Launched, after more examples were added.
No one's put any more effort into this in the last 11 days, and the last substantial addition to the content was almost two weeks ago; the argument appears to have been more important than the trope. It has just barely enough examples and categories to limp half-heartedly into the main namespace, but is it worth it? Please weigh in.
CC: @Labster, @GethN7, @Robkelk, @QuestionableSanity, @DocColress, @LulzKiller, @SelfCloak
No argument. You will just add something else to go back to square one again. So what's even the point, to either add or argue? Whatever.
I suspect we'd get more examples if somebody here was a military-fiction fan. However, if somebody here was a military-fiction fan, he or she likely would have weighed in already.
Maybe we should delete this one without prejudice, in case somebody who's willing to put in the work that a new trope deserves comes along later and re-creates it.
Jason seems like a good candidate -- maybe he's not noticed it?
Edit: Checked the history and confirmed he hadn't made any edits. So I went to his talk page and asked him to take a look. Maybe he'll be able to add something to save this candidate from deletion.
Regarding video games, I have nothing; because they're usually just focused on one war, anyways.
There might be example between the two Pacific Rim movies, but I never really watched the second one
There's also Cadia and Armageddon from Warhammer 40K, but this is something that I need to look into.
I'm not entirely sure if this will get a lot of examples. Because it's kind of hard to win a war by constantly fighting the same way and people are bound to catch onto this. Otherwise, it's an excuse for preserving resources, going by what I just written.
Okay, Jason's finally noticed my message, and came by to add a few things. What do people think? Ready to launch? (Yes, TBeholder, we know what you think. Please note that I went out of my way to recruit someone to help make this one launchable.)
@TBeholder: Per the Trope Workshop Guidelines. If you, the creator of the candidate, can't think of at least three examples, how can you be sure it's really a trope?
It's a "Seen It a Million Times" thing. So often in background, it's hard to remember anything specific.
If you've seen it a million times, surely you can remember three of them. The three examples minimum is there for a reason. If you or someone else can't come up with three examples in 24 hours, I will delete this candidate.
-- Looney Toons, Admin
CC: @Labster, @GethN7, @Robkelk, @QuestionableSanity, @DocColress, @LulzKiller, @SelfCloak
Okay, good. Three examples. Now a minimum of five, and preferably eight to ten, before it's considered launchable. Again, see the the Trope Workshop Guidelines for the rules that everyone -- even your august self -- must follow.
EDIT: Oh, and more categories than the default. I'm sure with some thought you can figure out at least one category Military Tropes like this one might fit into.
-- Looney Toons, Admin
Does it count if there's some kind of infighting and denial about the enemy? Because there's at least one Star Wars movie like that.
I don't see why that should matter, as long as the result is that the military force in question uses what worked last time instead of something new.
Ok, so it's a case of "doing what cost us the war, last time," and it kind of bleeds into one of the cartoons which is the Trade Federation blockading a planet to unload their infantry and tanks. Cue The Slow Walk as they gradually overwhelm their enemies in The Phantom Menace. By the time the Clone Wars rolled around, while the new incarnation of the Trade Federation had a fleet of spaceships, their invasion plans were largely the same. Although, they had armored droids and new land vehicles, it's still marching towards the enemy with heavier firepower and numbers.
As for the Galactic Empire, it's hard to draw a pattern on account of how long they've lasted in the movies.
You first crack down on Workshop while search is not working, and then move goalpost into area that specifically requires search? Really?
You don't need search to see the categories. Under "Tools" on the menu at the side of the page, select "Special Pages", then from the list you get select "Categories" in the section Lists of Pages. (Or you can just select this link straight to Special:Categories.) Then use the Contents bar at the top of the page to narrow down the list to the first two letters of what you think the category might be called. With the descriptive names many categories have, you're bound to find one or two reasonably quickly.
EDIT: Using that method, it took me less than two minutes to find Category:Military and Warfare Tropes, which lists practically all of the wiki's Military Tropes.
>
Well, yes. In this case.
However, it's mostly useless. Since there's a category for every page and then some more, diving through the full list without either search engine or knowing what you look for is a quest for one straw somewhere in the haystack. And since mouseover doesn't work on that list, arcane names are impenetrable short of visiting each.
Anyway, my point is that starting such motions while the functionality necessary for proper editing doesn't work are a very bad practice.
I don't know why you brought up "arcane names" when I specifically said "descriptive names" - unless you're trying to justify to yourself why you don't want to follow the advice that's been provided to you.
And you already know what you're looking for: military tropes. "Military" begins with "M", so that eliminates over 97% of the list right there.
Alternately, look through the list that I already found for you. Don't wait to be spoon-fed the answers, because we don't have time to coddle you. Search through the list with your own eyes.
You already know that you wn't find an exact match - if you could, then we'd already have a trope for this.
(Oh, and congratulations: you've managed to annoy me. I'm bowing out of this discussion now so that personal biases don't come into play.)
Don't you understand, Rob? This wiki exists solely to serve TBeholder, and must be tbeholden to his needs and desires. </snark>
Good job, TB. You've just driven off the admin who was pretty much on your side and trying to help you. If you can be just a bit more snotty about how inconvenient everything is for you, you can earn the extra bonus tempban prize on top of that!
Let me make this clear, because you're obviously a bit hard-of-thinking. Your arrogant, self-entitled attitude has won you no friends. If it's too much for you to put in a little extra effort while Miraheze is fixing its screw-up with the search indices, maybe this wiki isn't the place for you. Lose the attitude or move on.
> who was pretty much on your side and trying to help you.
This one is classic, but it gets old. From overuse.
The rest is pretty much a generic barrage of "I don't have a good answer, so you are icky poo, also I'm offended!" as seen on woke twitter, etc. Can't you put some thought into it at least when proclaiming your mental superiority? :] Strawmanning, projection, amateur drama… (yawn) …search is still broken.
So I'm still a bureaucrat here, and while you don't see much of me, do I really need to step in here?
Yes, searching is hard. I am partially responsible for it being crappy if only because I'm bad at running Miraheze finance. But I did put a ton of time into organizing categories for a reason. It's not ideal for some things, but when I do Trope Workshop I always use categories to find examples -- especially if it's a genre trope.
If you don't have enough to put it in Trope Workshop, I'd suggest using the sandbox up at the top of every page, and put it in your own user space. Then you can show other people when it's ready.
Goalposts haven't moved here. I seem to remember the same goal of 5 examples over on TVT. And low example proposals were shot down quite brutally. Seen it a Million Times is not evidence it's tropable, but that you haven't quite finished resolving the pattern. If I were to move the goalposts, I'd require one category at page creation time too.