Umineko: When They Cry/WMG/Colored Text

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Red Text doesn't only speak the truth - it has another meaning altogether

I mean, people not just speak facts in red, they even laugh in red, give death threats in red, say "You are incompetent" in red... There's got to be some form of hidden meaning!

• Except most of those death threats are carried out on, and it's certainly true that Battler is incompetent back when that line was said.
  • Most death threats? Which means some aren't true, that kind of shakes the reliability of the Red Text. Also, when Beato says "With my power, I can create any kind of closed room" in red, is it true or just a way to mock Battler?
    • Beatrice is the Game Master, the writer of the Rokkenjima Tale. She can show any event she wants, when she wants. So yes, she can create any kind of closed room.
      • She wrote the first two games, anyway...

Things to do with red text

• Solve continuum hypothesis, Riemann hypothesis, etc.
• Determine if Turing-complete function will halt without running it; demolish foundations of modern computer science.
• Check for existence of God.
  • After confirming, mock every religion which isn't right.
  • I
  • Actually Erika used red to falsify Maria's claim of Beatrice using magic to make candy in EP 6 and Bernkastel used it to deny Beatrices existance in EP 5.
• Trick Beato into self-destructing by reciting "
  • E
• Tell the player " in the very last game. Epic Mind Screw ensues.
  • How would that cause Mind Screw?
  • NOOOOOOOOOOO! I lost The Game!!
    • * Dope Slap* Get a Hold of Yourself Man!
• Rather than using the red truth, trick Beato (somehow?) into lying in red to either see if it works or to see her strangle herself on an impossible-to-exist red lie.

Things to do with g.

• Say nothing said in red so far has been the truth.
  • Not sure this would work. The way I figure it is "one interpretation of something said in red is true or you can't say it; all interpretations of something said in gold are true or you can't say it."
• Kill the [
• "Dine's K In other words, this is not a Mystery."

G

In The Stake's Valentine's Day; Ronove is commenting on how Angel's Horn or Devil's Horn is perfect on Chocolates; when suddenly a Do Not Try This At Home disclaimer appears in g comments on how these things are poisonous. Ronove nonchalantly responds to...um...nobody that well, yeah, to humans, not demons; very well, they'll skip those ingredients.

• However, the G will doubtfully be used in story. Watch me be proven wrong, it'll be great.
• Adding to that, the G that's added to the TIPS in the Witch Hunt translations use G to explain translation notes of interest and clarifications. Does that fall under Fourth Wall Truth, or has Ryu07 been royally cornered? Either way, it'll be fucking epic.
  • I
    • Apparently it's some kind of grimoire text. I went to a screenshot generator for Umineko and the text section had a hex code for green text, and called it "grimoire text".
      • You misunderstood. "Grimore" is how the Witch-Hunt call the the part of the menu they explain their translation. In their translation, every time you see the g you are to go to the 'grimore'(one page after 'TIPS") to read what the translators had to say about it. Therefore, there, the g is aimed to the reader. Since it was already this way before Ryuukishi first use it, it could be, indeed, an Ascended Fanon if this WMG is correct.

Gold truth is premise truth

Hopefully it's true nature will be addressed more clearly in episode 6, but since at the time of this writing that cat-box has (barely) not been opened yet we can't quite know that yet. Any references to wording are referring to the witch-hunt translation.

• Despite being a supernatural element the Gold text is accepted even in the face of Knox's 2nd rule. It reminds me of the part of the conversation Dlanor had with Battler where Battler pointed out that there were good mysteries that had secret doors and she responded that in those stories part of the premise was that "secret doors exist", meaning the Knox rules do not hold up against the premise of the story.
• Further The Gold Truth is limited to the master of the kakera, which corresponds to the premise of a story being limited to the author.
  • The statement is "I" a promise from the master of that world that that is true, in the same way that the author promises that a mystery is solvable along the same vein of the conversation above.
• This also fits with the comment about it being both superior and inferior, on par with the red truth, premise of the story could be ", it is absolute above the red truth as the premise is secret doors exist, yet even if "Secret doors exist" the red truth can still trump that with the Red N, it falls in line with the premise that "Secret doors exist", yet it overrides the premise to mean "S o

I am not sure if this falls in line with the common "No distortions of the truth" theory because of the "Because it is truly solvable, does not mean it is solvable for you" thing, intentional distortions, yes, but if a stated premise can mean something different to the author and the reader, so the gold could possibly be misinterpreted under this theory.

• I think it's been confirmed that red truth is subjective truth, which made me think that gold truth could be objective truth. Then again, I'm not sure how either would work, so your explanation, which is more thought out than mine, makes more sense right now.
  • T
    • That's probably the best way to think of it. I think the easiest way to interpret it without contradicting any of the previous colored truths or the fundamental game itself is to the think of the gold truth like an incarnation of the rules, much like Beato is. Anyone who understands the whole truth about Beato's game can use it and it is allowed to speak any truth pertaining to those rules. For example, EP 5, Battler can use it to guarantee Kinzo's corpse because that is one of the rules Beato's game revolves around, it's part of the core mystery and is an established fact by the rules of the games. Unlike the red truth though, the gold truth seems like it can't be used for any statement outside of that though.

Gold truth is the truth of tyrannicides, geniuses and madmen

It's the truth of those who face the world and say: bring your courts and your judgments, bring your science and your proofs, bring your mobs and your society and your certitude and I. Will. Not. Budge. One. Inch. It's the only value of truth Kinzo ever respected, and it's the truth Natsuhi served to the bitter end, at the cost of her sanity, and her honor.

If red truth is the truth of authority ('This is true. Do not question it.'), gold truth is the truth of the heart.

• I always thought Golden Truth was the truth of reality, as in depicting scenes as they actually happened, not what other people present or remember them as, or being true from any given perspective, not just any one perspective, like the Red Truth.

Gold truth is 'Kinzo truth'

It can be used to make absolutely irrefutable statements by, of or pertaining to Ushiromiya Kinzo.

Ushiromiya Kinzo does not fear the truth. The truth fears Ushiromiya Kinzo.

Anything stated in red about Ushironomiya Battler can be a lie.

This is an extension of the idea that there are two people named Ushironomiya Battler due to the events in EP 4. A A

• K t c B I acknowledge the possibility that Knox's Decalogue does not apply to any of the games, b E
  • T also...I

Why are supernatural elements exempt from proof or disproof in red?

It has to do with those damn certain points of view, and the possibility that y.

To explain that last part (and this is not a WMG, it is a completely hypothetical situation intended only to clarify; please do not attempt to prove or disprove it), assume that Maria unknowingly has an alternate personality called "Beatrice the Golden", who may or may not be based on an actual person. Maria kills someone in her "Beatrice" personality then reverts to her "Maria" persona, and when confronted over it, says " What Maria meant when she said that is "This murder was committed by a person named Beatrice, who is completely distinct from Maria Ushiromiya." I, because the Exact Words can be interpreted as "This murder was committed by 'Beatrice', who is not 'Maria' (note the quotes!)."

So what does this have to do with the supernatural? Consider the statement " There are multiple definitions of the word "witch", a:

1. A person able to reshape reality by force of will.
2. A person who, unable to deal with reality, has invented an elaborate escapist fantasy.
3. A person who practices a form of magic, regardless of whether or not there is such a thing.
4. A cruel woman (as in "she is such a witch").
5. A practicing Wiccan.

As you can see, this produces a few possible interpretations. For instance, "A" could mean:

1. A
2. A
3. A W
4. A (Respondent/Editor: Three guesses who THAT is)
5. A

Anti-Fantasy stances are not exempt from this either. "S" could mean:

1. T
2. T
3. T

• This can count as a WMG regarding the rules for using the Red Truth. As for the info itself, I love it, though, I felt a few added touches were necessary. Hope you don't mind.

• I b

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but f w s o and so therefore

Umineko's colored text is a Batman Gambit by Ryukishi

To make everyone on the internet start using colored text to discuss mysteries in a visually easy-to-understand method. Face it, U

• Why? Because the OP is right, u
  • T
    • The Green Truth breaks the Fourth Wall, which causes trouble and can ultimately destroy the Multiverse.
    • The Green Truth goes around Breaking the Fourth Wall, getting drunk and dialing up old witches in the middle of the night. We didn't invite him for a reason. Hey, wait, why isn't that red? Don't tell me I What!? Oh, come on...

Red Truth aligns the speaker and partially the listener with any and all (more than one) reality where the statement is technically true.

We know that there are different Alternate Universe. When a witch gives Red Truth; it disconnects the Meta-World from any kakera where the Red Truth is factually not correct. Say, P There's an infinite number of possibilities regarding Persons B-Z. And that's not even getting in the Literal Genie / False Reassurance aspect of language. Magic is just one HUGE branch of the Kakera; however, when someone pokes holes in this; the Speaker is dealing with the backlash of being tied to an existence contrary to theirs.

• There are an infinite number of worlds where each member of Battler's family killed off the others because the darkness in their heart was given the right circumstances. Red Truth narrows it down, but just to a "lower" infinite number of realities. (Just because everything exists, though, doesn't mean Highly Improbable events are easy to get to. Some rule not yet seen determines accessibility to those.) Meta-Battler's salvation will be his accepting ALL of his Self. Even if the Piece Battler can be given a reality where neither demons nor his family killed everyone; Meta-Battler will face a hell of being stuck with the realities left behind, where the Golden Ending did not occur. He will be the cast out parts; just like Bernkastel was.
  • You're forgetting a key difference between Bernkastel and Meta Battler. That is Bernkastel experienced all of Rika's experiences directly, Meta-Battler is simply observing Piece-Battler's experiences. Note that unlike Rika, Piece-Battler doesn't remember the different arcs.
    • Beatrice may be protecting Meta-Battler this way. By letting him develop slowly, the memories won't overwhelm him. He has to learn the Truth himself. For that matter, Bernkastel might be doing something similar.
  • So what does choking on the Red Truth mean? There is no conceivable kakera where that truth can apply?
    • Either the speaker can't use a Language Trick to sneak out of it; or it contradicts previous Red Truth, or it requires too high an improbability quotient and thus is "too far away."
    • So how is a universe in which Battler is Asumu's son "too far away?"
      • T Additionally, the ability to move from Kakera to Kakera is effectively to move between different 'possibilities', stemming from a certain point. For example if Battler lost his hand prior to his magical romp with witches, he could end up learning to get by without it (Possible), get a prosthetic (Also possible), or have a sweet Gatling gun grafted on (Insane, but probably still possible). However, before beginning to hop kakera he lost his arm, so there's absolutely no 'possiblity' that exists where he still has an arm.

If we want to be more fair and more specific, the point of Kakera-jumping is mostly the point where the victim/kakera-jumper(Rika in Higurashi, Battler in Umineko) has their fate 'decided', so they're given a chance to avoid the fate chosen for them. This explains why Rika could sometimes jump back years and meet Akasaka many times(As Tanako decided that Rika was going down and 'decided' her fate YEARS before putting the plan into action), whereas Battler only gets three days; His fate was 'decided' when he stepped off the boat; if the murders are tied to his sin then he has to be present for them to happen, and if he could jump back further he would eventually find a Kakera where he wusses out of the boat ride, throws a hissy fit and stays home from the family conference.

• • • U U

The red truth is absolutely unreliable in certain cases

It's not that it's telling complete lies, but the red truth can be manipulated into being used for untrue statements, not necessarily outright lies. The trick is in punctuation. Sometimes, when red truths are spoken, the full stop, comma or the exclamation mark, or whatever is at the end of the sentence is not in red. This might mean that that specific statement was abruptly ended before being completed. That itself is outside of the definition of lying, but still inside the bounds of the rules of Battler's and Beatrice's game. I

Here's an example:

I

X.

The third premise doesn't contradict the previous two by a single bit, because the statement hasn't been completed in red, meaning it is still open to be filled in and completed at a later point in time. A Furthermore, r Not only that, but what completely undermines the red truth is the very first stament in red, which is:

Beatrice: "S."

Since the full stop at the end isn't in red, it means that the entire statement is actually incomplete, and is therefore unreliable. Depending on just what is missing, Beatrice's statement might be completely true or completely false, or inbetween. For example, we can fill this statement in in two different ways:

Beatrice: "S."

Beatrice: "S,"

I

T Furthermore, "

• N
  • • What is a delusion based on? A T I P b
      • t
        • Where does it say that nothing could cause an illusion of Kinzo? Wasn't the red saying that people absolutely wouldn't mistake A, B, or C for Kinzo? E Y\\ I won't give you time to recover, I won't, I'll shatter your 'Contradictory Red Truth' theory with this blue wedge! T N Take that, fall, fall to the deepest depths of purgatory, where my goats will chew on you, chew your bones, and make a soup! You want a taste, tropeeeeer?! Tastes great, doesn't iiiit?! We can let you taste it with magic, ahahahaha-(Insert ahaha.wav here)\\ ...Er, sorry. It looks like I got a little carried away. Either way, I should tidy this up a bit. Alright. About people asking for evidence with the red, T A good analogy can be how real world trials can have evidence thrown out because it was gathered illegally. The part that makes it hard to think about is that the witch side and the human side are playing the same game, but the rules and moves allowed are different. When Battler tried to play a witch move, Lambdadelta basically said "Yeah, your knights don't move in an L shape. Tough luck." Virgilia said that the game was winnable, she never said it was fair.
          • S
            • Hold it! Can we really say that Battler was using the red as a detective method in the second game? Let's turn the chessboard around on the most important character in this. Ryukishi. What does Ryukishi have to gain from deceiving us and making Red Truth less valid in the fifth game?
              • R T Also,
                • R For evidence, see his recent statement on the Golden Truth and compare it to Lambda's description in EP1.
  • • Knox's 9th isn't a valid point; Knox's 5th is omitted entirely, and the two readings of Knox's 9th really mean the same thing. Even if not, it was already mentioned that people argued over how to interpret or write Knox's Decalogue in the TIPS. Them being different doesn't MEAN anything because there is no OBLIGATION to make it a perfect transcription.
      • K The reason I cited Knox's 9th is because it is the only rule defined in red that isn't even remotely close to what the original says. Compare, "It is permitted for observers to let their own conclusions and interpretations be heard." and "The stupid friend of the detective, the Watson, must not conceal any thoughts which pass through his mind; his intelligence must be slightly, but very slightly, below that of the average reader. This is a rule of perfection; it is not of the esse of the detective story to have a Watson at all. But if he does exist, he exists for the purpose of letting the reader have a sparring partner, as it were, against whom he can pit his brains. 'I may have been a fool,' he says to himself as he puts the book down, 'but at least I wasn't such a doddering fool as poor old Watson.'" The Umineko version allows for Unreliable Narrators, the real version requires the Watson to not hide his thoughts from the reader. T
      • Word of God says (on his blog) he would "never do such a cruel trap" such as intentionally misleading by breaking a tool such as "Red Truth can lie." It would go against the Fair Play of his game. Therefore,
        • Why should we care what Ryukishi07 says Also, even if he did write them h.. Not to mention, [ In other words, an argument that relies solely on the author's blog post will not work. It's possible that the rules regarding the Red Truth were changed (thereby explaining why the characters treat it differently), but that every Red Truth happened to be true anyways (hence Ryukishi07's claim), but that would be a violation Knox's 6th.

I

W A

Ryukishi07 is lying in the below statement concerning the Golden Truth.

In EP 5, we were told that Battler's use of the Golden Truth was proof that he understood the rules, including Beatrice.

Ryuukishi: That's right. The gold text is something that anyone can use if they understand the rules of the game, so ultimately, even 'pieces' in the game can use it. That's probably why Beatrice the elder could use it too. It's like a hidden finishing move in a fighting game that anyone can use if they know the right commands (laughs).

I'm sorry, but what. He goes to the trouble of saying in-script that it can only be used by the Game Master, and then turns around and says anyone who understands the rules (and Beato by extension) can use it.

• When the hell did he say that it was only usable by Gamemasters? The statement is intrinsically wrong since Battler uses it before he's crowned Gamemaster. Alternatively, anyone who understands the rules is a Gamemaster by definition.
  • (OP here.) Well, technically, it was Lambdadelta who said it, but he wrote it, no? This video. Pause at 06:11 exactly. I'll quote her line word-for-word here.

Lambdadelta: ..................Yes. ......Golden truth, effective. The gold truth.........can only be used by the territory lord of this world......no. ......only by the Game Master himself!!

• • It's also found on the entry for the Golden Truth on the Umineko Wiki, both of these are why I call bullshit on his statement.
    • So what's the problem, here? It's only used by the Gamemaster in any instance, and the only one who can be the Gamemaster is the one who understands the rules, and as we learn in the scene of Battler's ascension, using the Gold Truth makes one immediately qualified to be Gamemaster. I
      • (OP here.) That may be, and I'll promote that "semantics" statement to Blue Truth since I acknowledge the possibility of an error on my part, but here's the part I have a problem with. "even 'pieces' in the game can use it" How can the "pieces" use it if it exclusive to the Game Master? I'll acknowledge the possibility of a misinterpretation, or even a mistranslation, but this is a serious fuck-up on someone's part, be it Ryukishi07, or the translator, or someone in-between.
        • Given how much Ryukishi loves wordplay, i For example, "Theoretically, anyone who knows understands the rules can 'input the code' of performing the Gold Truth, but only the Gamemaster has the authority to do so." This is, of course, not even touching the fact that more than half the characters aren't even objectively real as we understand it.
          • (OP here.) T Again, I However, I will not deny the possibility that e
            • Thanks for the promotion, but one's opinion shouldn't be given in gold, especially when we're debating the rules for it in this very argument.
              • (OP here.) If not Gold, then Red. * laughs* I'll demote it to Red Truth. Like I said, you might be right, I, and I It's entirely possible that Ryukishi is trying to mess with us while confirming information. In fact, I'll even make that a Blue Truth. I
                • Well, duh.
                  • Even the words where Battler tells Maria to let him 'eat' her in ten years?
                    • (OP here.) ESPECIALLY those words.
          • There is no contradiction. What Lambda meant was probably was probably "The gold truth should only be used by the Game Master himself". That is it, only the Game Master should knows all the truth, therefore only him/her should be able to speak in gold. If one understand everything, it would be in the same position of the Game Master and, therefore, be able to speak it. Also, Battler was not the Game Master by the time the Gold Truth first appeared.
            • (OP here.) Nope. He was before then, as well. It is first confirmed that he has become the Game Master when Erika orders the Siestas to fire on Battler after he is revived as the Endless Sorcerer. They are unable to as Battler is now the Game Master, instead of being blocked by his Endless Nine resistance in EP5. The Golden Truth is just evidence that Battler really is the new Game Master. Also, I think from an RL perspective, Ryukishi is trying to Mind Screw us with his statement, and what the guy said earlier, that while anyone who understands the rules, and Beato by extension, can use the Golden Truth, only the Game Master has the authority to do so has more ground.
              • Didn't they say they need special permission to fire on the "Territory Lord". Being the Territory Lord isn't necessarily the same as being the Game Master.
                • (OP here.) I'll look some other time, but for now, we're both right.
• C
  • (OP here.) Two problems with that. (1)B (2)E
    • That's a contradiction. Bern wants to end the game, so giving her more truthful information about the gameboard can only cause it to end faster. Also, L
      • (OP here.) K Provide evidence for your Blue Truth, if you wish for it to be acknowledged!

Golden Truth is 'Promise Truth'

We have very few statements of Golden Truth. EP 5's "I guarentee this corpse is Kinzo's!" and one about a flower pedal stating "This pedal was made with magic. It was a very good magic", or something along those lines(As EP 6 is untranslated and OP doesn't remember the exact phrasing".

I. It's like saying "I have Red, and I have evidence that exists in the human world to back it up."

• So let me get, this straight, Red + Solid irrefutable proof = Gold? Sweet heavens, it's so crazy, it just might be canon!
  • So what was Battler's irrefutable proof of Kinzo's death prior to every game?
    • (Respondent here.) I would say the scene in EP5 where Natsuhi, Krauss, Nanjo, and (possibly, not certain) Kumasawa are in Kinzo's study and the old fart has just passed away. The one where Natsuhi convinces the others to pretend that Kinzo is still alive.
      • ...Um, so? Not only is that a flashback provided by supernatural means, but there's no empirical evidence left behind that Battler can use, such as a diary or anything.
        • (Respondent here.) A Battler can ask for the date of Kinzo's alleged death and compare Natsuhi's entry against that of a more "sane" person (say, Nanjo's records) and voila, confirmation. T ( It has been stated that Gold needs a check for absolute validity. Furthermore, anything said in Gold can be said in Red, but not always vice versa. Finally, K, therefore, B ( u Counter that, if you can! You can't, can you? This! Is! CHECKMAAAAAAAAAAAATE!!!
          • K Where was it stated that Gold needs a check for absolute validity and/or that all Gold statements can be said in red, but not (always) vice versa?
            • (Respondent here.) Mmm. Well played. It's stated on this wiki's Main Page for Umineko, which, upon consideration, stirs a question of my own. Where the hell did they get it from? Anyone up for some snooping? In the meantime, I demoted the statements in question until they have some support from the series itself. V

G

I

Golden truth is witness testimony.

• T B
• B T
• B T
• A
• I
• R
• B

Witness testimony is considered true until proven to be unreliable, so the burden of disproving it is on the detective, like a reverse blue truth. In the total absence of evidence, it becomes true automatically, which is why Battler's proof of Kinzo's death was successful. However, if any contrary evidence is presented, the gold becomes ineffective.

This also makes gold the primary means of attack for the witch side, because it can be used to present a claim that some mystery was accomplished using magic. The detective is then obligated to disprove it by raising objections in blue, which the witch can deny with red. The detective wins if all of the witch's golden truths collapse.

G

In Logic an argument is valid if and only if the conclusion follows from premises, whether those premises are true or not. A Sound argument is a valid argument where all premises are true. Golden Truth is the conclusion to a valid (but not necessarily sound) Logical argument. Red Truth a True premise or statement, and Blue "Truth" is a premise or statement of an unknown truth value. If another color text is introduced it will be Sound Argument truth. As for what premises Battler used to construct his argument in episode 5... if I knew that I would have written this theory's title in gold.

The Golden Truth is really Beatrice's Heart

The Golden Truth is in fact not technically as strong as the Red Truth, but it's a piece of evidence used as a rule or a premise within the game which is not to be broken... thusly it can be used as a Red Truth, as the point of the game is to disprove something that could be stated in Gold. If any Golden statement is disproven then the witch side loses instantly, as the rules have effectively been shattered with a warhammer.

• So what does Kinzo's corpse have to do with Beatrice's Heart?
  • Unless Beatrice is some sort of Frankensteinian Zombie, nothing physical. Kinzo's Corpse is part of the 'rules'. A better way to put it is 'The Golden Truth is this story's Anthropic Principle. Denying that it's Kinzo's Corpse if it's stated to be Kinzo's Corpse in gold is effectively the same as playing a game of chess and putting the king in your pocket to protect it when it's in a position of checkmate.
• So basically, This, in a way, combines the idea of "Beatrice's heart" (as Beatrice is the embodiment of the rules), premise truth (as the rules are based off the premise), AND explains Ryukishi's statement that "even pieces can use the Golden Truth." After all, if you're in an RP and a player starts godmodding, you can accuse them of breaking the rule ", even if you're not the GM.

The reason the creators introduced colored text?

They wanted pages like this to look pretty, and so the fandom overthinks the colors and confuses itself. So, in other words, they're secretly in league with Tite Kubo

S B T Note howver, that an Unknown Person X committing the crimes is still impossible due to Knox's 1st and 8th.

• This theory is largely unneccesary. It's already been demonstrated that magical characters don't count as humans. And in most cases, 'human' and 'person' are derived from the same Japanese word in the translation, so trying to make a semantics argument that they're different doesn't work.
  • • In the magical perspective, Kanon and Shannon are also counted as human because of their love with George and Jessica. It's very likely Genji was gay for Kinzo, but that aside, , so questioning their existence or trying to shed doubt on them is completely futile, unlike the magical characters, who musn't be referenced one way or another to make the game far.
      • sorcerer G Therefore,
        • • • Just like Maria, yea. But Beatrice, by her own definitions, is not a Person, just a Witch. For what it may be worth, in Beatrice's narrative, she is a Great Witch, which Maria and Rosa are not.
  • The precise japanese phrases used in this example are '人間' (by Erika, WH translation 'humans'; wiktionary) and '人' (by Be/Ba, WH translation 'people'; wiktionary). In particular, the translation of '人間' as 'humans' is dubious since the term can apparently also be translated as 'character' or 'personality'. The possible implications of this should be obvious.

Given the rule that the Red Truth can't confirm or deny supernatural elements. How else would saying statements like " and " be possible? Also, since the Red Truth is itself a supernatural element statements like R don't contradict this theory.

• Regardless of the method, if the culprit "Beatrice" is creating closed rooms, she's doing so with her own power, magical or otherwise. The second statement is never stated in Red, so it's completely invalid. So this theory has nothing to stand on.
  • You're not trying to calim that scene was falsified are you? If you would claim that scene was falsified you must present evidence to support that claim!
  • • Not really, as it's stated in EP 6 that you can't do anything with magic that can't be done by mortal means. "Any" doesn't state it can create impossible closed rooms, only that it can create any closed room Battler will encounter.
      • That is simply one character's belief, and was never stated in red.
      • Therefore, T
        • Technically, no. Dlanor has the ability to seal the use of Red for an entirely different reason that has nothing to do with Knox's Decalogue. She can basically just seal it without needing a reason as part of her execution rights.
          • K Where is it ever indicated that she is someone who would do such it thing?
            • It's in the TIPS, if you bothered to read them. Also, when she sealed Gaap's blue without giving any reason, even though it was perfectly valid. And there's really no legitimate reason to believe that Knox's rules even apply, so Dlanor's just running on an assumption and acting on that basis either way.
              • Fine, I concede that Dlanor sealing the red doesn't prove it's supernatural. However,K N
                • T
                  • Either way, t
                    • No, that Red's not on the Gameboard, strictly speaking. And whether or not the Red can confirm homunculi is irrelevant. You're overlooking the fact that the Red is barred from commenting on the supernatural in order to make the game fair and playable, not due to metaphysical possibility.
• Nevertheless, m
  • Er, yes it has. When Erika was arguing with Maria, she wasn't playing Beato's logic game, she was just bullying a little girl. And Erika's a fucking bitch who doesn't respect the spirit of games anyway. The Red Truth has no metaphysical barring against commenting on the supernatural. It's just that in the context of the Meta-World games, it can't be used in such a manner to make the game fair and reason-based.
    • A T
      • Yea, pretty much. It can still be used to confirm and deny supernatural elements, like when Bernkastel decided to destroy the illusion of Natsuhi having tea with Beato, but it's technically against the 'rules of the game.' It's like moving a pawn three spaces; you COULD do it, but you shouldn't.

We're all overthinking the Red Truth

Yes, there are some lines that are questionable and we need to look out for Jedi Truths, and there are a lot of messes which make human murders seem impossible, like the web of red in EP 3, but the important thing is that the red can't tell a lie. I.

When Ryucakes reveals that the Red Truth was about 20 times simpler than we're all imagining, then that Untwist will have Mind Screwed us not just on the 'Shit that happens in the story' level, but in on a Meta-level so heavy that it would be like Arthur Conan Doyle having written a cookbook with an Excuse Plot, him having told us it's a cookbook with an Excuse Plot, and us having read so far into the death of one supporting character that we didn't realize it was a cookbook until we realized we knew how to make a tasty quiche after reading.

• We cannot say whether there will be a twist or an untwist regarding this matter. If we, let's say, expect a twist regarding the nature of the red truth, and get an untwist, then that's a meta-twist by itself. However, if we expect an (un)twist, and get exactly that, then that's some sort of a meta-untwist. We can take this to the n-th degree, and end up completely confused. In the end however, this whole is binary - we will get either an n-th degree twist (1), or an n-th degree untwist (0) in the very end. I will now introduce the 'Schrödinger truth': it lets us analyze the circumstances and draw a conclusion regarding the probability of there being a twist behind the red truth:

• (Keep in mind that the 'Schrodinger truth' is not really a truth, but rather a tool which may or may not help us judge how something might develop in the near future.)
• (OP Here) However, an aspect of the WMG isn't that not every absense of a twist is an untwist. What we're dealing with as for the nature of the red is four possibilities, not two:
  • A Twist - There are some bizarre rules to the Red/Gold which are revealed near the end which blow open a hole in the case.

• • Absense of a Twist - The rules of Red/Gold are laid out in enough detail that they make perfect sense before the end.

• • Type-1 Untwist(True Untwist) - Red/Gold is simple but implied to be complex... but isn't.

• • Type-2 Untwist(Self-Inflicted Mind-Screw) - What this WMG postulates. Red is exactly what Beatrice said it is completely straightforwardly, gold is not all that much more complex, and we're just working ourselves up to the point where we're doing Ryukishi's Mind Screw work for him.

We need to adopt the Schroedinger's truth from the above WMG for our arguments.

• Seriously, it's awesome. Although it needs a simpler color to write and use. I propose P. Schrodinger's cat is neither alive nor dead, and the Schroedinger's truth, an analytical truth rather than an absolute truth or a theory, also exists between them. Purple is a fusion of red and blue, and is a worthy color for the Schrodinger's truth.
  • Isn't Schroedinger's Truth effectively the same as Blue Truth? They serve the exact same function and properties.
  • S I propose that we use Schrodinger's Truth like this:

T(( a((((( In other words, purple is used to indicate parts of a statement that can be spoken in red, and grey indicates the parts that are still uncertain. Numbering is used to indicate logical connections between possibilities, as in "If item W is true, items X, Y, and Z are true, and vice versa. Items W, X, Y, and Z will therefore all be numbered 1."

• • • Not quite. In fact, t as Blue's nature is not to postulate the rules or evidence, but to provide a theory which behaves as a solution to a given problem. Schrodinger's truth is not a truth of providing a theory, but to analyze the validity of a theory.
      • All Blue Truth is is to posit something that may or may not be true. This Schroedringer's Truth is not only needlessly complex, but it's purpose has already been canonically filled by other instances of the Blue.
        • Blue is used to declare hypotheses, Schroedringer's Truth is used to declare that if X is true then Y must also be true. For example, " B, t " means that if Battler killed the victims then Battler is the culprit. It's actually closer to red then blue.
          • Then it could be called the T A, as the possibilities include at least one Red Truth and at least one Blue Truth. T
          • Again, Blue Truth already works this way. Infact, this is the exact format Beatrice and Ange used it in during the scene wherein they debated Battler's parentage.
            • (6th respondent here.) B Furthermore, to recite what the original creator of Schroedinger's Truth said of it, "K" S
            • T

D

P

UPDATE: (6th respondent here.) Due to the introduction of the Purple Declaration in EP5, it is called for that this be re-colored. I propose O for Confirmed Red and B for Unconfirmed Segments.

One Truth, Two Truth...

, .

Gold truth creates gameboards.

Ryukishi says anyone can use the gold, even pieces, but Lambda says only a game master can use it. This way, neither of them is lying. The act of using gold makes a new board with its own truth, and the speaker defines that truth, so that person is by definition a game master.

Battler was able to use this as an underhanded proof method in EP3. Since Kinzo's corpse couldn't be identified on the main gameboard, he first created a new sub-board where identification was possible (or maybe had his piece create it by lying). Then since red truths can apply to individual games, he was able to use the premise he'd defined as a basis to establish Kinzo's death in red on his own board, rather than Lambda's.

The various colors of text were based on the countries the make up Oz

Putting aside white we have Green, Red, Blue, Gold, and Purple text. Oz consists of the Emerald City (green), which is surrounded by the countries of the Quadlings (red), the Munchkins (blue), the Winkies (yellow, which is obviously just a mundane way of saying gold), and the Gilkins (purple). In fact, once we factor in the fact that people are required to wear green tinted glasses in the Emerald City it could very well correspond to white as well.

The gold truth is the golden key

• A. In order for the red truth to be used to support a human-side theory, it must be backed up by evidence.
• B. There is a "golden key," a mystery at the center of umineko that once discovered unlocks all of the other mysteries.

Thus, the purpose of the golden truth is clear. If someone was to create a human-side theory, and use evidence related to the key, it would reveal the secret to everyone. Thus, the golden truth is the right of those who know the truth to waive the need to actually state the evidence to ones opponent. So to give an example.

• • Battler:
  • Dllanor: Can you back it up with human side evidence?
  • Battler:
  • Dllanor: What's Y?
  • Battler: Telling you would ruin the mystery and defeat the witch side, that's why its a golden truth.

The Golden Truth is the use of Braun Tube in colour

• Okay, i haven't read through Chiru perfectly but to me the use of the golden truth seems pretty easy to understand when you think about it (at least it's use in episode 5). The game says it is stronger than red in some cases and weaker in some. Isn't that rather similar to the Braun Tube that they talk about. For example at the end of Episode 5 where Battler says that Kinzo is dead in gold, if you use the Braun Tube argument here then it means that it works as a blue truth that only can be countered by opening up the tube and if the golden truth is correct then it is stronger than Red while if it is wrong it is weaker.
  • The way that you use it here makes it...identical to Blue Truth. Because Blue Truth is already the Braun Tube metaphor.

The Superior/Inferior nature of the Golden Truth

Let's start from a Red Truth:

From this truth, it is possible to draw this Golden Truth.

The Red Truth above is the foundation for the Golden Truth. Kinzo has been guaranteed dead, and other red truths throughout the games make clear that the corpse is found during the games, hence the corpse must be in the island, being possible to find and present it. Which can mean that the corpse is availabe to be presented, making possible to state the Golden Truth.

A case of an inferior Golden Truth is the one that states that Beato used 'magic' with the overturned cup.

Magic CAN be denied because the game was made with riddles that can be solved. Beato used the same magic that has been used before, and it was declared as a 'splendid display' because it was done perfectly. Remember that Beatrice said that simply saying magic exist in red would not make a game. Seeing this way, that Golden Truth is inferior because a blue truth revealing the 'trick' would defeat that particualr Golden Truth, but following the rules of the game it is still not a lie.

I believe the Golden Truth is like a Red Truth, which is true as is 'to the letter'

For example, from this Red Truth:

We could have this Golden Truth