Villain Has a Point

Everything About Fiction You Never Wanted to Know.

Time and time again a story is told with the classic hero vs. villain setup with the villain committing acts deemed evil by good, neutral, and the normally apathetic. The villain usually commits said acts for their own personal reasons. But wait, they have a justified reason for their actions? They may not be so much evil as they are anti. He may end up sending the hero into a depression after his motives come to light? Here my friends is a villain who actually has a justified reason for being what he is. Due to the nature of their villainy if they become too excessive in their methods it may fall under Straw Man Has a Point and they can easily fall under as a Well-Intentioned Extremist. In-universe they can also easily fall under Designated Villain. Compare Anti-Villain.

Examples of Villain Has a Point include:

Anime and Manga

  • Yu-Gi-Oh Ze Xal has this with Kaito Tenjo. He believes the Numbers' cards are evil and from what has been seen the Numbers can easily make the good bad, (Ukyo, Fuya to a lesser extent) and the bad worse, (Jin, Rikuo, Kaio). Also, his claim that the Numbers want to destroy the world seems plausible seeing the evil from Black Mist who was able to capture Astral and control Yuma's body against his will. In fact, the only issue with him capturing Numbers is that he takes the soul of the person who possessed it.
  • Stain, from My Hero Academia, a violent vigilante who hunts down and murders super-heroes. Much like Marshal Law, he feels the term “hero” has lost its meaning, and most heroes have become little more than greedy, selfish Attention Whores and worse, those who are Only In It For The Money and take from society far less than they contribute to it; the only person he considers a true hero is All-Might himself. Stain knows his methods are wrong, but considers himself a Necessary Evil. Thing is, he's not exactly wrong in his views. Many pro-heroes in this series are indeed selfish narcissists caring little for anything but their own glory, folks like Endeavor being good examples.

Fan Works

Eris: These wicked humans charge a fortune for permission to travel on a cramped, disgusting tube that shoots through the sky! They fondle you to search for weapons, which somehow includes soap, then send you into this “plane” where you are crammed in like grapes waiting to be juiced. Then they spend roughly an hour on the “tarmac” just sitting there before finally beginning the journey, whereupon you are treated to hours of recycled air while left to near starvation, given only tiny snacks on rare occasions. Entertainment is provided, but it is of low quality and costs extra.
When the flight is finally over, after a long descent during which your eardrums nearly explode, you are then forced to wait again on the "tarmac" before disembarking, and I am told, must wait even longer to retrieve your possessions, which may have been placed aboard the wrong vessel.
"Hundreds of thousands of humans, if not more, inflict this horror upon themselves every day, for there are no other high-speed methods of travel. And I have heard that the employees are treated no better than clients. Truly, humans should be utterly ashamed at this, and yet they simply aren't! They have just accepted this as unacceptable reality.

  • To make this worse, Themis offers the heroes a chance to offer a counter-argument, but they cannot. While Eris is actually speaking from personal experience (having complained about it in an earlier chapter) anyone reader who has flown economy class can not help but see where she is coming from here.

Film

  • General Hummel from The Rock. Even the protagonist of this movie can't comprehend, at first, why a war hero as decorated and respected as Hummel would steal a stockpile of deadly VX gas-armed M55 rockets and try to extort money from the government by threatening to use them on San Francisco like some common terrorist. He gets his answer later: Hummel wanted the ransom to be paid from a military slush fund, and intended to use it to pay the families of soldiers who died under his command, families who had not been properly compensated to begin with. And then you discover Hummel was bluffing and never intended to make good the threat. Can this guy even be considered a "villain"?

Live Action TV

  • In Power Rangers SPD, Sky and Jay constantly argue with each other and have a lot of trouble cooperating, so much that in the episode "Walls", Ringbah (the Monster of the Week) points out how unprofessional they're being.
  • The demons plaguing Mariner Bay in Power Rangers Lightspeed Rescue are pretty evil, but let's put this from their perspective. They just woke up from a 5,000 year old slumber, and find that humans have built a city over their home. In a small way, you can't help but feel their anger is slightly justified.
  • In the Buffy the Vampire Slayer episode “Pangs”, Buffy's desire to have a pleasant Thanksgiving dinner with the other Scoobies is compromised when the discovery of an a Native American burial ground spawns a spirit of vengeance, who is dead set on revenge against the white man for genocidal actions against his tribe centuries ago. While Giles claims this is a clear-cut case of a monster preying on civilians (when this is brought up, there have been two such murders already) Buffy and Willow can't help but feel sorry for the spirit, believing his actions might be partially justified, and that reasoning with him and possibly apologizing might be a better option. In the midst of the argument, Spike (who came to Giles house begging for help and is now being held prisoner) interrupts, calling them a bunch of fools. He states that first of all, this creature is a spirit of vengeance who cannot be reasoned with, as revenge is its only purpose. He also points out that genocide committed by conquerors is hardly unique to America, and has been done countless times in human history. "Caesar did the same thing, you never heard him saying ‘I came, I saw, I conquered, and I feel really bad about it'." While this is very much a Family-Unfriendly Aesop, you can't deny he has a point there, and in the end he's right, violence is the only thing the spirit understands, and he has to be dealt with that way.

Literature

  • In Isaac Asimov's story "The Dead Past", the government agents trying to prevent the protagonists from learning the secret of viewing the past seem like a classic heavy-handed Government Conspiracy... until it turns out that they're simply trying to prevent privacy from being utterly destroyed by the dissemination of devices that can view any place at any past time from a century ago to a microsecond ago.

Video Games

  • Dr. M from Sly 3 may be a terrible person to work with, a lab nut, and an overall Ineffectual Sympathetic Villain but he did buy the island legally so everything is technically his and he could've claimed his right to kill Sly seeing that Sly invaded his land.
  • Commander Tartar, Big Bad and Final Boss of Splatoon 2's Octo Expansion campaign is a batshit insane Omnicidal Maniac who wants to eradicate both Inkling and Octolings to replace them with a more "pure" sapient life form worthy of receiving ancient human knowledge. Which is true on one point: Inklings and Octolings waging war over minor differences and fashion choices is beyond insane. At least this didn't fall into deaf ears as both species seem to reconcile at the end.
  • Used as an off-joke in Injustice 2 during pre-fight dialogue between Aquaman and Poison Ivy. When he questions why she talks to plants, she asks why that is different than talking to fish.
  • Mr. Morlock from Octopath Traveler is an unapologetically greedy asshole who underpays his men for the gold they find and steals Tressa and Ali's sky stones to boot... but as Quarrycrest's landlord he is legally entitled to anything dug up in the town's mines, ditto for cracking down on unauthorized mercantile dealings. However, it's made clear that while he may be legally correct, he sure isn't morally correct, and once he has Ali beaten and kidnapped while planning to sell him into slavery, he firmly steps into "unambiguously evil" territory.
    • He is, however, right on the mark when he calls Ali's dad a swindler and a huckster. While Ali defends his dad's shady dealings as him giving people exactly what they want, he was still buttering them up and manipulating them into buying things that they didn't need for the sake of making himself richer. Ultimately, as angry as Ali gets over Morlock's insults, he never actually refutes them either.

Web Original

  • In the Maple Story-inspired video seen here, Hilla (the only character of the three that can be called a villain) clearly knows far more about the subject matter than the other two, despite Mayor Slimm being an actual elected official. Pragmatic Villainy, of course, as she claims she's simply studying a nation she plans to conquer.

Western Animation

  • In The Jungle Book, Shere Khan's distrust and dislike of Mogli hinges on Fantastic Racism at times, until you realize he's a Bengal tiger, an species that has nearly been hunted to extinction by humans. One might even see Khan as the Only Sane Beast among the cast, realizing that trusting a human is playing with fire.
  • Justice League Unlimited: Project Cadmus created several threats to the world, but they do have considerable ground to stand on for their actions: the League didn't tell anyone about their big Kill Sat, they themselves have made questionable decisions in the past, and the Justice Lords were able to take over their world with only six of the founding members.
  • One from Batman: Under the Red Hood. Under the Red Hood gives us one from the titular character himself. No matter how many times Joker may get slammed into Arkham, being the Cardboard Prison it is, he always returns at some point wreak more havoc. While Batman does think about killing Joker, he fears about never coming back. However among Batman's rogues gallery, Joker DOES have a higher kill count alone than most and will most likely never stop killing as long as he is able, so putting him behind bars or a padded room does no good. Yet because he's Batman he won't take that step. Some people find it easy to side with Red Hood here even though he is a bit demented.
  • The Equalists in The Legend of Korra claims that benders are forcing non-benders to live as second class citizens. Although it is not entirely true but they do show that there are bending gangs who abuse their powers to intimidate non-bending people and the city's council is solely consist of benders.
    • They get quite a bit of ammunition in the eighth episode when the City Council starts to oppress non-benders, arresting them simply out of suspicion or ANY association with members of the Equalists (this includes being a family member as Asami found out). And it gets worse after we think a little bit. Later on in that episode we see what appears to be a whole neighborhood of non-benders.
    • Of course, the primary occupation of benders seems to be 'low-class factory worker', while the richest man in the city (if not the kingdom) is a non-bender, so, its hardly one sided.
  • In the original ThunderCats, Mumm-Ra is both a Card-Carrying Villain and seemingly a Generic Doomsday Villain, who seems to be evil for evil's sake and have no goal other than ruling Third Earth unopposed. That is, until some of Third Earth's history is revealed. First of all, this world is Earth All Along, its name being "Third Age of Earth". Humans are either extinct or have left in some mass-migration (possibly settling wherever Mandora the Evil-Chaser is from, as she seems pretty human) with Third Earth itself populated mostly by alien settlers. Now, Mumm-Ra is not just a mummy, he's obviously an Ancient Egyptian mummy; his fortress is a pyramid, he serves four "Ancient Spirits of Evil" that resemble Egyptian gods, and many other characters associated with him have Egyptian themes. The obvious conclusion is, Mumm-Ra Was Once Human, and his grudge against the heroes started because, in his eyes, they're trespassers on his rightful property, not an unjustified outlook.
  • Harley Quinn:
    • In one episode, the Joker mocks Harley by claiming she has a "third-rate dye job". While Harley takes offense at this, Poison Ivy can confirm this is true, as Harley buys the cheap stuff from the drug store.
    • A less frivolous example, Harley herself tells Batman off, claiming he's being a selfish jerk by neglecting Gordon (and he is, most fans would attest), who is a Nervous Wreck and almost on the verge of suicide. Of course, this also makes Harley realize she's acting the same way towards Clayface.
    • Killer Shark calls Bruce out in season 3 about his obsession over the deaths of his parents, and the crazy part is, Bruce acknowledges that Shark has a point.
  • The episode of Extreme Ghostbusters "The Luck of the Irish"; the evil leprechaun is, as Egon states, "not a rational creature", going after the descendants of his jailers, who are mostly innocents with no idea who he is or what he wants. However, when he tells his last target - the Mayor - that "if any'a man deserved his cruel fate, tis yourself" you kind of have to agree with him there. The Mayor is a pompous snob who gives the heroes nothing but trouble during the entire series, and this is neither the first nor last time they have to save his ungrateful behind.
  • In Billy and Mandy’s Big Boogey Adventure, Grim is put on trial for abusing his powers, with Boogey himself as an Amoral Attorney prosecutor. Boogey’s evidence? For starters, at different times in the past, Grim has let his scythe (an “ancient and epic tool filled with terrible magic beyond mortal comprehension") fall into the hands of Jack o Lantern, Billy, Mandy, Irwin, both of Billy’s parents, Billy’s cousin, Billy’s cat, Dracula, General Skarr, Principal Goodvibes, Mrs. Claus, the Secret Snake Club, the army, Scout Troupe 701, the Sleazetechs, Abraham Lincoln, the mailman, the Dingleschmitt Sisters, Boogey himself, a llama, and a turkey sandwich ("hold the mayo"), and all of them used it for evil and/or selfish purposes. When you put that all together Boogey (despite being motivated entirely by revenge and greed) is right, such carelessness makes Grim pretty lousy at his job. He also points out that if not for the magic contract that compels Grim to be friends with Billy and Mandy, they’d never be friends in the first place, are just using him, and they’d ditch him in a minute if he had no supernatural powers. Even Mandy can't deny that. Although, to her credit, she would be friends with Grim long before being friends with Boogey, given her response later to his We Can Rule Together offer.