is, except to one who has ''lived'' for a thousand years!"
** Mumm-Ra's transformation sequence implies that, despite being a thousand years old, he gets his powers from statues called the "Ancient Spirits of Evil" who are even older.
 
 
== [[Real Life]] ==
* Wine and spirits improve with age, at least according to the connoiseursconnoisseurs who drink them.
** The word "vintage" originally meant the collection of grape vines (farm and year) that a wine was made from; the fact that this word has come to mean "aged to perfection" in popular speech attests to the Older Is Better notion among wine snobs.
** They do generally improve, but after a while they become undrinkable. Wine will decay into vinegar (literally "sour wine").
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* Guitarists still prefer tube amplifiers over transistor amplifiers because of the warmer and more organic output of the tube amp.
* The vinyl LP record is still preferred over compact disks and other binary musical formats by connoisseurs.
* Many photographers never use the full automatic mode when transitioning from film camera to digital. They achieve better results on manual mode - they are used to it and can use it to obtain best results. Full automatics usually are set to "discernible in most possible cases" which by definition is suboptimal for specific cases, so even an operator with small experience can do better. A photographer considers ''the specific scene'' and ''the desired impression'' to decide what parameter is more important (shutter time depends on how fast the objects move, and whether you ''want'' some motion blur, etc.), and what deviations from the average are desirable or undesirable (sometimes it's fine to allow light parts be a bit lighter, and sometimes dark parts a bit darker) — that's part of why it's considered an art. People who worked with a film camera tend to at least understand what aperture, shutter and focal depth ''do'', even if the sensor is not the same. While people who come from cellphone cams / webcams and other "soapboxes" with pinprick aperture didn't see the differences obvious with any halfway good lenses and usually need a lot of experiments to "feel" the optics.
** They also favor their extant old lenses, which usually are metal and glass, over more modern all-plastic lenses, which are lighter and cheaper but less robust.
* "Lindy effect" is a simple heuristic for how long you can expect something to stay around in future: just as long as it already was around (obviously, it applies to phenomena that are subject to selection, like species or art forms, not perishable ones like cakes and people, or purely random like unstable isotope atoms).
 
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