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My Country, Right or Wrong: Difference between revisions
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The title is a common variation from a quote from American naval commander Stephen Decatur, as seen above. Later, American Senator Carl Schurz gave his own interpretation: "My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right."
Compare [[My Master, Right or Wrong]], [[Lawful Stupid]], [[Just Following Orders]]. ''Please'' do not confuse with [[Country Matters]], which is about something else entirely.
{{noreallife|the nature of patriotism, and indeed the question of whether patriotism in ''any'' form is desirable, is a [[YMMV Trope]], and we don't need the [[Edit War]]s.}}
{{examples}}
▲== Anime & Manga ==
* Most of the cast of ''[[Fullmetal Alchemist]]'' are soldiers of the evil Amestris. The average soldier only cares about fighting for their country and the good of the people, it just so happens that it involves the occasional massacre. Roy Mustang's entire storyline is about his plan to overthrow Fuehrer King Bradley, who, like the ''Gundam'' example below, is based off of Hitler. Roy can then become the new leader so he can bring peace to Amestris.
* A few of the Zeon from ''[[Mobile Suit Gundam]]'' are portrayed as this. It just so happens that Gihren Zabi is [[A Nazi
** Many characters from various ''Gundam'' series are examples, though countries seldom matter and it's often loyalty to other institutions, e.g. ''[[Mobile Suit Gundam 00]]'' has Sergei Smirnov, who dislikes actions such as the HRL's Supersoldier project or the world government's A-Law's actions, but he stays loyal to them.
* It's a given, considering the series, but several countries in ''[[Axis Powers Hetalia]]'' are portrayed as this, epecially WWII Germany, who expresses open disgust at some of the orders he's been given, but has to follow them anyway.
* The Britannians in ''[[Code Geass]]'', even if their rulers oppress others and promote racial supremacy.
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* ''[[Naruto]]'': Danzo lives this trope. His catchphrase could be 'for the good of Konoha.'
** {{spoiler|Uchiha Itachi as well. Even in death he is loyal to Konoha.}} Most of his plans were devoted to imparting this mindset on {{spoiler|his brother Sasuke}} as well. Things didn't exactly turn out that way.
== Comic Books ==
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** As of the [[War of Kings]] event, {{spoiler|Gladiator is the one holding the Throne}}.
* Eric Finch, Chief of New Scotland Yard in the ''[[V for Vendetta]]'' graphic novel. Helping to keep his country afloat in its hour of need, he tells the [[Big Bad]] his disdain for the fascist Norsefire Coalition right to the man's face. The Leader replies that it's a measure of his respect for Finch's craft that he's still alive to say that. {{spoiler|In the end, Finch decides that upholding such a regime isn't worth the price.}}
* Former [[Captain America (comics)]] USAgent (as opposed to the actual Captain, whose duty is not to whoever is elected to lead America, or the organisations formed by America, but the ideals of America), and also the Iron Cross, who fought for Germany in WWII for precisely these reasons.
* Hans von Hammer, protagonist of DC's ''[[Enemy Ace]]'' feature and WWI pilot for Germany, especially in Garth Ennis' ''War In Heaven'' (WWII) version. However, when he discovered the Nazi death camps of the Final Solution in the final days of the war, that was the last straw for him and he led a mutiny with his unit.
* Subvert in the Dave Gibbons/Will Simpson re-imagining of 2000AD series, [[Rogue Trooper]]. The Genetic Infantry are shown to be an elite band of highly-motivated, unshakable soldiers, but they show no interest in the cause which they serve. Their motivation is drawn from genetic and psychology conditioning and a fierce bond of brotherhood.
* One version of ''The Unknown Soldier'', a bandaged character from DC Comics. The long-lived soldier snapped upon seeing a Nazi concentration camp. He decided that since the USA fought against something this horrible, whatever they fight against is the right thing to oppose.
* This is what happened to the character of [[Superman]] in ''[[The Dark Knight Returns]]'', though that was not in canon, where he's frequently refused to do favors for the U.S. government if he feels they are wrong, especially when [[Lex Luthor]] was President. His attitude towards the city of Metropolis however, is closer to this trope.
** Superman doesn't believe in
{{quote|
* Played with in the strip by Argentinian cartoonist [[Quino]] titled [http://www.ghira.mistral.co.uk/mipais.gif "Mi Pais (My Country)"].
{{quote|
'''Man:''' Put "contradictory"... }}
== Film ==
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** Hauptman Muesel in ''[[The Guns of Navarone]]''.
** General Wilhem Bittrich in ''[[A Bridge Too Far]]''.
** The [[La Résistance|German Resistance]] in ''[[Valkyrie (
** The German sergeant who nobly refuses to give up intelligence information in ''[[Inglourious Basterds]]'' and {{spoiler|gets [[Batter Up|his head bashed in with a baseball bat]] for it}}.
** More recently, the Japanese during WWII began to receive the same treatment (especially in ''[[Letters From Iwo Jima]]'').
* Centauri 7's attitude in ''[[Hunter Prey]]''.
== Literature ==
* Anton, the hero of ''Summer of my German Soldier''.
* Several of the more sympathetic Havenite characters in the ''[[
** Indeed, Cachat's [[The Plan]] in "Fanatic" depended on the majority of the Havenite officers and enlisted being decent people, ''including'' many of the [[State Sec]] officers (consider that [[State Sec]] is normally presented as [[Lawful Evil]], and only ''mildly'' lawful at that). Of course, a man in Cachat's position would be in a position to guess which way those particular [[State Sec]] officers would move.
** Another Havenite example was Amos Parnell, the former head of their space navy. Thought executed, he was discovered and rescued from a prison planet, and despite having every reason to utterly hate the current government of Haven, refused to provide intelligence that would directly assist the Manticorans in battle against Havenite forces. However, he does testify about the coup and helps destroy the new government's prestige.
{{quote|'''Admiral Parnell''': Still, I suppose a little of that same idealism still clings to me, too. What an amazing thing. Forty years of naval service, dozens of cold-blooded campaigns under my belt - hell, I'm the one who drew up the plans to begin ''this'' war! I screwed them up, of course, but I was damned straight the one who authorized 'em. And eight more years here on Hell, on top of all that. And still there's something down inside me that insists the drunk-rolling whore I served is a great, shining lady who deserves to have me lay down my life in her defense.}}
*** In contrast, he convinces the much younger and more idealistic Havenite officer Warner Caslet to defect. When Caslet attempts to invoke this trope, Parnell shuts him down. "Son, you don't have a country anymore." Consider that recent circumstances outside his control had pretty much guaranteed that Caslet would be executed or [[Unperson|disappeared]] if he returned to Havenite territory.
** Thomas Theisman articulates this thought several times when considering Alfredo Yu, his own mentor who defected, and Warner Caslet, one of his subordinates whom he considers an honest, integral man who wanted nothing more than to defend his nation and was driven into defection. Theisman understands and empathises with them both, while still deciding that he cannot follow in their footsteps because he is loyal to the Republic, if not to its leadership. Theisman himself, however, is someone who takes the full Schulz quote as his motto, including the part about "if wrong, to be set right." {{spoiler|At the end of Book 9, he shoots Citizen Chairman Saint-Just and restores the old Republic.}}
* Many imperials in the [[Star Wars]] universe use varying degrees of this trope. Some desert right away after Battle of Endor. Others remain loyal until the interim government implodes. Some defect or desert after they become sickened by their commanding officers or realize that the Empire has lost unity.
** Pellaeon remains loyal to the person who has the most legal claim to the government and later commands the Remnant. However, as time goes on he realizes that the Remnant must change it's racist policies to survive.
* Günter Bischoff, the U-Boat captain in ''[[Cryptonomicon]]'' starts off like this (he's definitely not a Nazi), but ends up just looking for a way out of the whole thing.
* Oberst Kurt Steiner from ''The Eagle Has Landed''. He actually risked his life trying to save a Jewish girl from death. He is then court-martialed, along with a platoon of his men. They are then given the job of kidnapping Churchill. One of them rescues a local girl from a water wheel and is killed in the process. So it is obvious that they are good guys, yet they still fight for Nazi Germany. In an aversion, it is hinted that {{spoiler|Steiner hesitates when he has a chance to shoot Churchill because he knows it is wrong, and is himself then shot and apparently killed}}.
* ''Soldier X'' might fit here. The main character talks about how, as a teacher, the new students always stare at him because he is missing an arm. When they inevitably ask about it, he reveals that he lost it in WWII and someone always comments "it had to be done". However, the main character was a conscript in the Wehrmacht (although it is a little more complicated...).
* In ''[[The Three Musketeers (
* In ''[[
* Eric von Shrakenberg of ''[[The Draka]]'' takes this trope to a whole new level, given that the country he is fighting for is the Domination of Draka, which makes Nazi Germany look tame by comparison. Although he views the Draka ideology and society as a cultural dead-end, he is arguably the single most important individual in Draka history, playing a key role in both the [[World War II|Eurasian War]] and [[World War III|The Final War]].
* In ''[[
* A minor recurring theme in the [[1632]] series, as we repeatedly see people from "enemy" nations who recognize based on the foresight/hindsight provided by reading the uptime history books that their countries are in the wrong at LEAST practically if not morally (such as upholding serfdom), but serve their country regardless even when rulers fail to recognize the warnings.
== Live-Action TV ==
* Bryce from ''[[Max Headroom]]'' is loyal to the TV company Network XXIII, to the point of trying to kill Edison Carter in the first episode. But Bryce is doing it only because it was ordered of him, and he bears no genuine malice. He just wants to play with computers.
** This is only true of Bryce in the American version, however; in the original British Made-for-TV movie, Bryce is not only wholly unsympathetic, but killing Carter ''is his idea in the first place''.
* ''[[Star Trek:
* In ''[[Star Trek: Deep Space Nine]]'', this trope is Gul Dukat's explanation for switching his allegiance to the new, democratic Cardassian government in an earlier season. The fact that this quasi-[[Heel Face Turn]] took place shortly after it became obvious that the old regime was going to lose [[Blatant Lies|is purely coincidental]].
* A variation of this is spoken of by [[The Captain|Jonathan Archer]] in ''[[Star Trek: Enterprise]]'' in the [[Mirror Universe]] episode "In a Mirror, Darkly", where he claims that Starfleet officers are loyal to the Terran Emperor, not the person currently occupying the throne. All one has to do is to successfully overthrow the government and name oneself Emperor, and the military will support him or her.
* In the ''[[Babylon 5]]'' episode "Endgame", General Lefcourt leads the ships loyal to the Clark regime. As he puts it, "I'm from the old school: a soldier doesn't take up arms against his own government, no matter how justified you feel doing it." That said, when {{spoiler|President Clark sets up Earth's defense grid to scorch the planet rather than let Sheridan win, Lefcourt destroys the last orbital defense platform that Sheridan's fleet couldn't reach.}} Of course, he only did so after {{spoiler|Clark was dead, and thus no longer President; given Luchenko's rise to Presidency, presumably Earthgov has an analogue of the [[Twenty-Fifth Amendment]].}} It turns out that many members of Earthforce had that same mindset, including {{spoiler|Babylon 5's later CO, Captain Elizabeth Lochley}}. [https://web.archive.org/web/20180828000146/http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/guide/086.html
** Lefcourt's mindset does invite the question whether he would have followed an immoral order and allowed the {{spoiler|orbital defense grid}} to kill millions of people. The real-life section of [[Screw the Rules, I'm Doing What's Right]] has an example where the Prussian officer was expected to violate an order.
** Many officers refused to obey immoral orders during the Earth Alliance Civil War. [
* On ''[[Highlander the Series]]'', Duncan fought for the North in the [[American Civil War|Civil War]]. He met another immortal who fought for the South. He said that the other immortal was on the wrong side; the other immortal acknowledged that he was, but said that he had made ties with his neighbors and friends and didn't feel like he could turn away from them.
* In the ''[[Doctor Who]]'' episode "Doomsday", Yvonne Hartman (leader of Torchwood in 2007) did her duty "for queen and country" {{spoiler|even after being upgraded to a Cyberman.}}
* Rankol in the 2007 ''[[Flash Gordon (TV series)|Flash Gordon]]'', who explains to Princess Aura, before his apparent [[Heel Face Turn]], that his loyalty is to the ruler of Mongo - whomever that may be.
* In a very early ''[[Mission: Impossible]]'' episode, "The Reluctant Dragon," the main villian, played marvelously by character actor John Colicos, is well aware of the evils of his country's oppressive policies, but carries on as Security Minister because he's loyal to his country, and insulates himself in cultural pursuits. It's not hard to imagine that things would be much worse with someone else in his place, and he ends up being probably the most sympathetic villian in the series' history; as he lies shot at the end, he even generates a degree of compassion and respect from Rollin, who takes time to help staunch the bleeding before making his escape.
== Music ==
* [[Midnight Oil]] [[Title Drop|title drops]] this trope in their song ''My Country'', though it is more a critique of [[Patriotic Fervor]] than this trope specifically.
{{quote|
The flag a camouflage for your deceiving [...]
And did I hear you say:
My country right or wrong
My country oh so strong
My country going wrong }}
** As do Levellers in a few of theirs, most interestingly, in England My Home
{{quote|
My green and pleasant land? }}
** German punk band Die Toten Hosen's "Tausend gute Gründe" lists "a thousand good reasons to be proud of this country" only to admit that at the moment, they can't actually come up with a single one.
== Tabletop Games ==
* A common depiction of the Imperial Guard in ''[[Warhammer
== Theatre ==
* Anatoly Sergievsky of ''Chess'', a rather timid and awkward man hounded by the press as to why he still supports his country of Soviet Russia. He proceeds to sing "Anthem":
{{quote|
== Video Games ==
* Most of the Covenant in ''[[Halo (
* The ''[[Fire Emblem]]'' series in general does it too many times to count (although, in most cases, a childhood friend or relative will be able to convince them to defect).
** Camus the Sable from ''Shadow Dragon'' is somewhat tragic as he was a kind-hearted and brilliant man but valued his country above all else. Technically, it is possible not to kill him in ''FE11'' but it is very hard and you miss out on a powerful weapon. Luckily, {{spoiler|he is back and recruitable in the 3rd game.}}
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* ''[[System Shock]] 2'' includes the Von Braun, an experimental faster-than-light starship. Without giving away any spoilers, let's just say it could be that the game creators meant it as an ironic name rather than an honor.
* While not a soldier in anyway, the character Nathan from ''[[Fallout 3]]'' believes all the Enclave (former US government) propaganda he hears and seems adverse to questioning the government in general if you talk to him about it. It can be entertaining to argue with him using examples from the US Declaration of Independence and Bill of Rights; he'll eventually cut off the discussion for the explicit reason that you might convince him. {{spoiler|Ultimately, though, he may warn you, if still alive later, to get away from the Enclave before they catch you, as he was in the Raven Rock base.}}
* In ''[[Fallout: New Vegas]]'', Veronica is loyal to the Brotherhood of Steel, despite believing that they will slowly die out if they don't change their isolationist and xenophobic ways. At the end of her personal quest, she'll either choose to stay with them or leave them, {{spoiler|where she will see just how fanatical they can be when it comes to those with progressive thoughts.}} The current Elder, Nolan McNamara, has similar beliefs, but is hindered by his fear of the NCR and an unwillingness to go against tradition and commit outright heresy.
** Similarly, we have Craig Boone, former NCR Sniper. Despite his disagreement with certain actions, {{spoiler|like the Bitter Springs massacre}}, he is still a strong supporter of them, and will outright refuse to come with you if you get on their bad side.
* Despite attempting to invade half a dozen countries at once to expand its borders and avoid an economic crisis, Belka in ''[[Ace Combat Zero]]'' had corps of extremely loyal pilots proud of their own nation. In an interesting game concept, there are cutscenes of interviews of the Belkan pilots the player fought, depicting them as obviously likable men ten years after the war.
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** In ''II'', Culgan and Seed.
** Jowy loves his country and would rather reform it by {{spoiler|taking out [[Complete Monster|Luca Blight]] using [[Xanatos Speed Chess]]}} than see it ravaged by war thanks to the disjointed alliance that is the city states.
** The Zexen Knights in ''III'' open the game as this as they, Chris in particular, are opposed to the Zexen council's motives. This leads to a bit of [[The Atoner]] with Chris ({{spoiler|and Salome removes the corrupt councilmen}}).
** Sasarai in ''III'' is this. He's not all that elated with seeking out the True Runes in the grasslands, but follows through until the issue becomes much larger. Then he finds out that he {{spoiler|is an [[Artificial Human]] cloned from the dear leader as a placeholder for a true rune}}. Despite this, he still goes back to his position once the war is over.
** ''IV'' has Troy. Given the trend of the games to have these types of characters eventually come around in the end, many fans were disappointed in the lack of a [[Heel Face Turn]], given that he was one of the few interesting characters in the game.
** In ''V'', there is a distinct divide on the Queen's nights concerning the Godwin rule. While some of the knights are quick to align with the prince, some align with the Godwins, and another considers his duty to Queen and country rather than any faction.
* General Forsythe in ''[[Advance Wars]]: Days of Ruin'' fights only for the glory of his country, treats commanding officers and soldiers in the New Rubinelle Army with honor and dignity, and refuses to use Caulder's doomsday weapons to take them out. In the one mission where you go toe-to-toe with Forsythe, he actually ''comes and gives you advice on how to beat him''. His AI is not aggressive, as he usually tries to beat you by blocking factories and sending infantries straight to your HQ. When you do beat Forsythe, {{spoiler|he surrenders without a fight, on the sole condition that his army is treated with dignity, and he takes all the blame that his comrades deserve.}} Honestly, {{spoiler|considering that the player is fighting under Admiral Greyfield's banner}}, it could be argued that ''you're'' on the "bad" side at that point in the game.
** In dialogue, it's implied that {{spoiler|Greyfield was the aggressor}}, and explicitly stated that Forsythe was called out of retirement to defend Lazuria.
* Can be utilized by both the antagonists and protagonists in ''[[Ogre Battle]]: March of the Black Queen''. A good amount of the enemy generals feel this way, and if you're enough of a dick or just plain unlucky (damn you tarots to hell!), yours begin to think this way as well. [[Cute Witch|Except for Deneb]], [[All Girls Want Bad Boys|of course.]]
* Sam Carter from ''[[
* This is the attitude of Baldus in ''[[Blaze Union]].'' In the A route, he's the last general left defending the capital against Gulcasa's revolution, and ([[Puzzle Boss|so long as you follow Nessiah's directions to the letter]]) is persuaded into a neat little [[Heel Face Turn]] when Gulcasa points out that the revolution has Bronquia's best interests in mind. Having gotten to know Gulcasa earlier and thus being familiar with his struggles to protect the civilians, Baldus not only joins up enthusiastically, but winds up [[Parental Substitute|developing a great deal of paternal affection for him]] after this.
* In ''[[World of Warcraft]]'', loyalty to your faction - be it Alliance or Horde - is absolute for PCs and almost absolute for NPCs. While infighting among the leaders is common and the player can often disobey a morally questionable - or outright evil - demand given by a faction leader through [[Loophole Abuse]], outright treason towards the faction itself is unheard of.
* In ''[[Naval Ops|Warship Gunner 2]]'', Admiral Amagi of the Imperial Japanese Navy initially aids the player character because Japan is an ally of your nation, but later becomes a recurring enemy when Japan aligns with [[The Empire]]. {{spoiler|So does Captain Tsukuba if he doesn't become your adjutant.}}
* Nords loyal to the remains of the Empire in ''[[The Elder Scrolls V
== Western Animation ==
* Crosses over with [[My Master, Right or Wrong]] in ''[[
* General Shiva from ''[[Exo Squad]]'', despite all the atrocities that Phaeton or the other generals, Draconis or Typhonus, commit, he stays loyal to the Neo Sapien regime since he is a soldier. It becomes a [[Tear Jerker]] when he dies in his final battle, which seemed to be used since [[You Have Outlived Your Usefulness|he had outlived his usefulness to Phaeton]], who was already phasing out the Neo Sapiens with the Neo Lords.
* What seems to be going on (due largely to extremely intense propaganda starting in elementary education) with a large portion of the Fire Nation military in [[
** Iroh, significantly, appears to have decided this and then waited passively for five years for the right opportunity; before this he seems to have been a poster child for this trope.
* Unicorns in ''[[Gravity Falls]]'' seem to have a "My Species, Right or Wrong" approach. While two of them scold Celestabethabelle for being a liar who takes advantage of humans simply for fun, they still side with her when violence breaks out.
{{reflist}}
[[Category:
[[Category:Authority Tropes]]
[[Category:The Only Righteous Index of Fanatics]]
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[[Category:Politics Tropes]]
[[Category:Villains]]
[[Category:Loyalty Tropes]]
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