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Grey and Gray Morality: Difference between revisions
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(This is a pretty...New South Revisionist argument. The North absolutely wanted to end slavery.) |
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{{trope}}
{{quote|'''Wesley:''' There is a line, Lilah, black and white, good and evil.
'''Lilah:''' Funny thing about black and white. You mix it together and you get grey. And it doesn't matter how much white you try and put back in, you're never gonna get anything but grey.
|''[[Angel]]'', "Habeas Corpses"}}
In an all-grey conflict, neither side is [[Black and White Morality|totally good or completely evil]]. Both sides have a strong, justifiable reason for fighting, and contain a mixture of people of all kinds, from admirable, upstanding individuals to vicious, slimy scumbags.
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Any betrayals within a [[Grey and Grey Morality]] Universe will, by their very nature, be [[Hazy Feel Turn]]s.
{{examples}}▼
▲{{examples}}
== Anime
* The entire Mahorafest arc of ''[[Mahou Sensei Negima]]'' fell under this, with the main characters unsure of whether they should allow [[The Masquerade]] to be permanently broken. {{spoiler|Negi eventually just accepts that [[Dirty Business|he might be the bad guy in this arc]] and stops the [[Anti-Villain|bad guy]] because she doesn't give him a good reason why he should let her continue.}}
** Later events {{spoiler|show pretty unambiguously that Chao could have improved on the actual outcome, if allowed to win. The best argument against her is "But she might get corrupted by power". Well, and the fact that even when she explained what was going on, she downplayed it to such a level that it didn't seem worth the risk to let her succeed.}}
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* Given [[Real Life]] history, the Nations of ''[[Axis Powers Hetalia]]'' are definitely this. As everyone's shown to be good-at-heart in their own ways, not one of them is portrayed as utterly evil, including Ivan/Russia. This doesn't stop [[Dark Fic]] writers from making [[complete Monster]]s of them, however,
* ''[[Magic Knight Rayearth]]'' has each side (or country, in season 2) fighting for what they believe is right. All of them meant well. None of them wanted to deliberately do evil. Yet each one had goals that would have eventually hurt others- even though it may have benefited somebody in the end.
* ''[[Getter Robo]]'' villains are at best [[Anti-Villain|Anti Villains]], at worst [[Well-Intentioned Extremist|Well Intentioned Extremists]]. The only villains that crossed the [[Complete Monster]] line are [[Human Are Bastards|human]], and really, its hard too see how the villains are "evil" especialy in the manga when most of them consist of the villain fighting for the happiness of their people, or trying to SAVE the world, complete with several [[Heroic Sacrifice]] to save the world. The only explanation for their status as villains are the fact that they are not human.
* The feuding ninja clans of ''[[Basilisk]]'' are equally honorable and treacherous. As are the heirs' nannies who instigated the contests with their own intrigues. The [[Treacherous Advisor]] / [[Big Bad]] wasn't in support of either side so much as conflict for the sake of pain and misery. {{spoiler|In that sense, even though defeated, he won in the end.}}
==
* [[Marvel Comics|Marvel's]] [[Civil War (Comic Book)|Civil War]]
* ''[[Watchmen (comics)|Watchmen]]''. Dr. Manhattan is the larval form of an [[Eldritch Abomination]], both Rorschach and the Comedian are [[Heroic Sociopath|heroic sociopaths]] , and {{spoiler|Ozymandias}} is an [[Anti-Villain]] [[Well-Intentioned Extremist]]. None of the main characters is unambiguously villainous, but even Nite Owl and Silk Spectre are [[Anti-Hero|antiheroes]]. To quote Zack Snyder, director of the movie adaptation, "Superman doesn't care about humanity, Batman can't get it up, and the bad guy wants world peace."
* IDW's [[Transformers|Megatron: Origin]] miniseries shows the series's iconic [[Evil Overlord]]'s rise to power from a laid-off energon miner through underground [[Blood Sport|gladiator]] to the leader of a rebellion against a corrupt Cybertronian senate, with the Autobot Security Services presented as an incompetent and in some cases fascistic police force under the control of the aforementioned senate.
** Before this the Dreamwave comic series revealed that the Autobot ruling council were servants of the Quintessons, the Transformers' entire history was a lie told to keep the Autobots in line and Megatron, having found all this out, forced the Decepticons to try and free his people and to bring order to the universe, albeit through very [[Knight Templar]] behavior.
* ''[[World War Hulk]]'': Warbound vs Illuminati. The Illuminati weren't guilty of the crime that Hulk was avenging, but they ''were'' the reason he was on Sakaar in the first place.
* ''[[Scalped]]''. Dash is an [[Anti-Hero]] at best, and Red Crow has many shades of being an [[Anti-Villain]]. He definitely faces enough [[Complete Monster|complete monsters]] that it's hard to pin him as the worst thing that could happen to the Rez.
* ''[[Superman: Red Son]]'': [[Superman]] is a totalitarian dictator, [[Thou Shalt Not Kill|but values human life enough to never kill anybody]] and - to himself, at least - has humanity's best interests at heart, while [[Lex Luthor]] is totally obsessed with bringing Superman down rather than liberating humanity from Superman's yoke.
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==
* ''[[Tiberium Wars]]'' portrays both the Global Defense Initiative ''and'' the Brotherhood of Nod in sympathetic light, with Nod being presented as desperate and angry and vengeful for the wrongs GDI has perpetuated on them, and GDI being presented as [[Well-Intentioned Extremist|Well Intentioned Extremists]] who nonetheless are trying to protect the world and defend themselves against Nod aggression.
* It should come as no surprise, but the crossover fanfic ''[[Renegade (fanfic)|Renegade]]'' by the same author does the same thing, with the same factions. In fact, both factions are presented as protagonists, with the Brotherhood of Nod intervening in the slaver raid on Elysium and with {{spoiler|Kane himself}} attempting to negotiate a compromise between GDI and the Citadel. Of course, {{spoiler|Nod apparently stole the Tacitus on Eden Prime}}, which ''caused'' said conflict between GDI and the Citadel and allowed {{spoiler|Kane}} to score points by negotiating said compromise, so it might have [[The Plan|been part of the plan....]]
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*** [[Fridge Brilliance|The joke makes a lot of sense in hindsight]] given that Londo and the Centauri are initially portrayed almost wholly sympathetically, while G'kar and the Narn are portrayed very much as villainous. By the end of the second season, however, both the characters' and audience's sympathies have completely reversed (in part thanks to Londo making a [[Deal with the Devil]]). By the end of the fourth season, it's no longer clear who's the hero or the villain in the perpetual conflict - which was almost certainly the intention of Stracyzinski from the very beginning.
* The [[The Cavalier Years|English Civil War]] drama ''By the Sword Divided''. There are some obviously 'good' characters, but none of them are perfect, while no one is shown as an out-and-out villain either.
* The new ''[[Battlestar Galactica
* In various seasons of ''[[Survivor (TV series)|Survivor]]'', the final two (three in more recent seasons) was often seen as this, both (or all three) people pretty much annoyed the Jury and they wound up voting for who they viewed as the lesser evil.
** ''Marquesas'' is perhaps one of the ''best'' examples of this trope; Neleh admittedly didn't start playing the game until Day 24 and glided through on other peoples' shoulders, while Vecepia flip-flopped enough times to make everyone question where she stood, and won because everyone was mad at Neleh.
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