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Spoony Bard: Difference between revisions
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* Alternately, bards can be built to specialize in status effect abilities. This ''can'' often be a wonderful way to add a new role to the game, it's in [[An Adventurer Is You]] as "Buffers" and "Mezzers" for a reason. In games where enemies can have powers that disable your own characters, having a character that can disable them first, or provide your teammates immunity to their tricks is a great boon. This often falls flat, however, because the status effects in many games are actually [[Useless Useful Spell|Useless Useful Spells]]. This problem is often exacerbated by having fairly short fights in many games where the standard [[Mook]] enemies you mow through are only meant to turn the game into an endurance match, anyway. A spell or song that gives a +30% attack bonus is only a useful bonus if you are actually going to attack at least four times with that status effect on - if not, congratulations, you just wasted a turn. Even if boss fights are fairly long, if the bard specializes in nothing but debuff spells, the enemy may be [[Contractual Boss Immunity|immune]], and the buff spells may simply not be useful enough to justify using a bard instead of another character.
It is worth noting that oftentimes, bard-type characters are Spoony Bards because the game makers simply didn't think things through when they made the class and didn't do proper balancing. Typically, when a class is "weak and worthless," especially in MMORPGs, other classes will be [[Nerf|nerfed]], or the bards will get additional beneficial gimmicks to make them useful and avoid an inevitable revolt by the players.
On the other hand not everyone plays just for the thrill of the kill and some gamers want to avoid [[Complacent Gaming Syndrome]], so the ability to play with a "fun" mechanic or to try something new is sometimes worth the loss of effectiveness.
The term "Spoony Bard" itself, incidentally, comes from [[Final Fantasy IV]] - it was originally used as a [[Woolseyism]] insult at Edward (a bard), but so many fans of the game saw him as a useless waste of a party slot, thanks to being a status-effect character in a [[Useless Useful Spell]] game, and even worse, having the command "Hide" that does [[Exactly What It Says on the Tin]], (making him not just weak, but a [[Dirty Coward]] to boot,) that the players themselves took up the amusing insult to Edward, and the bard class in general.
Keep in mind that simply having a "Bard" class is not sufficient - they have to be ''spoony'' bards - that is, if bards are powerful and useful, and virtually all parties will want one, then they aren't really a spoony bard. If a bard is a generalist with magic, but is actually powerful at spellcasting, they may instead be [[The Red Mage]]. Also, the class doesn't have to have anything to do with music or bards to be a spoony bard, they simply have to try to perform the same function that most spoony bards do, which is messing with status effects in a game where [[Useless Useful Spell|status effects are useless]] or giving ability point bonuses or penalties that are too minor to make up for not simply making another fighter.
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** Mostly averted in [http://www.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/dramp/20081103 fourth edition. Bards] are a "leader" class (healer/buffer/debuffer) like Clerics and Warlords, and are neither conspicuously better nor conspicuously worse at that role than those classes; they'll be solid contributors to any party that isn't overloaded with such characters. Bards tend to focus more on debuffs than the others, which have their own specialties too. In a nod to their "jack of all trades" style in previous editions, they are the only class that can take multiclass feats corresponding to more than one other class.
*** In 4th Edition, the ''Cleric'' class [[Linear Warriors, Quadratic Wizards|of all people]] very easily led to this trope--especially before the lion's share of the [[Splatbooks]] came out. The class was (and is) the most eclectic in the game, with a lot of powers bordering on useless and/or counterproductive to the role. Fortunately, due to the lowered ability density of 4th Edition they still retain(ed) their [[Game Breaker]] status (as least [[Obvious Rule Patch|before the errata onslaught anyway]]) to a player who knows what they're doing. To one that doesn't, they're this trope.
* And then there was [http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/classes/bard.html#bard Pathfinder. The Bard] now supplies large bonuses to his party without it taking up his actions and has class features which grant him "virtual" skills by allowing Perform to double up for two more skills. In addition, the Bard is able to use all Knowledges without training, and half his level is added as a bonus. You have a class which buffs his whole team, is a skill monkey, and without spending a single skill point is likely to know more about everything than the rest of the party combined, plus serves as a natural face for the group. Sure, the Bard is still not a powerhouse in combat, but in any but the most hack-n-slash campaigns, it's a solid, non-spoony choice.
* The [[Returners Final Fantasy Roleplaying Game]] practically inverts this trope, especially in relation to the [[Trope Namer]]. They can endlessly throw around group affecting buffs and debuffs for free while still doing decent magical damage and they can use Hide to avoid predictable attacks making them very valuable against both tough mobs and bosses. Their main weakness, just to further separate them from [[Final Fantasy IV|Edward]], is a tendency to go last.
* [[Warhammer 40000]] has the iconic Tactical Squad, which can be given a Missile Launcher (with two types of ammo, one for anti-tank and one for anti-horde), a flame thrower for close ranged combat, the sergeant being tooled up for actual close combat, and can be split into two squads so that the close combat half can move and cap objectives while the heavy weapon guy can sit back and shoot. They can also take a Razorback Transport, which can bring the Close combat half up to the enemy while providing another heavy weapon, which is mobile. To top it off, they're pretty cheap for what you pay for. This all ''looks'' good on paper, as they can theoretically take on any threat they see, it's actually horrifying bad, as they cannot put enough shots/attacks to ''kill'' whatever threat they see. Especially glaring is the Missile launcher, whose anti-horde firing mode in theory can hit multiple targets, but because of coherency rules, it'll likely hit no more than 2, and that's if it's ''lucky'' (and on top of that, there's roughly a 75% chance of the target in question surviving anyways). The only reason they are still widely used is because the only alternative to fill the standard marine's troop choice is the badly-priced Scouts, which are roughly the same cost as marines, but lack their stats and survivability in lieu of other rules. In armies that gives the player another choice for troops, Tactical Marines are almost universally passed up in favor of those.
* ''[[Magic: The Gathering]]'' gave us kobolds, a tribe as weak as physically possible without going straight to the graveyard, but cost nothing to play. They [[Magikarp Power|can be upgraded with other kobolds]], but these tend to come out on turn three or later, and the bonus isn't that much. And they're all in red, a color known for [[Leeroy Jenkins|winning fast, or not at all]].
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*** The ''FFT'' remake for the PSP has been more forgiving for the siblings, as it made their spells more reliable, upping the number of times it can theoretically hit to nine, and raising the chance it can hit the center tile target, so that one can center the spell on an enemy and expect it to hit at least once.
** I'm sorry, I must have come in late in the discussion. Did you just say the second most powerful party in the game was composed of three dancers and two mimes?
* ''[[Final Fantasy Tactics A2]]'' has an actual bard as a unique character ... and he's quite spoony, since unlike [[Game Breaker|Final Fantasy Tactics unique characters]], FFTA2 has absolutely terrible stat growth in unique classes. His bard songs aren't of much help, since only his MP boosting power offers something another class can't already do with a better range of alternate actions, and dedicating a unit to boosting MP would only be of use if you had multiple mages trading out Halve MP or Blood Price for Geomancy or Magic UP while staying in formation. Fortunately, he can learn from other classes, like Juggler or Time Mage, but depending on what level you were when you recruited him, his low stats will ensure he never can quite compete with a generic specifically leveled for certain stats.
** He does make up for it with two songs. Undead Requiem does massive damage to zombie type monsters at long range and can remove multiple tombstones at once (the tombstones revert back to the zombie monster after a set amount of turns have passed). Nameless Song gives multiple units random buffs (Ranging from Haste, Reflect, Reraise, Shell, Protect, and Regen) without costing any MP at all. This is an improved version of the same ability Nu Mou Scholars can do, which only affects one person and costs MP to use.
*** And the strategy of multiple mages in formation works relatively well with Illusionists who have the High Magic second ability for the Magic Frenzy attack and the Dual Wield support ability-- a strategy that allows a character two make one magic attack and two physical attacks against every enemy on the screen but consumes MP at a prodigious rate.
** The game also uses the Spoony Bard thing as an insult; in one of the Bonga Bugle missions, one of the enemy units calls [[Leeroy Jenkins|the Head Editor]] a "spoony seeq".
* In ''[[Final Fantasy XI]]'' the Bard is an example of the Gamebreaker side, it is so popular (due to its completely free buffs) that most people say that you can get offers for [[Level Grinding]] parties without raising your invite flag (to signify that you are looking for a party); this gets to the point to which some people have to go into anonymous mode (which hides what job and level your character is) to avoid getting invites. Though this has happened with other jobs, bards are pretty much the only one that has always been like this. [[Summon Magic|Summoners]], traditionally the most powerful job in [[Final Fantasy]] games, fits this trope on the other side due to being able to do useful things less frequently than any other job.
** Unless you get the right gear to reduce the mana upkeep to zero, then you can kick some serious ass. ESPECIALLY if you fire off the Avatars and get a decent subjob attached. Your DPS can go through the roof.
* ''[[Final Fantasy III]]'' had a nice variety of classes, but there were several that were either only useful once in the game or were so useless that they could be totally overlooked. Its version of the Bard class is ''even worse'' than FFIV's Edward, with little attack power or defense and only one command ("Cheer") that has any use whatsoever. The Scholar, similarly, has little attack or defensive power, but has the "Scan" command which is vital in ''exactly one'' battle in the game, against {{spoiler|Hyne}}. The DS remake, however, did make the Bard at least marginally useful. If you got Bard's Job levels high enough and equipped them with correct harp, they could restore at least 1000 HP to everyone instantly.
** Scholars also double the effectiveness of any items that they use. This includes the items that give you a free cast of high-level offensive magic like Blizzaga. Pair them up with a Thief (to ensure a steady supply of items) and you've got a small nuke with no reliance on MP.
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* The Bard Class in ''[[Ever Quest]]'' is stated as a "Jack of All Trades, Master To None" in that it's sort of like multiple classes combined together. Unlike normal buff spells, the bard had to constantly keep "singing" almost non-stop and keep refreshing the songs over and over again every few SECONDS. Most players can successfully juggle 4 song buffs up at once. They can also wear Plate armor, and dual wield weapons (but not Double Attack.) Among the song types they have, they can increase run speed to being the fastest in the game (faster than the most powerful mounts), charm enemies, stun them, deal damage over time, and heal over time.
** Bards have been changed in ''[[Ever Quest]]''. They no longer have to press the singing keys every few seconds (this led to wrist problems for some players). They also have some pretty awesome abilities. A well played bard can be one of the most powerful classes, they can solo many mobs at once and in groups they can boost damage output by a huge amount. They also can single mobs from a pack of them with ease.
** The Bard classes in ''[[Ever Quest 2]]'' are broken down into "Orderly" and "Chaotic" versions. The Troubadour and Dirge, respectively. Each class has different types of buffs. The Troubador focuses more on defensive buffs such as raising defense and health, while the Dirge class is more offensive, who's buffs enhance attack speed and double attack damage, among others. Due to the game's Archetype system, both bards are classified as Scout classes, who are restricted to wearing Chain armor (unlike plate in the first game), but are designed to deal significant damage when facing behind an opponent. Literally backstabbing them. Also unlike the first game, however, they don't need to constantly "sing" their buffs for the group. Once you activate them, they stay that way until canceled.
*** Dirges are considered especially useful, as their ability to increase melee attack speed and power, which half the classes in the game and all of the pets benefit from, guarantees them a slot on almost any raid or group. When there are 24 different classes in the game and the largest raids in the game have 24 people with typically a few repeating classes, being pretty much guaranteed a slot is a big deal.
*** Among the 6 scout classes (Ranger, Assassin, Swashbuckler, Brigand, Troubadour, Dirge), the two bard classes are supposedly the "weakest" of the 6 in terms of sheer damage output, but when comparing the bards to classes outside the Scout archetype, that's not saying much. They still do more damage than most fighter, priest, and a couple of mage classes.
* Accordion Thieves are probably the weakest class in [[Kingdom of Loathing]]. They have the least number of combat skills, meaning you mostly just hit them with [[Musical Assassin|music]], where a muscle class does a better job of basic weapon attacks. They mainly rely on buffing themselves with some marginally useful songs. As a plus, they can sneak into the League of Chef-Magi and the Brotherhood of the Smackdown, letting you shop at all 3 guild shops and, if you have permed the skill, let you use the Wok of Ages and Malus of Forethought.
* ''Dungeon Explorer'' has a bard class which is considered one of the most useless classes in the game.
* Many, many, many ''[[Pokémon]]'' fall into this category. Because any player can choose from all of them, many tend to get ignored completely. This tends to lead to [[Magikarp Power]] when you realize that damn near any Pokémon can be used effectively if you raise them right and throw on some [[T Ms]]...Okay, ASIDE from Magikarp.
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** In addition to Gadabouts and Dancers, ''[[Dragon Quest VII]]'' includes an actual Minstrel/Bard class that, while not totally useless, deals mostly in status and curing songs, and is an underwhelming fighter. As before, you need to master this class (as well as the Gadabout and Dancer classes) in order to get the Luminary/TeenIdol class.
** Averted in ''[[Dragon Quest IX]]'', as the Minstrel plays more along the lines of the [[Jack of All Stats]] and is a decent fighter and spellcaster all around, which is a good thing, because you start out as one!<br />And then played straight with the Luminary (Dancer). Not only is it a pain to unlock (the quest requires finding a random dungeon with a specific [[Mook]] in it, [[Guide Dang It|which is a pain if you do not even know what type and what level dungeons they're even found in]]), which can take hours or even ''days'' if you're particularly unlucky with the random dungeons. Upon finally unlocking the Luminary, you are treated to a class with terrible stats(baring speed and charm, they're among the worst of all the available classes in the game), useless abilities, and awful equip options. And if that weren't enough, you don't even get to unlock the class until you beat the main story and start doing postgame content; making the effort put into getting the class that much more obnoxious.
* The MMO ''[[Eden Eternal]]'' has an interesting take on Bards. They are a support class with powerful but short lived multi-target buffs and heals, as well as an [[Ao E]] damage-over-time debuff. Bards hunt by using their speed buff on themselves, splashing a group of enemies with the
* Averted in [[Heroes of Might and Magic]] 4, more notably, the Gathering Storm expansion pack. The bard has maximum positive morale and top speed, that allows her to act before everyone else in battle, and possesses the mass fervor spell that provides maximum positive morale to every allied hero and creature. This becomes vital towards the end of the game when all the player has at their disposal are five heroes, each of a different alignment, meaning that they have maximum negative morale by default - a critical disadvantage.
* Averted in ''[[The Sims Medieval]]'', where the Hero Sims' professions are mostly equal in how awesome they can be (though different players might ''like'' different professions better.) The Bard is useful to the kingdom and has several good quests, including one territory conquest. No Bard who helps his king conquer territory (territory owned by ''pirates'' at that) is spoony.
* The Bard follower Sven in ''[[The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim]]'' isn't very useful, mostly being good for being a meat shield. However, it's actually [[Justified Trope|justifiable]] - he's a Bard. He makes his money by standing in an inn and entertaining people, what combat proficiency does he have?
** The Bard's College is also rather spoony compared to the other factions you can join, like the Companions, the College of Winterhold, or the Thieves Guild. They only have one trainer (for Speech) and three quests other than the initial quest to join up. In exchange, however, each quest gives you a substantial increase in skill points, so it's not entirely pointless to join up.
* Ricardo in ''[[Shadow Hearts From the New World]]'' is a bard but is ''far'' from spoony. Not only does he have ballistics inside his guitar, but he is one of the best mages in the game and plays a great support since he plays songs that buff allies. (Sadly, he is near-useless against the [[Final Boss]] due to its ability to instantly dispel any buffs ''and'' get a free turn when it does so.)
** His spiritual predecessor, Lucia in ''[[Shadow Hearts Covenant]]'' is the same, substituting songs for aromatherapy. However she also has a tarot card system as she's a fortune teller.
* The Bard-like class in ''[[Guild Wars]]'' is actually ''far'' from Spoony. They may not play music so much, but they shout and support allies (or debuff enemies) while putting pressure on enemies with their ranged weaponry. They have about as much armour as a ''warrior'' (And by default use shields) so they can certainly take several hits.
** They tend to be...different when it comes to [[PvP]] though. People often ignore paragons and save them for last in Random Arenas, but in different [[PvP]] modes (such as alliance battles) Paragons are much better.
* ''[[Inazuma Eleven]]'' gives us Handa Shinichi, a [[Jack of All Stats]]. In a [[Lazy Bum|really negative]] way.
* ''[[Fire Emblem]]'' has Dancers, Bards and, in the Gamecube and Wii games the Heron Tribe, whose main purpose is to refresh units that have already taken their turns and have no offensive capabilities. However, the SNES and DS games subvert this ''hard''; Dancers can use Swords in both of these subseries, and Bards are capable of using magic in the SNES games and are often among the best in their game, at the cost of being unable to refresh others (they don't even exist in the DS games).
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* Julie, the protagonist of ''[[Our Little Adventure]]''. She's [[The Archer|good with a bow]] and she's the only group member with any sort of healing powers but seldom ever kicks ass and takes names. Julie's [[Reluctant Warrior|dislike of fighting]] might play into it, but she's got no problem with [[Magic Music|boosting her groupmates' killing skills]] using [[Big Lipped Alligator Moment|silly musical numbers.]]
* Gamzee of ''[[Homestuck]]'' subverts this. Despite being a [[The Stoner|Stoner]] [[Love Freak]] and having the title of Bard of... Something (exactly what it is, he forgot), he takes down the [[Final Boss|Black King]] of the Trolls' session with ''[[Beware the Silly Ones|frightening]]'' efficency and brutality. Subverted even harder when we find out that he's actually the Bard of {{spoiler|''[[Ax Crazy|Rage.]]''}}
** Turns out that all Sburb bards are a subversion of this. The Bard class is described as one that allows others to destroy their Aspect or one who invites destruction through their Aspect, as if by the will of the Aspect. (e.g. {{spoiler|Rage}}) Seems unintuitive from the name, but useful.
** However, this makes the Bard class a [[Wild Card]] who often single-handedly causes improbable victory or spectacular downfall (or both), so it's played straight in that the person who tells us all of this is of the opinion that the kids are probably better off without a Bard.
* [[Captain SNES]] features Edward himself, being a bitter and angry soul after being tormented by the player, who hated Edward so much that he would go out of his way to make Edward die in battle immediately every time (because this would allow other characters to get more EXP), and to top it all off, he changed his name to ''Spoony''. {{spoiler|[[Laser-Guided Karma|Alex is the player.]] Cut to the Veldt and "Quief want to know, what Quief's name mean?"}}
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