The Neidermeyer: Difference between revisions

** Also, Spandam can be considered one.

* Miwa Sakimori from ''[[Daimos]]'' is this, and a [[General Ripper]]. He mostly hides behind his soldiers, or Daimos itself from danger. And when opportunity presents, he'll show his extreme racist tendencies by shooting actually harmless Brahmins. And all that's in his mind is... well, you guessed it, promotions.

** Corporal Strappi from ''[[Discworld/Monstrous Regiment|Monstrous Regiment]]''.

** While not in a military organization, Sergeant Fred Colon quickly becomes this after being promoted to Acting Captain in ''[[Discworld/The Fifth Elephant|The Fifth Elephant]]''. By the time Carrot returns to resume authority, Colon has fired or driven off all members of the Watch, with only a handful hanging around informally enforcing the law.

** Actually, nearly every general in the armies of the Sto Plains (which is the area in which Ankh-Morpork lies) counts as this, since their general battle strategy is to hurl their men at the enemy and receive "glorious casualties", since apparently the number of fallen men equals how great the battle was for them. If they actually win anything, that's a nice albeit unimportant bonus. They see the famous general Tacticus as a dishonorable military leader because he had the distinct tendency to win battles and wars and bring most of his soldiers back alive.

*** The official metric goes something like this: First, both sides throw their men at each other. Then, you subtract ''your'' casualties from ''their'' casualties, and "if the answer is a positive sum, it was a glorious victory".

* A couple generals in Urtho's army (I forget their names) in ''[[Heralds of Valdemar|The Black Gryphon]]''. Troops of all species dread being placed under their command because they're known for using tactics which would be gloriously victorious if they ever worked, but since they never work, are instead suicidally stupid. {{spoiler|It eventually turns out they're traitors, and they plan on losing every time.}}

* Lieutenant Weems from the first ''[[Doom]]'' novel. He was so incompetent and cowardly that he ordered his men to fire on a bunch of harmless monks protesting their war efforts mistaking them for suicide bombers even after one of his subordinates told him they were harmless. Flynn decked him for that, and that's why Flynn is stuck on suspension in the cafeteria on Phobos when everything goes to Hell. Throughout the novel Flynn has unflattering thoughts about Weems and thinks that Weems was the kind of guy who would side with the alien invaders if it meant saving his own skin. {{spoiler|When Flynn finds the dead bodies of Weems and another officer who had entered a suicide pact after the aliens trapped them in a [[Fate Worse Than Death]] by ''fusing their heads together'', he feels too much pity to hate the man anymore.}}

* In the [[Dale Brown]] novel ''Sky Masters'', an inexperienced Captain second-guesses his air defence expert and, when one anti-air missile misfires, shuts down the point defence net in his [[Lawful Stupid|Lawful Stupidity]], allowing an antiship missile to get through and hit the carrier they were supposed to be protecting.

** If this troper remembers correctly, said misfired missile had actually exploded and was tumbling back towards the launcher - keeping the other launch cells closed was a prudent thing to do; keeping on firing might have risked BOTH ships.

== Live Action TV ==

** ''M* A* S* H'' also had several Foe of the Week commanders who either [[Karmic Trickster|learned a lesson or were otherwise removed from command]] by the doctors.

** When Major Burns left the series (due to having a psychological breakdown caused by the marriage of Major Houlihan - which led to him causing havoc in Tokyo while on RnR), the Army, in its infinite wisdom, [[Kicked Upstairs|promoted him to Lieutenant Colonel and gave him a cushy job in a stateside Veteran's Hospital]]... which is extra disconcerting given that Major Burns was always made out to be as incompetent doctor.

** While Captain America embodies this trope in the HBO version, don't forget Sgt. Major John "Fucking" Sixta who has more power than either of them -- and uses it to continually insist on personal grooming standards while allowing the company to abandon their ammo supply truck in enemy territory.

*** In the final episode, Sixta {{spoiler|reveals that his psychotic obsession with the men's grooming standards was a [[Genghis Gambit]] to give them an outlet for their stress.}}

** The second is Lt. Norman Dike, who is given command of Easy Company during the war. It is implied that he got his position due to his pedigree and family connections, but is himself an "empty uniform" who can only feign competence. As Lipton put it; ''Dike wasn't a bad leader because he made bad decisions. He was a bad leader because he made no decisions.'' In the series, the only thing that holds the unit together is Sergeant Lipton's tireless efforts to maintain morale. After breaking down during an assault, Dike is immediately replaced with the vastly more competent Ronald Speirs.

** And when Dike genuinely tries to give orders... he gets two men killed.

* In the ''[[Babylon 5]]'' movie "In the Beginning," General Lefcourt approached then-commander John Sheridan to be the first officer to Captain Michael Jankowski. Sheridan refused, stating that Jankowski was a loose cannon and referenced how so many of his peers thought Jankowski an incompetent risk taker. In a twist, it is revealed that Hague knew this all along and wanted Sheridan to take the job since he needs someone competent to keep Jankowski in line. Then Jankowski started a war with the Minbari over his pride and stupidity, and we know how badly that went. Though to be fair, the Minbari captain was equally pigheaded, even going so far as to disobey a direct order from his government's leader, Dukhat to not take an aggressive stance.

** At least the Minbari had the excuse of [[Nobody Ever Complained Before|following an age-old tradition of keeping their weapons out in the open]], instead of hiding them behind their backs, so to speak. The humans in turn interpreted the show of power as an intention to use it. This, coupled with the Minbari's scanners causing interference with the Earth ship's sensors caused Jankowski to panic and open fire.

* Though he isn't shown on-screen, in the ''[[Firefly]]'' episode "The Message," Mal and Zoe recount an instance where one of their superior officers acted exactly like this. However, in this case, the man was drunk off his rocker, and passed out, at which point one of the troops cut off the man's mustache and glued it to his own face.

* Arnold Rimmer from ''[[Red Dwarf]]'' is a subverted one of these, as though having all the requisite personality traits, he lacks real authority, and the people he does outrank refuse to listen to him. Plus, he's dead already, so fragging's out of the question.

== Radio ==

** To be fair, the crew of the Troutbridge are completely incompetent/derelict in their duties

* Kraze and Kanaan from ''[[Suikoden]]'', who you'll grow to hate very much early on in the game. Kanaan is more or less a classic example of a real dirtbag who wants all the glory to himself but hides behind his soldiers. Kraze is more or less the same, but at least he {{spoiler|he isn't given an option to be spared unlike most of the Imperial commanders}}.

** {{spoiler|You COULD spare him. But since not sparing him doesn't penalize you with not getting the best ending... well... [[Sure Why Not]]?}}

* Lee Linjun from ''[[Super Robot Wars Original Generation|Super Robot Wars Original Generation 2]]'' quickly makes himself known as a complete jerk. He constantly argues with the pilots (especially Excellen and Katina), is clearly jealous of Tetsuya (even though Lee outranks him and commands a ship), and fully cements himself as a Neidermeyer when he makes it clear that everyone is expendable, and he really doesn't care if any member of the crew lives or dies. [[Face Heel Turn|Then he just defects to the Shadow Mirrors]].

* Sufficiently unhappy nobles in ''[[Dwarf Fortress]]'' act this way, ordering beatings and hammerings to any dwarf that ignores (or is incapable of fulfilling) their demands. Unsurprisingly, players tend to respond to such behavior with [[The Coroner Doth Protest Too Much|their own form of capital punishment]].

* ''[[Iron Grip]]'' has the Fahrong/Confederacy, where apparently every officer above the Sergeant is this and everybody below it is [[Cannon Fodder]].

* Due to the open ended nature of the story, it is entirely possible that both brothers in ''[[Team Fortress 2]]'' count as this. All of the mercs on both teams start haphazardly next to the other side, and can just run to battle in about 4 seconds, and everybody should die at least once. Given that the announcer seemed to be looking for this setup, it may be the brothers were intended to both become "the Neidermeyer".

*** [[Word of God|The head writer]] stated that his portrayal was meant to be evocative of the afformentioned [[MASH|Major Frank Burns.]]

** Grimlock is occasionally shown to be a bit of a Neidermeyer in the comics when he's put in command of units other than the Dinobots, largely due to the fact that most Autobots aren't used to doing things [[The Spartan Way]] like the Dinobots are and Grimlock being unwilling to accommodate them. When he briefly took over the Autobots he threw the rulebook out the window--literally.

* In ''[[Invader Zim]]'', Zim is shown to be this type of leader in the episode Hobo-13 in that he needlessly sacrifices his squadmates so that he himself can get to the end of the obstacle course, including using his last remaining soldier as a battering ram to open a door. The Drill Sergeant (ironically played by [[R. Lee Ermey]]) who meets him at the end chooses to fail Zim due to his horrendous leadership skills and challenges him into combat in order to pass (which Zim does by cheating).

** Of course, The Tallests are seen as worse than Zim, being a pair of petty, self-serving, and egomaniacal [[Jerkass|jerkasses]], treating everyone beneath them with contempt and mockery, particularly the shorter Irkens. In fact, the Irkens are pretty much a race of Neidermyers.

* It should be noted that this sort of thing actually occurs in [[Real Life]]. While fraggings are uncommon (though they did occur in Vietnam), plenty of stories get passed around the modern military about which officers to avoid and who's a dirtbag.

** Since his Turtledove counterpart's been cited, one example might as well be named directly; George Armstrong Custer. He was a glory-seeking General that lost his wits, every man of his Seventh Calvary, and his life in the campaign that led to the Little Big Horn. And he got in that mess from increasingly frantic and frustrated desire for glory to turn to political advantage, no matter how many tribes or soldiers died to get it!

*** Custer led a cavalry force of 700 men to take out Sitting Bull and the 800 natives who had left a reservation. Ignoring his scouts (members of the Crow tribe) who told him the village they spotted had THOUSANDS of women and children and probably an equal number of warriors he split his force in half to "trap" the enemy. Custer's own group, about 200 soldiers personally led by him would end up facing at least 1800 native american warriors, warriors who had just fought off the other half of his armed force which had attacked the village. The only survivor from Custer's group was a horse called Commanche which had nearly a dozen wounds from bullets, arrows and spears.

*** What everyone always forgets is that he was a Colonel at this point, having been a General in the civil war, and wanted to regain his rank!

** Patton himself has been accused of being more than a little of a martinet, far too concerned with the dress code in a combat zone (including the fact he demanded, and may even have gotten, front-line infantry to wear their ties), attacking Metz and the Vauban forts without proper preparation and demanding the attack continue after it became clear it was not going to succeed, and finally culminating late in the war with his famous tirade against a soldier who had been shot in the foot for cowardice (said soldier had already won a Silver Star for valor).

*** With regard to the slapping incident, the soldier in question was away from his unit without permission and legally Patton could have had him executed for desertion. What Patton did was the better option, albeit not the best one available.

* Most recently, [http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1969602,00.html this officer].

** And how. For the link impaired, Holly Graf’s Neidermeyer behavior includes:

*** When approached for advice by a junior officer, Graf allegedly responded with “Don’t come to me with your problems. You’re a fucking department head”, and later “I can’t express how mad you make me without getting violent!”

*** Tired of delays leaving a port, she ordered that the ship accelerate to 25 knots instead of 10, despite being informed it was dangerous to do so. As a result, the USS Cowpens ran soft aground and mangled the ship’s propulsion screws. She then allegedly grabbed a British exchange officer by either the throat or the lapels (accounts differ), and began shouting “Did you run my fucking ship aground?!”. She then went on to order the crew to falsify records and claim they were moving at 10 knots.

*** Allegedly covered up the fact that her ship had struck a whale by ordering the crew into lockdown and temporarily terminating e-mail privileges.

** Despite leading revolutionaries in Africa, Guevara was often overheard to disparage his black fellow travelers, stating that black people did not have the intelligence to make communism work.

* Captain Bligh had a reputation for this, but it's not really deserved: Yes, he flogged his men, but it was only because flogging was the mandatory punishment in the British Navy at the time. In fact, he was considered ''lenient'' compared to the other officers in the Navy. Yes, conditions were overcrowded on the Bounty, but only because Bligh couldn't say no to friends and relatives who needed jobs for their friends and relatives. And when they finally got to Otaheite (later Tahiti), Bligh let his men run around and do whatever they wanted for the five months they remained. The conditions that led to the famous mutiny were largely made out of a desperate need to get his by-now rather lax crew into some semblance of order and competency. In short, the supposed tyrant's greatest crime was being too accommodating.

** It should be noted at this point that the famed Mutiny on the Bounty was not the last time Bligh faced a mutiny of those under him. His overly strict and by the book attempts to enforce discipline when he was made Governor of New South Wales sparked off the [[wikipedia:Rum Rebellion|Rum Rebellion]].

* Hermann Goering, by 1945, was called the most hated man in Germany beccause of his obsession with fame, glory, [[Bling of War]] and rampant egomania. Given [[Those Wacky Nazis|the competition]] at the time, it's quite an achievement.

** A common problem with former military ''is'' [[Stranger in a Familiar Land|re-socializing to the civilian world]]. Once you spend a long enough time in, it takes time to get used to the less formal (in appearance) environment of the civilian workforce. There are reasons why former military are often seen in jobs with known chains of command.

** People who've worked for Jobs and left tend to have this view on him, considering his high standards. But since he's led Apple from nearly dead in the water to having more liquid assets than the US government in 10 years, people skirt by this.

* Virtually every officer in the [[Imperial Russia|Imperial Russian]] military, because of the brutal means of discipline and strict social class differences. Almost all officers came from the privileged nobility, while the enlisted men were almost all [[Slave Mook|force-levied conscripts]]. One particular example was Lieutenant Ippolit Giliarovsky on pre-dreadnought battleship ''Potemkin'', whose uppity, cocky and bullyish behaviour sparked the mutiny onboard immortalized on Sergei Eisenstein's [[Battleship Potemkin]].

** The Soviet military fared no better, largely due to the culture of ''dedovschina'' (literally, 'rule of the grandfathers') where senior conscripts were encouraged by the hierarchy to inflict extremely brutal hazing and bullying upon junior conscripts. The practice is responsible for as many as 3,000 deaths per year, although the Russian Defense Ministry classifies most of those as 'suicides'. The practice was partly responsible for the ''[[wikipedia:Strozhevoi mutiny|Strozhevoi]]'' Mutiny, the attempted defection of a Soviet frigate to Sweden in 1975. Lowering the mandatory service period to three years from five has eased the problem somewhat, but it still remains endemic to the Russian military even in the post-Soviet era.