Topic on User talk:NoxiousSludge

A candidate we discussed once and deemed potentially too YMMV, Sigma from the Mega Man X reboot, looks to be getting upvoted on TV Tropes. Ready for a writeup on him?

Not quite yet, I'm paranoid that one of the more known posters will downvote him and thus getothers to follow suit. Unlike a certain poster who shall not be named I refuse to outright lie or omit info, yet at the same time I'm paranoid that I forgot a key disqualifying factor or that someone disagreeing will lead others to retract their votes. I'm aware it's a stupid thing to worry about, but still. @_@

And yeah, I proposed him, mainly because there was a detail that I missed and thought it was worth bringing up there: the berserk mechanaloids were hacked under Sigma's orders by a group of criminals he hired. However, he murdered them all soon after the Mechanaloids were hacked as a way to cover his tracks, showing blatant Bad Boss tendencies.

You were referring to Klavice there, weren't you? Admit it. :P

I'm not going to comment further, because it seems kinda scummy to do so when said poster isn't here to defend themselves.

But then again, I'm being a hypocrite since I bought them up to begin with. Oh well.

I personally feel there's such a thing as an Acceptable Target but yeah, let's drop that matter.

Alright, change of subject then!

You know, on our Marvel films subpage I don't really have any issues with its candidates.. except for Norman Osborn. I know we discussed him pretty in-depth a while back, but in spite of all his bad traits, his love for Harry later on in the film strikes me as being a little too genuine, especially since his final words were him begging Peter not to tell Harry about him being the Goblin and doing all those awful things. I know it ultimately complicated matters and led to Harry wanting to get revenge on Spider-Man, but I don't see that as his intention so much as him not wanting to hurt him.

It just seems to me that this Norman is a lot closer to pre-90's Norman from the comics where he was still sympathetic and genuinely cared for his son. I feel that by my standards, a Complete Monster incarnation of Norman would hurt, attempt to murder, or otherwise do other awful things to Harry like he did later on in the comics and in The Spectacular Spider-Man.

But eh, ultimately I might just be missing some bigger piece of the picture, and you'll probably discuss it in the upcoming "Keepers" topic on that page.

What a coincidence - I just got done with the discussion.

If you want to get technical, Norman's love for Harry is often always pretty genuine in any incarnation of the character - it's just that he doesn't really like his son personally unless he's what he wants him to be, and his affection is completely twisted and conditional, meaning that he's still an abusive father even when showing his version of "love" to his son. The "don't tell Harry" line was very vague but I never saw it as sympathetic - if it was Norman sincerely asking it, it comes off as more "don't let Harry have a bad image of me as a person", and if he's still in full Goblin mode, he might have hoped Harry would take up his cause to avenge him against Spider-Man and thus carry on his spirit.

Even in the comics Norman chose to act against Spider-Man out of anger at Harry's death and in The Spectacular Spider-Man he often gave encouragement to Harry and rationalized his actions towards him, even twisting his ankle and framing him, as being for his sake to "make a man out of him", and expressing pride in him moments before his final defeat. It's a twisted form of fatherly love but it doesn't truly mitigate Norman's monstrosity as a thoroughly, irredeemably terrible human being.

That's a pretty valid way to look at his character. In the end, he's probably one of the most complex examples I can think of from media I've consumed in that he has plenty of humanizing qualities and is even kind of tragic, but he's still ultimately a horrible person who goes beyond redemption.

And another thing, I think you're best off with handling the rest of the Keeper lists (Though I'll still do the Fallout and Elder Scrolls ones since I take it that you're not familiar with them like me). I'm not trying to suck up, but you're a lot better at writing: my writing tends to be really rough around the edges and you're always having to tidy it up after me. I'm not trying to feel down on myself, but I think I'll back off on what feels more like your territory.

Exactly, and he's been that way in various stories past his resurrection in the nineties, though others write him as simply pure evil and thoroughly inhumane in a revolting and largely generic way. The "Death In The Family" story by Paul Jenkins as a good example of one that actually manages to make you feel a touch of pity for the guy but still write him as ultimately being too far gone to be anything but a Complete Monster in the end.

Thanks and you're welcome. I take it that means I gotta tackle the Mario page?

If you want. I feel I can justify Grubba and Terrormisu's presence just fine, but I'm having a hard time figuring out what to write about the Shadow Queen for some reason. I agree that she counts, I'm just drawing up blanks.

Alright, I'll handle Mario, One Piece, and other pages tomorrow. ^^

Maybe I'm just being a paranoid loon, but I'm officially dropping any and all discussion on Sigma on the main site and letting his discussion just kind of die down. I realized too late that I misunderstood parts of his character and thus led people on with false info. Not wanting to become you-know-who 2.0 and damage my credibility, I'm just going to pretend that I never proposed him.

Wait, what got misunderstood?

His motivation. I got it mixed up with his in Mega Man X where he explicitly wanted a world without humans while in Maverick Hunter X it was to unleash X's full potential and use that as a basis for all Reploids.

And what did he intend for the Reploids to do?

Evolve, basically.

But what would that gain?

I don't know, Sigma just keeps talking about speeding along the evolution of Reploid kind.

That's strange. There's a chance he might still qualify, though. Darwinist villains have counted before - just look at Mr. Sinister.

I guess. I suppose it helps that he regularly endangers tons of Reploids without feeling remorseful or regretful about it. Like I said, he seems like he cares only for satisfying his own curiosity regarding X's potential.

I'm not sure how it'll turn out, but we'll wait to see if he either comes up again on the thread or is just forgotten about.

Yeah, that's what I want to do. I'm sorry for fretting over such stupid things like this and Lorithia a month ago, I've just had a nasty habit of letting dumb fears consume me lately.

I'm thinking of at least writing Sigma up here though. Would you support that notion?

If you feel up to it, then by all means.

Once again, I'm so sorry that this whole thing has been completely, totally stupid. I just need to stop fretting over things that aren't such a big deal.

If you have even the tiniest concerns, just let someone who will listen (like me) know.